Is Public transit Charity?

[Zacha341]

Can't those driving just drive as chosen, and those in need of public transpo do that? For some public transpo will be a desire, others a necessity. I can live with that distinction, is it that hard to do?

In the mean time I prefer to drive a car as I can and -- drive at the level I can afford legally, or I would not drive.

[stasu1213]

It's amazing the California has more cars on it's road than Detroit and/or Michigan does but Calfornia has a much better transit system than Michigan. How could you explain that?

[stasu1213]

Depending on the size, a bus can cost btwn $300-400K for public transit busses. Operating costs will vary with each agency. To ride a SMART bus with no pass, it's $4.00 one way. With a montly pass, it's $2.20 per day. If you get a senior or handicapper pass, it's $2.50 per month.

We're a house divided. My husband faithfully takes the bus everywhere he can. He has always hated to drive, especially now with so many inattentive drivers on their phones, people thinking STOP signs are just suggestions, etc. I on the other hand prefer to drive everywhere. [[Although, I've never worked where there is a bus route nearby.) I don't ever want to give up my car. However, I can see the value in the bus service. I've ridden the 261 FAST bus with my husband a few times. Every time I've been on it, it's been pretty full of riders. Some people really need it. Some people just prefer it.

Correction. The fare for SMART is $2.00 one way and $4.00 two ways

[stasu1213]

Michigan's transit could have an increase in ridership if it was better publicized and have SMART services operate in and out of Detroit on weekends. There probably be more and more people going to a Pistons or Red Wing games as well as other events occurring downtown/midtown if more SMART routes would have busses running them after 6pm and on weekends. On the lighter routes where ridership is sparse SMART could have there shuttle like busses to run those routes and the Fast busses could continue to run the Gratiot and Woodward lines. Additional lines could be added for Fast such as Jefferson, Grand River, Michigan, and Van Dyke

[O3H]

The marketing boys should strike while the iron is nuclear hot.

My pitch :
- Got no insurance ?
- Can't afford to register that vehicle ?
- Maybe you just can't afford the higher gas prices ?
- Pissed off at finding the perfect Parking Spot for the lowest price ?
- Would you like to see more green, more money , in the bank ?

TAKE PUBLIC TRANSPORT - chances are your company
will even help out with the commute expenses.

[mtburb]

Additional lines could be added for Fast such as Jefferson, Grand River, Michigan, and Van Dyke

Michigan already has a Fast line, I think you meant Fort Street.

[masterblaster]

Started reading this thread while having coffee this morning. Passed 6 buses on the way to work, a 17 mile one way trip, 2 SMART, 2 DDOT, 2 FAST. Both DDOT's were empty, one going East, one going West. One FAST was empty, going East, one FAST had 8 people on it going West. One SMART going West was empty, one SMART had 6 people on it going East. What does it cost to buy each bus? What does it cost to run each bus, fuel, maintenance, driver? How much is it to ride a bus one way? Where I live, I can observe buses all day, if I want, and I see this scenario repeated daily. Today, when I leave work, on my way home, I'll pick up groceries @ an affordable grocery store, and pick up hardware and garden supplies for a rehab I'm doing. One trip. So, to answer the original question, yes, it is charity.

I am on the Warren DDOT bus currently, 12:25 am at night, and there are 19 people on this bus. Public Transit is a necessary service for a city. Owning and maintaining a car, especially in the city with this insurance racket, is extraordinarily expensive.

[Honky Tonk]

I am on the Warren DDOT bus currently, 12:25 am at night, and there are 19 people on this bus. Public Transit is a necessary service for a city. Owning and maintaining a car, especially in the city with this insurance racket, is extraordinarily expensive.

Thanx MB. I prefer real investigation not feel-good rhetoric. My guess is it's a shift ending. I get more done with one car trip, there are no direct routes to my work place, and I'm not going to spend an additional three hours a day to get back and forth to work. You are right, vehicle ownership is expensive. Gouging drivers every time you need a tax increase doesn't seem fair either, does it?

[Danny]

Too bad Livonia, Novi, Canton TWP. Bloomfield Hills have missed out of the public transit bandwagon. They believe their opt out makes public transit a charity.

[Worldsgreatest]

No. it's a living and economic necessity.

Only in America do idiots think public transit isn't important.

[O3H]

The brainwashing doesn't work anymore.
Let them build electric busses instead, because the $40,000 car is laughable

Yeah Electric Busses, I said it, not diesel.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1112132024746291203

[Zacha341]

Yep, driving can be expensive [[40K level if that's your scene). However, for me to get to my jobs/ appointments I'd be outdoors standing at bus stops before sunrise and after dark - winter seasons.

