The dark side of cotton

[Richard]

I was thinking of doing a garment factory based on useing US grown cotton from raw product to finished garments.

Then I found this.

Monsanto controls 99% of all cotton grown in the WORLD.

India used to grow over 1000 different varieties of cotton,naturally grown,they even had drought and flood resistant seeds devoloped naturally.

They even developed naturally cotton grown in colors so there was no need for dyes.

So what happend is Monsanto claimed and won that they own exclusive rights on cotton seeds,so then what happens is the farmers receive seeds on credit from Monsanto,who then controls the market,when harvest time comes the price of cotton drops so the farmers cannot pay the tab,so Monsanto takes thier property in exchange.

The other ones are charged a percentage of thier crops as royalties to Monsanto even if they do not use Monsanto provided seeds.

350,000 farmers have committed suicide by drinking the toxins that are used as pest control,which also kills the bees and monarch butterflies that are needed in the process of natural grown cotton.

So basically they devolved a seed that requires a pesticide to grow but in turn the pesticides kill off the naturally grown products leaving Monsanto’s version the only alternative.

So the only thing one is left with is toxic cotton as raw materials.

No wonder there are so many different types of cancer,everything we touch,wear and eat is controlled by toxic based products.

[Honky Tonk]

I've been reading about Monsanto's modus operandi since the mid 80's, but was unaware of their involvement in the cotton industry. I have read about their iron clad contracts, and their taking over people's farms because some of their seeds were found growing non-Monsanto contact farms, and the mass killings of birds and bees blamed on their pesticides. It probably would help if you could add a few links to your post so everyone is on the same page. [[so to speak)

[jcole]

I was thinking of doing a garment factory based on useing US grown cotton from raw product to finished garments.

Then I found this.

Do you have a link for this story? All I can find is that Monsanto's GE cotton seeds are a huge disappointment in India because they don't give the yield that was promised and that cotton is literally doused in insecticides; India has been having low crop yield causing them to lose money as well as a bumper year a few years ago that caused a glut.
Also Monsanto has been known to sue farmers for saving seeds that they got from Monsanto because it's a patent violation.

[Zacha341]

I found these interesting articles on Monsanto and GM Cotton in Burkina Faso, Africa [[a large manufacturer of cotton)... and other related info:

How Monsanto’s GM cotton sowed trouble in Africa

The Seeds Of Suicide: How Monsanto Destroys Farming

Monsanto May Leave India After Losing GMO Cotton Patent

[jiminnm]

In 2018, Bayer acquired Monsanto [[and the RoundUp litigation that came with it). Bayer also owns more companies and brands than I can name:
https://www.bayer.com/en/products-from-a-to-z.aspx

[jcole]

I didn't know Bayer bought Monsanto, but I remember being shocked to see all of their garden products on the shelves a number of years ago and their sign on University drive in Pontiac. I always just thought "aspirin" when I thought Bayer.

In 2018, Bayer acquired Monsanto [[and the RoundUp litigation that came with it). Bayer also owns more companies and brands than I can name:
https://www.bayer.com/en/products-from-a-to-z.aspx

[Honky Tonk]

I didn't know Bayer bought Monsanto, but I remember being shocked to see all of their garden products on the shelves a number of years ago and their sign on University drive in Pontiac. I always just thought "aspirin" when I thought Bayer.

Did the labels say "Bayer Works Wonders"?

[Richard]

In the 1980s, Cutter Biological sold millions of dollars of HIV-tainted blood-clotting medicines to hemophiliacs. Cutter Biological is a division of Bayer.
Internal documents alleged the company made its medicine Factor VIII from the blood of prisoners, intravenous drug users and high-risk gay men.
The medicine infected thousands in the U.S. and abroad with HIV and hepatitis C. Many died.

https://www.drugwatch.com/manufacturers/bayer/

There are about 5 corporations that now control the pharmaceutical and food supply with Bayer at the top even pulling DuPonts strings.

