Ilitch Parking empire expansion

[Gistok]

I preferred the baseball stadium where it was at before.

The best thing that ever happened to Corktown was the Tigers leaving. The neighborhood was horrible with all the empty residential dirt lots that were used on game days. It became more profitable to tear down houses and use the lots for Tigers days than to keep the neighborhood intact. Now the neighborhood has been infilled and is booming.

[LongGone06]

I preferred the baseball stadium where it was at before.

I agree. If Tiger Stadium truly was beyond the point of refurbishing, which it probably was, I would have liked to have seen something like the Yankees did with the new Yankee Stadium--a new facility with the basic design elements of Tiger Stadium in the same neighborhood. Aside from a gigantic outfield, Comerica Park is not particularly unique.

You have to remember, though, this was only a few years after the opening of Camden Yards, which was designed by the same architect, HOK Sport, and set the standard for designs of that era.

[Uncledave54]

You have to remember, though, this was only a few years after the opening of Camden Yards, which was designed by the same architect, HOK Sport, and set the standard for designs of that era.

However, Camden Yards was designed to look like an old time ball park. Copa is a simple design, imo.

[djtomt]

First off, Comerica Park is way better than Tiger Stadium...period. If you are debating this, you don't go to baseball games.

Second -https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/detroit-city/2019/04/03/temple-detroit-development-cost-72-million-open-june-2020/3355211002/

This development is going to be ready in 1 year. The Illitches can't even make a parking lot that fast. District Detroit my ass...

[Meddle]

Question: Did you transcribe the press release you were given, or just copy and paste?

A C&P might have had a paragraph in it somewhere.

So is anybody going to the Public Hearing?

[EGrant]

Comerica Park is a middle-of-the-road MLB stadium. It isn't bad, but it isn't great either. While Tiger Stadium had its obvious flaws, I dearly miss the charm and intimacy you felt while watching the game. Best upper deck seats in baseball; you were literally on top of the outfielders. We traded that charm for 1,000 giant video screens so we can watch Dunkin Donuts menu items race around a CGI downtown between innings. CoPa is fine, for a "retro" park that was all the rage in the early 2000s. But Tiger Stadium was a unique place to watch a game, and I wish we could have done something more to save it.

[Zads07]

I tend to agree with you. The Illitches have no doubt manipulated and taken advantage of tax incentives [[ as many have ) for their more than profitable adventures, but have developed some very impressive facilities. They are business people, not a total charity, what does one expect. However, so many on here seem to have no idea what the city would be like without them. I remember living here in 1984, [[still do 35 years later, I can certify I have lived downtown through it all ) and the city was a disaster , and nobody would even look at the city, Illitch started with the Fox theater development , renovated and restored beautifully a dilapidated and water destroyed theater that finally, brought solid world class entertainement back downtown, did several other projects, waffled on several other projects, and overall was the catalyst that started any sort of rebirth that took 15 to 20 years to develop.

Here's why that's not true and it has been stated in other posts here. It wasn't a full-scale renovation, only partial and he continued the work of Chuck Forbes. Give him credit, absolutely, but don't praise him for continuing something he didn't start.

He also built the Red Wings up, from a team of mediocre talent, to a dynasty, which not only brought a sense of pride to Detroit, as Hockeytown, but brought millions and millions of dollars into the area for the city, for himself, and for numerous other restaurants and businesses that otherwise would have collapsed. No one seems to remember there was huge pressure to move the Red Wings to the Novi area much earlier, but Illitch insisted he wanted them downtown.

This is also false. He did not build up the Red Wings. He bought the team and invested. The GM, Jimmy Devallano built the team, he just provided the money. And to your point about Novi, the Red Wings were prepared to move to Pontiac, but the city kept the Red Wings in Detroit [[before Ilitch) by building a city-owned arena [[Joe Louis) and the package was too good to move.

His families casino involvement is a big success for Detroit as well as himself, he insisted on building Comerica Park and staying downtown, so Detroit could compete with a state of the art ballpark with the other wealthier cities.

He let Tiger Stadium sit and rot after he bought the Tigers. He could've put less money into renovating it, but instead decided to tear down a bunch of buildings for Comerica and PARKING LOTS and closer to the Fox and his HQ.

I can never get over how so many on here seem to have absolutely no concept of that, it’s no secret the Illitches like to promise big developments, and the final product is never totally what they propose, but they have built some pretty dam nice facilities in town, just look at LCA. I would much rather have the new arena built , then worry about the fact that they haven’t built a couple blocks of townhouse and some retail development around it yet. The Illitches have made decisions that obviously will benefit themselves, but have most definitely benefited Detroit in a big way.

This is not true. Taxpayers put up the money for LCA, over half and the promises have no come through surrounding. How about I promise you a full, five-course meal. Instead though, I deliver a few sides and a piece of the entree.

The pluses, far outweigh the negatives on their projects Overall, without them, there would have been zero catalyst for development, I often doubt that even Gilbert would have cared less had it not been for the Ilitch, Penske, and Karmanos teams trying to turn Detroit around. Gilbert himself, has stated many times, that he wanted to build up upon what these individuals have done in the city, and how important every one of their non-stop investments and their loyalty to Detroit impressed him. Every one of them could have taken their material dollars to the suburbs or to another city very easily, there was always a lot of alternatives and they always picked downtown Detroit.No one else stepped up to the plate except these guys. Lets see who else comes in and duplicates or betters these accomplishments. It never hurts to acknowledge accomplishments instead of constantly looking for negatives.

