Should undocumented (illegal) immigrants have drivers license privilege?

[Zacha341]

Governor Whitmer supports allowing undocumented (illegal) immigrants drivers license privileges.

Making this a Michigan state-wide option could pose problems (withstanding and beyond Trump).

For example, how many laws would an undocumented immigrant have to break or ignore to present to the Secretary of the State to acquire a drivers license (last I checked you need very specific documents)?

What will the adaptations be to allow the illegals licensing process (documentation) not available for US citizens?

And how does this advance Detroiters? How would auto insurance be impacted? How would liability be addressed in the case of accidents.

[JBMcB]

How on earth would this work with the Real ID requirements?

In a broader legal sense, if it is OK for an undocumented worker to use a fake social security number to get an ID, why is it not OK for anyone else to do so (under Real ID I think it may be a felony.)

[Zacha341]

Yes. And must you be a Trumpster to see the obvious conflict of such policy?

[EastsideAl]

The problem is that you then have thousands of people on the roads (as we do now) with no license, and no legal presence should they get into an accident. You also have thousands of families with no legal form of identification (often even for their citizen family who are minors) and thus great difficulty or impossibility to access a wide range of often necessary services (including law enforcement). This could have grave wider-scale implications on public health and safety.

You can talk all you want about federal immigration or border policies, or shout about "send 'em back" or about meaningful and useful immigration reform all you want, but for the foreseeable future this situation isn't going to change and none of that involves state government. It's the state government's responsibility to govern for the public health and safety in the situation that they have on their hands right now.

[Zacha341]

I don't use tropes like 'send 'em back' as they mostly invoke TRUMP et al; everyone circles-their-wagons and we're left with laws and changes, etc. that will go on beyond this POTUS!

In the interest of 'priorities' we first need to strive to help more Detroiter's acquire appropriate State ID to vote, and Drivers License to drive.

This is an existing problem that also needs to be addressed.

[Trumpeteer]

So you want someone who is here illegally to be able to vote as well?

[JBMcB]

This could have grave wider-scale implications on public health and safety.

Entirely true. However you could make the exact same argument if you are going to loosen the rules on obtaining federally recognized ID. Some of the restrictions put into Real ID are there to prevent identity fraud, for instance.

[Richard]

Otherwise they would be spending the same resources helping US citizens to obtain ID so they can exercise thier rights as citizens to vote.

But clearly that already wrote those US citizens off and are looking for replacements.

[Zacha341]

^^^ You just 'made that up' HAH! What? You don't like the lack of priorities?

[Gistok]

So you want someone who is here illegally to be able to vote as well?

Slippery Slope logic fallacy....

[Jimaz]

How on earth would this work with the Real ID requirements?...

My understanding is that we're still able to have and use a driver's license that is not Real-ID compliant.

Without the Real-ID part, you just can't board even a domestic flight despite being a citizen. There are other restrictions too, like entering certain federal facilities, etc.

This was all in (over)reaction to 911.

[Zacha341]

Yep! It's all getting so incoherent, with very little long or even medium term thinking applied.

Entirely true. However you could make the exact same argument if you are going to loosen the rules on obtaining federally recognized ID. Some of the restrictions put into Real ID are there to prevent identity fraud, for instance.

[Zacha341]

In point of fact presenting with an DL and address does allow voting registration and voting does it not?

This action will probably slip towards that direction......

Slippery Slope logic fallacy....

[JBMcB]

My understanding is that we're still able to have and use a driver's license that is not Real-ID compliant.

Without the Real-ID part, you just can't board even a domestic flight despite being a citizen. There are other restrictions too, like entering certain federal facilities, etc.

The built-in passport to Canada wouldn't work either. You also couldn't board Amtrak trains. I agree it's an overreaction to 9/11, but it's the current law.

So would it be worth it? Essentially shut out everyone in Michigan from using most modes of mass transit?

[Zacha341]

Now hasn't that been just a 'tad' part of the agenda? ------

So you want someone who is here illegally to be able to vote as well?

[Honky Tonk]

Yay Whitmer! Could Snyder do that?

[softailrider]

Can’t even really see how this could be an issue. How on earth can you provide an undocumented and illegal a drivers license? I don’t care if he / she drive as good as AJ Foyt. You just can’t do that.

[Zacha341]

To have drawn attention away from the debacle of Flint he may have!

Yay Whitmer! Could Snyder do that?

[Zacha341]

Indeed a house-of-cards would have to be presented by the undocumented person, and what stack of laws and procedures would need to be applied to ignore and go around that!

I can just see the added mayhem at the SoS office already!

Like they need anything further to think about or address in a given day!!

Can’t even really see how this could be an issue. How on earth can you provide an undocumented and illegal a drivers license? I don’t care if he / she drive as good as AJ Foyt. You just can’t do that.

[Honky Tonk]

To have drawn attention away from the debacle of Flint he may have!

I think you meant Darnell Earley.

[Honky Tonk]

Indeed a house-of-cards would have to be presented by the undocumented person, and what stack of laws and procedures would need to be applied to ignore and go around that!

I can just see the added mayhem at the SoS office already!

Like they need anything further to think about or address in a given day!!

We need to pay more taxes to open up more SOS offices.

[Zacha341]

^^^ Looks like we'll need 'em!

[Zacha341]

Oh yeah before he made a stop on over to become EM at DPS!!

I think you meant Darnell Earley.

[Zacha341]

I was asked to show my ID the last time I boarded a Grayhound Bus!! I had ID of course, so not sure if they would have pushed it, but I was a bit surprised?

I know proper ID is require to board a commercial aircraft.

(Please don't ask why I was on the Greyhound...... Let just say the distance too short to fly, car was down, Amtrak too $$)

The built-in passport to Canada wouldn't work either. You also couldn't board Amtrak trains. I agree it's an overreaction to 9/11, but it's the current law.

So would it be worth it? Essentially shut out everyone in Michigan from using most modes of mass transit?

[Richard]

^ do you feel that you are going to be stigmatized because you took the bus?

As much as I like to drive,it was more enjoyable to take Amtrak or the bus because you actually get to see what you were missing while concentrating on driving.

The bus kinda killed it when they eliminated all the small town stops though,Amtrak is still makes it cool to stop in some tiny town at a terminal that looks like it is stuck in the 1930s.