I'm not interested in putting in that position, replete with a purse and sometimes with a laptop. The times I have used public transpo part of my adaptation is no purse, to help minimize risks.

But the risks remain. Rape, robberies and assaults can mess up a day, BEYOND the additional hours of transpo time added.

Woman sexually assaulted near Detroit bus stop, police seek suspect

Tips Wanted To ID Car After Woman Kidnapped At Bus Stop, Raped

64-year-old woman sexually assaulted by man who offered ride at bus stop

Thanx MB. I prefer real investigation not feel-good rhetoric. My guess is it's a shift ending. I get more done with one car trip, there are no direct routes to my work place, and I'm not going to spend an additional three hours a day to get back and forth to work. You are right, vehicle ownership is expensive. Gouging drivers every time you need a tax increase doesn't seem fair either, does it?

[Zacha341]

Yes, I've noted everyone's driving a 40K car, 'brainwashed' dolts they are..... Getting mine next month. Ummn, NOT.

In any event [[whatever price point spectrum) it's still a personal choice as to what level car to purchase. Eh, last I checked......

The brainwashing doesn't work anymore.
Let them build electric busses instead, because the $40,000 car is laughable

Yeah Electric Busses, I said it, not diesel.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1112132024746291203

[Zacha341]

Indeed, I see riders on busses, it's an option. I also see people at bus stops ALONE - sadly a risk factor, especially for women.

In some cases people have someone wait with them until the bus arrives for added security. Seen that too. Due to necessity I used busses for a few weeks 2016, going out of my way to go the the Northland Mall end of line. Catching an extra bus to avoid standing at a stop alone after dark. The N-Land buss hub always had many riders waiting. Making it a safer IMO.

Criminal trolls are very precise in their victim patrol; seeking persons alone, especially at night. Take care to not become a victim when using public transpo, especially if your stops coming or going are in a sketchy area.

Yes, the insurance rates in Michigan are ridiculous, but for some driving remains a preferred transportation option.

I am on the Warren DDOT bus currently, 12:25 am at night, and there are 19 people on this bus. Public Transit is a necessary service for a city. Owning and maintaining a car, especially in the city with this insurance racket, is extraordinarily expensive.

[stasu1213]

Honky Tonky you probaby monitoring these busses during down time very early in the morning around 5am or late in the evening. You didn't say what routes that you were driving along. Had anyone ever though that the reason why the "Using Public Transporatation" concept is not prevalent in Michigan is probably due to the auto industry control those in the legislation, the Governor, Mayor, common council, and probably the local media. One reason why children are being raped or kidnapped at bus stops is due to DPS had closed many schools throughout the communities in Detroit and not providing school busses to pick up children at certain pick up points exposing these children to danger while waiting at bus stops. Many entities benefit off the bad roads througout southeast Michigan; the auto industries for consumers are forced to purchase SUVs and other large gas guzziling vehicles that could handle the bad roads, the dealership repair shops who are the only ones that could repair the cars including the electrical components damaged from cars being shakened on these bad roads, and the tire shops who's revenue had increase from the influx of replacing of blown tires and repairing of suspensions. The auto industry, UAW, gas stations, and the insurance companies benefit off of Michigan being a car dependent State. Governor Whitmer should also had said "Fix t"he damn transportation system

[softailrider]

I don’t think anyone is forced into an SUV or truck because of the roads around here. I think you can do perfectly well with a regular passenger car. However, if you have low profile tires it could be problematic.

[Zacha341]

^^^ A stronger car mechanically helps. That is to say level of those that can be driven in rural areas and rough terrain like Antartica, Australia, Afghanistan, and India!

I'm serious [[see below rough terrain areas of the world). When you see cars driven in certain regions on rough, dusty, snowy and often unpaved roads you don't see wimpy models. Those suspensions are far, FAR to delicate for that.

Same here in Michigan increasingly! Weaker cars suffer more damage/ faster! Toyotas for example, are very hearty suspension-wise, I've found... you'll not see weaker offerings driven in areas below:

The Hardest Countries To Drive Across In The World

[O3H]

The BIG cities in Michigan still have dirt roads, like in Warren.
After a hard rain those ruts will rattle your brain cavity severely.
Why do we have dirt roads in Michigan's largest cities is a mystery.

[Bham1982]

It's amazing the California has more cars on it's road than Detroit and/or Michigan does but Calfornia has a much better transit system than Michigan. How could you explain that?