Please, list for us the positives and we'll list the negatives and we'll see which one is longer. I can guarantee the list of demolition for parking lots will be so long, you'll need 10x the list of the few positives they have.

[Gistok]

A nice little video [[2 weeks old) showing what is going on right now in "District Detroit"....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTxMBmlw4kQ

[archfan]

...
This is also false. He did not build up the Red Wings. He bought the team and invested. The GM, Jimmy Devallano built the team, he just provided the money. And to your point about Novi, the Red Wings were prepared to move to Pontiac, but the city kept the Red Wings in Detroit [[before Ilitch) by building a city-owned arena [[Joe Louis) and the package was too good to move.

Thanks for this - I hadn't thought beyond the usual narrative. The Red Wings announced they were moving to Pontiac in 1977, the city countered with JLA, which opened in 1979. The Ilitches didn't buy the Red Wings until 1982.

[EastsideAl]

First off, Comerica Park is way better than Tiger Stadium...period. If you are debating this, you don't go to baseball games.

I know this is a lot of water way past a very old bridge, but I couldn't disagree more with this statement. I've been to a lot of MLB baseball games, not only in Detroit but around the country. Atmosphere and history aside [[although that does count for a lot), I have never been in a ballpark that was better for actually watching the game of baseball than Tiger Stadium. Every infield seat, upper and lower deck, in front of the posts was closer to the game and had a better view than practically any seat in Comerica Park. Sitting in the upper deck at Comerica you may as well be a block away from the game. It is an entirely different experience of baseball than sitting in the upper deck at Tiger Stadium.

Now Comerica isn't a bad ballpark, and certainly has much greater creature comforts in terms of concessions, rest rooms, whirligigs, etc. [[although not in terms of comfort and shade from the summer sun). But Tiger Stadium it ain't, and another ballpark with that level of intimacy with the game will never be built again.

[Bham1982]

It's amazing to me that people believe that theaters would never be renovated or stadia would never be built if it weren't for the Illitches. Bizarre.

Comerica is an average park, at best. Nothing highly objectionable, but nothing particularly iconic. I think anyone who has visited other parks would generally agree with this.

[Bliebs77]

I know this is a lot of water way past a very old bridge, but I couldn't disagree more with this statement. I've been to a lot of MLB baseball games, not only in Detroit but around the country. Atmosphere and history aside [[although that does count for a lot), I have never been in a ballpark that was better for actually watching the game of baseball than Tiger Stadium. Every infield seat, upper and lower deck, in front of the posts was closer to the game and had a better view than practically any seat in Comerica Park. Sitting in the upper deck at Comerica you may as well be a block away from the game. It is an entirely different experience of baseball than sitting in the upper deck at Tiger Stadium.

Now Comerica isn't a bad ballpark, and certainly has much greater creature comforts in terms of concessions, rest rooms, whirligigs, etc. [[although not in terms of comfort and shade from the summer sun). But Tiger Stadium it ain't, and another ballpark with that level of intimacy with the game will never be built again.

Upper deck yes; but don't you remember those ridiculous obstructed view seats and the 'troff' urinals that the men had to use? I think we are looking back on T.S. with some rose colored glasses.

[EGrant]

Obstructed view seats were not ideal for sure, but the troughs could surely have been amended with a serious modernization of Tiger Stadium. I think the owners kind of let that place go to say "see, it's falling apart!"

I look at what the Cubs have done with Wrigley over the past 5 years and can't help but wonder what a "modern" Tiger Stadium would look like.

[CMU Steve]

It's amazing to me that people believe that theaters would never be renovated or stadia would never be built if it weren't for the Illitches. Bizarre.

Comerica is an average park, at best. Nothing highly objectionable, but nothing particularly iconic. I think anyone who has visited other parks would generally agree with this.

Comerica Park is the best stadium in baseball. It has a Ferris wheel and everything.

https://www.freep.com/story/sports/m...rs/3347382002/

[EastsideAl]

Upper deck yes; but don't you remember those ridiculous obstructed view seats and the 'troff' urinals that the men had to use? I think we are looking back on T.S. with some rose colored glasses.

The trough urinals didn't particularly bother me. They were the same kind that were in my grandpa's bar!

EGrant is right though, a trip to Wrigley Field or to Fenway Park will show one the ways in which an old ballpark can be both preserved and modernized. And a trip to the new Yankee Stadium will show how a new stadium can be built to respect and update the past.

Part of my problem with Comerica has always been that, outside of the added on sculptures, there's no feeling at all there that the city has a baseball history that predates 2000. It's long struck me as kind of sad that the Texas Rangers' gimcrack of a ballpark [[soon to be replaced now) contains a direct swipe from Tiger Stadium, but the Tigers' ballpark was built as if Tiger/Briggs/Navin/Bennett Stadium/Field/Park never existed.

[Gistok]

For all the merits of old Tiger Stadium... the best thing that happened to Corktown was them leaving the area for another stadium. Corktown was a DUMP.... every 4th house on each street was missing because they were being torn down and replaced by weed choked lots for landowners to make money parking 10-12 cars on their lots, 81 days a year. Corktown would never have turned into the polished gem of a neighborhood with the Tigers still there.