They also did not play nice during WW2 supplying Hitler with the gas for the concentration camps and the development of chemical weapons.

Now they can figure out how to add drugs to the food supply.

A lot of the foods we eat generate their own seeds for replanting,cotton,tomato’s etc.
they tried passing laws to forbid the use of those seeds.

Say we want to eat healthy and buy fresh produce how do we know it was actually grown with non modified seeds because modified seeds contain chemicals that are passed on to the end product.

[Zacha341]

Great! Might as well go back to wearing the sweaty synthetics, where you get the truth in content!!

[JBMcB]

Pretty much everything you hear about Monsanto is a lie, or a massive exaggeration. Some of it is zealotry. Some of it is astroturfing by it's competitors. Some is just plain nonsense.



Here's a pretty good synopsis by Dr. Steven Novella, whose pretty good at reading the scientific literature and teasing out the nonsense.

[Honky Tonk]

Great! Might as well go back to wearing the sweaty synthetics, where you get the truth in content!!

I can't go cold turkey Zacha341, I have to have @ least "9% Cotton By Content".

[jcole]

I was thinking of doing a garment factory based on useing US grown cotton from raw product to finished garments.

Then I found this...

Find that link yet?

[Richard]

Find that link yet?

Others have participated in the discussion and posted links as a starting point,are you going to participate in a positive manner?

[jcole]

No, I searched for the things you stated, but can't find any info on them. I also commented on what I found. I find nothing about Monsanto controlling 99% or the worlds cotton, on line or in the links above. I see a couple things about colored cotton but mostly in context of a woman in California. In India they grow two colors of cotton, brown and red, that are natural growth but the cotton itself is not good for cloth; short staple and it breaks. I see that Indian farmers have been killing themselves, but over loss of revenue for a number of reasons.
I also saw a lawsuit by Monsanto but it's in context of copyright infringement by seed saving, not that farmers aren't allowed to use other seed. There are also lawsuits against Monsanto by the Indian farmers.
I would like to see a link that supports your findings or refutes mine

[Richard]

Well sense you asked we can start here,as long as you can comprehend that those who control the seeds controls the products.

Global GM Seed Market
40.8: Percent of world’s GM crops grown in the U.S.
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

76.3: Percent of world’s GM crops grown by the U.S., Brazil, and Argentina.
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

9: Number of countries responsible for 97% of the world’s GMO crops.
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

8: Number of GMO crops that have been approved for commercial production worldwide [[soy, cotton, corn, canola, sugarbeet, papaya, squash/yellow zucchini, and alfalfa).
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

11: Number of countries that grow GM soybean [[81% of global planting).
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

15. Number of countries that grow GM cotton [[81% of global planting).
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

17: Number of countries that grow GM maize [[35% of global planting).
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

4: Number of countries that grow GM canola [[30% of global planting).
Source: International Service for the Acquisition of Agri-biotech Applications [[ISAAA), 2012

Monsanto Monopoly
80: Percent of U.S. corn grown from Monsanto patented GMO seeds.
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

93: Percent of U.S. soy grown from Monsanto patented GMO seeds.
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

27: Percent of Monsanto profits that came from the sale of Roundup herbicide.
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

1,676: Number of seed, plant, and other applicable patents owned by Monsanto.
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

282 million: Number of acres Monsanto products are grown worldwide [[up from 3 million in 1996).
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

151.4 million: Number of acres Monsanto’s GE crop traits are grown in the U.S. [[40% of total cropland).
Source: Food and Water Watch, 2013

95: Percent of the U.S. GE corn seed market containing Monsanto’s traits.
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

89: Percent of the U.S. GE cotton seed market containing Monsanto’s traits.
Source: Food And Water Watch, 2013

https://www.organicconsumers.org/ess...arket-gm-seeds


When you are done with those links let me know.