Um, CA has like 4x the population? Japan has far more cars on the road than Michigan too, and roughly 1 billion times better transit.

[makischr]

When I travel to other large cities - NYC, DC, Paris or Berlin, I use mass transit. Who do I see making use of mass transit along with me? I see other tourists, I see people in business attire travelling to and from work, I see people of all walks of life. Do most of these people feel that they are slumming it for not sporting for a cab? No. They use it because it's convenient. Do they consider it to be charity? Hardly. You go to a major metropolitan area and expect there to be multiple transit options.

[stasu1213]

When I travel to other large cities - NYC, DC, Paris or Berlin, I use mass transit. Who do I see making use of mass transit along with me? I see other tourists, I see people in business attire travelling to and from work, I see people of all walks of life. Do most of these people feel that they are slumming it for not sporting for a cab? No. They use it because it's convenient. Do they consider it to be charity? Hardly. You go to a major metropolitan area and expect there to be multiple transit options.

In Michigan convenient is having a car and not having to so call rely on public transportation which is for us low income people. That concept had been sprouted by the supporters of the auto companies for over 60 years. Businesses in the other cities such as New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, and Washington DC are still in their downtown areas while in Michigan many of the companies had set up shop in the suburbs where their employees have to drive to them but have parking lots where they could park for free. There weren’t many busses that went out to these businesses for their employees who lived in Detroit or the inner ring suburban areas could use to get there. I would say that Semta had a train that had taken office workers from as far as Pontiac to downtown Detroit but it was disbanded in the early 80s.

[Tig3rzhark]

With present problems such as high insurance rates in Michigan, along with the high cost of car ownership, the millennial generation also has to deal with the high cost of student loans, thereby increasing the need for public transportation.

The millennial generation would more than likely be on that bus, than in that car, with the lack of infrastructure in the country, the lack of public transit in metro Detroit, and the lack of city, county, and state governments to cooperate with each other.

[O3H]

Let's just be brutally honest :

That uptight buthole scrunched businessmen/salesman making 6 figures,
simply can't past the """""Stigma""""""" of a bus ride with a common dude.
Mix in a little racial diversity, cultural difference, language and the uppity asshole simply can't take the HUMANITY of it all ; to share a ride.

We have PROBLEM in metro Detroit called being an ASSHOLE
- and it has nothing to do with car ownership.
And more to do with ownership of one's own UNrational fears
of sitting next to someone different, who might actually say Hi .

People all over the world do it daily Mon-Fri and they live great lives.

Try the Hi and a smile to a complete stranger - go ahead - be brave.

[Zozo]

Let's just be brutally honest :

That uptight buthole scrunched businessmen/salesman making 6 figures,
simply can't past the """""Stigma""""""" of a bus ride with a common dude.
Mix in a little racial diversity, cultural difference, language and the uppity asshole simply can't take the HUMANITY of it all ; to share a ride.

We have PROBLEM in metro Detroit called being an ASSHOLE
- and it has nothing to do with car ownership.
And more to do with ownership of one's own UNrational fears
of sitting next to someone different, who might actually say Hi .

People all over the world do it daily Mon-Fri and they live great lives.

Try the Hi and a smile to a complete stranger - go ahead - be brave.

How can you assume to know what people think? There are many corporate workers that cannot utilize transit because it is not convenient for their job. Many white collar workers are only in their office for several hours a day. The rest of the day is spent traveling to meet clients, or attending meetings out of the office, or perhaps they are at the courthouse or in trial. Also many white collar workers are working remotely from home these days. What a prejudiced and presumptuous rant.

[Zacha341]

^^^ Yes, it assumed alot. Six figures can be from $100,000 annual a family of four [[not exactly rich) or $999,000 which is loaded fiscally.

For the rest of us eh, folk, well some live long distances to a bus stop, or not able to walk distances or withstand cold temperatures, carrie packages, due to varied health reasons.

And I challenge anyone to tell me all areas of Detroit, etc. are safe to stand at a buss stop early or late hours. They're not.

The biggest rub is that the six figured person so offish, is NOT GOING TO BE FORCED TO RIDE A BUS OR SHARE THEIR TIME COMMUNALLY!! Taunts and rants withstanding!

If the driving option goes away, the poor and working class will be affected mostly. The hail and the frail, disenfranchised from freedom of choice once again.... Did not see that one coming......?

The truly rich and elite will continue to do and have what they want, even when they say you cannot.

IF YOU don't like cars, don't buy or drive one. IF you don't want the extra time of ridership with others don't.