[jcole]

Well, in the first section of "links" it's the same link over and over with no specifics to cotton
Second set of links is "Page not found" over and over.
I'm done now

[Richard]

I knew that you were done when you posted India had two different varieties without digging deeper to discover they went from having over 1000 varieties down to the two because of the manlipulation.

The plus side is Bayer/Monsanto as of a few weeks ago lost all of thier cases in India when it comes to GMO control.

The links posted were from 7 years ago,common sense dictates that Monsanto’s agenda and methods did not freeze at that time and only continued to grow.

You are only done when you seek to argue for the sake of argument and refuse to look at the bigger picture in context.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-i...-idUSKBN1QS1H3

But they are still forced to buy seeds that they can get for free from the plants at harvest.

[jcole]

Maybe if you knew how to post a link instead of making fun of others that do, you'd be taken a little more seriously. Your links DON'T work.
I tried to give you a chance to prove what you posted, but you posted links that are broken, so you obviously didn't even look at them. You found a page with links that you thought would prove your point and just copied the whole page without verifying anything.
As I said on another thread, you're not worth my time.

[Richard]

But yet you continue to post and reply that you are done in the same amount of time that it would have taken to dig a little deeper.

If you posted in another thread that I was not worth your time,why would you even reply in this one? It makes zero sense.

If you actually read my first post you would have noticed/comprehended,I was not trying to prove anything.So what are you trying to prove?

[JBMcB]

But they are still forced to buy seeds that they can get for free from the plants at harvest.

No, they are forced to buy Monsanto's patented seeds if they want to use them year after year. If they don't want to agree to those terms, they are free to use any other kind of seed that isn't patented. As you said, there are thousands of varieties to choose from.

This is what I don't understand about these arguments. Nobody is *forcing* the farmers to do anything. They want to use Monsanto seeds because, apparently, they work pretty damn well. The farmers want to pay less for them, which I understand. However, I'd bet the farmers would be pretty upset if the textile companies got together and tried to strong-arm them into charging less for their cotton.

[Richard]

I posted they used to grow over a 1000 different varieties and now down to two.

It is the same thing there,or was,as in the US.

You grow non GMO cotton,a seed from a GMO lands in your crop.

Many ways,birds grab tufts to build nests,wind blows,a flood may flow through etc.

I have mango and papaya tress and such and I never planted them,a few blocks away a guy has several,the birds eat them fly away and take a dump a the seeds are planted.

Once they find one GMO plant in your field,you now owe royalties on the entire crop,so what are you going to do?

Use your own seeds and take the chance and have to go through the litigation process only to lose or just buy thier seeds from the start?

The difference is the GMO seeds need the pesticides to germinate and grow,natural seeds you plant and grow without the use of pesticides,that was the whole purpose of GMO,to reduce the risk from critters.

But the seed company sells pesticides,so why do they need pesticides if the seeds were designed to grow without them.

The seeds could be free from the previous crop,but now when they are forced to buy the pesticides in order to grow the product the costs increase substantially.

Think about it,in India’s case they were the textile hub long before we were even a country 1000s of years and then all of the sudden they needed somebody to tell them how to grow cotton?

When a farmer plows a field they are only useing or turning the first 12” of soil,in the past it was nutrient rich from organic breakdown,or the farmer would plow over a portion of the crop in order to replace the organic nutrients.

So 20% of the crop was lost to that process,in comes the salesperson,I have this chemical fertilizers that you can spray on your crops so you do not lose that 20%,or a seed that you can plant.

Once that GMO seed is planted it becomes a GMO field forever,you cannot change your mind without still having to pay the royalties.

Are there other options yes,the government learned in the 1930s about crop rotations.

There are rice growers in Arkansas and Louisiana that after harvesting the rice crop they flood the fields and raise crawfish,the crawfish replace the nutrients in the soil,useing no fertilizers.

Now as a seed and fertilizer and pesticides company are you going to approach farmers with alternatives or are you going to sell your product and be like any other large corporation and figure out how to dominate your industry.

[JBMcB]

Once they find one GMO plant in your field,you now owe royalties on the entire crop,so what are you going to do?

Show me a link to an original source [[IE case filing, major newspaper article) that says that has happened. That is, Monsanto trying to collect licensing fees for an entire crop when a few crops were contaminated. The only examples I find are when the farmers purposefully re-grow the GMO seeds the next year, then either grow or sell them.

https://gmo.geneticliteracyproject.o...nly-grow-gmos/

The Organic Seed Growers coalition tried suing Monsanto for this practice, but it got thrown out of multiple courts as they couldn't find a single instance of this happening to anyone, and the courts saw no reason why it would.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-m...9590ZD20130610

[oladub]

Show me a link to an original source [[IE case filing, major newspaper article) that says that has happened. That is, Monsanto trying to collect licensing fees for an entire crop when a few crops were contaminated. The only examples I find are when the farmers purposefully re-grow the GMO seeds the next year, then either grow or sell them.

https://gmo.geneticliteracyproject.o...nly-grow-gmos/

The Organic Seed Growers coalition tried suing Monsanto for this practice, but it got thrown out of multiple courts as they couldn't find a single instance of this happening to anyone, and the courts saw no reason why it would.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-m...9590ZD20130610

I looked up one I had heard of. Percy Schmeiser looks back 20 years at fight against Monsanto

[Richard]

[COLOR=rgba[[0, 0, 0, 0.701961)]The [/COLOR]House Bill 2739 summary states[COLOR=rgba[[0, 0, 0, 0.701961)] that it “Allows cause of action against patent holder for genetically engineered organism present on land without permission of owner or lawful occupant.” Defenders of the bill believe it is a step in the right direction to remedy problems caused by GMOs. Sandra Bishop of the Our Family Farms Coalition, which supports HB 2739, spoke to the [/COLOR]East Oregonian website saying[COLOR=rgba[[0, 0, 0, 0.701961)], “This is not a wild legal grab. We will not be compensated for our angst. We will only be compensated for provable legal damages.”

[/COLOR]For years Monsanto[COLOR=rgba[[0, 0, 0, 0.701961)] has bullied farmers when their GMO seeds ended up on the farmers’ land. While contamination can occur many different ways, by no fault of their own, [/COLOR]farmers have been sued when unauthorized GMO crops show up in their fields[COLOR=rgba[[0, 0, 0, 0.701961)]. The companies that own the seed patents typically win these cases, leaving farmers with few options. This bill, if passed, would give power back to landowners who want to continue to have GMO-free farms.

[/COLOR]https://realfarmacy.com/gmo-law-farmer-sue-monsanto/

The biggest problem is if one has a natural grown produce farm and it becomes contaminated without knowledge then they are actually marketing GMO without knowing.

[jcole]

The
House Bill 2739 summary states that it “Allows cause of action against patent holder for genetically engineered organism present on land without permission of owner or lawful occupant.” Defenders of the bill believe it is a step in the right direction to remedy problems caused by GMOs. Sandra Bishop of the Our Family Farms Coalition, which supports HB 2739, spoke to the East Oregonian website saying, “This is not a wild legal grab. We will not be compensated for our angst. We will only be compensated for provable legal damages.”

For years Monsanto has bullied farmers when their GMO seeds ended up on the farmers’ land. While contamination can occur many different ways, by no fault of their own, farmers have been sued when unauthorized GMO crops show up in their fields. The companies that own the seed patents typically win these cases, leaving farmers with few options. This bill, if passed, would give power back to landowners who want to continue to have GMO-free farms.

https://realfarmacy.com/gmo-law-farmer-sue-monsanto/

The biggest problem is if one has a natural grown produce farm and it becomes contaminated without knowledge then they are actually marketing GMO without knowing.

Fixed that for ya