Farmers Restaurant/Eastern Market

[SammyS]

Please elaborate
"benefit of very cheap RE within miles of relatively unaffordable RE."

You mean real estate, did you type all that to just to abbreviate ?

The cost of veggies goes up because someone can't park a truck,
pull up and throw some stuff in a paper bag for cash ?

Right on about the RE. I do question whether an independent grower can compete with the big producers though, with or without free parking.

The bottom line is simple. Detroit is changing and changing for the better. There will be losers but the net effect will be positive.
ALL ABOARRD, THE D TRAIN

[archfan]

I understand the sensitivity of the subject and the disruption it is causing current tenants, but i would like to approach this problem without emotion.

This is often the preface to saying, "I'm doing something vile, but it's legal".

What we have here is a situation of pure market economics.

<single stakeholder economics, and how real estate works>

If EM cannot bear higher rents, then the investors will soon feel the pain and it will likely revert back to the prior situation organically.

That's it though - it won't go back to being what it was. They're pushing out the shops that made the area appealing. Once the wand is broken, there is no more magic.

There are other ways. Developers could work with the existing businesses to keep them going on the main floor. Rehab and rent out the unused floors above the shops at the increasingly higher market rates. Possibly buy in to the business to keep them viable, leading to a new revenue stream. That would require business acumen and an eye for the long term. But, it might prevent more empty storefronts in EM, because the developers couldn't get their rents right.

[Honky Tonk]

The "gentrifiers" have brought an awareness to many downtown areas but as archfan said, many will and have been priced out of the area. Here's an example. My daughters high school teacher lived in a loft in the market well before it became hip. She left last year because of the spike in rent.

Here's a more detailed article about the process. Take a gander of Nelson in a fedora and cuban cigar. Just might tell ya where it's heading.


http://www.deadlinedetroit.com/artic...dlords_move_in

What's that shoved in his mouth? Never mind, it's a cigar. Unfortunately, money won't buy you class or cool, just a contrived environment and a bunch of tchotchke.

[SammyS]

This is often the preface to saying, "I'm doing something vile, but it's legal".



That's it though - it won't go back to being what it was. They're pushing out the shops that made the area appealing. Once the wand is broken, there is no more magic.

There are other ways. Developers could work with the existing businesses to keep them going on the main floor. Rehab and rent out the unused floors above the shops at the increasingly higher market rates. Possibly buy in to the business to keep them viable, leading to a new revenue stream. That would require business acumen and an eye for the long term. But, it might prevent more empty storefronts in EM, because the developers couldn't get their rents right.

Things may never be the same ever again and that applies to many areas of Detroit. I think your idea of subsidizing current tenants by increasing the rent of new tenants will be challenging if not illegal.

It all goes back to my last point. The previous owner held onto the properties for decades so the millage is assumed to be relatively low compared to the reassessed value. From my experience, I’m estimating the tax burden has increased at least 5 fold. If my numbers are somewhat accurate, then it does not make financial sense. For instance, if residential rentals are expected to return 7-10%, then a rent of $350/month values the property at $30-$40k. Maybe 5 years ago but not today. Same would apply for commercial but I’m not sure what a viable business model would be in that cases. I could only assume more.

[O3H]

I actually LIKED the grit,grime, diesel smell, Drive Up and Get Some.
The farmer drove the truck, to market, and sold produce - direct.

It almost looks like a mall now

[SammyS]

I actually LIKED the grit,grime, diesel smell, Drive Up and Get Some.
The farmer drove the truck, to market, and sold produce - direct.

It almost looks like a mall now

All good in a pre-globalization/environment age. 100 years ago, someone like you probably complained about missing the horseshit smell

[O3H]

Beats the hell out of food served on styrofoam, wrapped in plastic wrap,
and people calling it fresh meat from the refrigerated warehouse.

When is the last time you held meat - still warm from a live chicken ?

People want to eat the lettuce right out of the plastic bag,
like it never actually grew in DIRT that had to be washed off.
Carrots picked that morning, with the green tops intact are delicious.

Kids think all food is like their plastic legos and doesn't have blood.

[Detroitdave]

Like an earlier poster stated. "that fedora and cigar says it all", this guy is such a tool, daddy's money helps.
I'll leave that right there for you...

[O3H]

Horseshit smell = organic
Styrofoam and cellophane = a middle man jacking up the cost

[SammyS]

Horseshit smell = organic
Styrofoam and cellophane = a middle man jacking up the cost

Organic means double the price for this sticker :P

[poobert]

This is easily one of the more "I'm out of my bloody mind and flinging poo" threads on DetroitYes, and there are plenty.

I think there are a few issues at play here.

One, we've lost a beloved restaurant, and all seem to think, above the incoherent screeching that something sucks about that.

But I remember the dirty Eastern Market of the early Kwame years, and while utilitarian and cool, there were still dipshits selling repackaged produce, except I got the impression they bought it from Kroger with their bridge card rather than packaged it in a wicker basket. So don't get too weepy.

Also, I get the knee-jerk about the price of organic, but the flip-side is that the vast majority of organic farmers at farmers markets you will encounter are indeed small farmers. The very kind you're romanticizing. And there really isn't anything silly about not dousing your food in pesticides if you actually stop to think about it. You can't have it both ways.

But, yeah, Eastern Market is too big and commodity-ridden. Ann Arbor Farmers Market is virtually all farmers and all organic and has balanced the junk-selling by having a "craft day" and separating the two.

We all want investment, but as far as I know, no city has solved what sucks about gentrification - turning a unique, if a bit shabby, place into a generic, overpriced yuppie playground. You could be in Portland, Berlin, Brooklyn, or London and it all basically looks the same. And the people who lived there before usually lose.

[archfan]

Things may never be the same ever again and that applies to many areas of Detroit. I think your idea of subsidizing current tenants by increasing the rent of new tenants will be challenging if not illegal.

It all goes back to my last point. The previous owner held onto the properties for decades so the millage is assumed to be relatively low compared to the reassessed value. From my experience, I’m estimating the tax burden has increased at least 5 fold. If my numbers are somewhat accurate, then it does not make financial sense. For instance, if residential rentals are expected to return 7-10%, then a rent of $350/month values the property at $30-$40k. Maybe 5 years ago but not today. Same would apply for commercial but I’m not sure what a viable business model would be in that cases. I could only assume more.

There's some middle ground here. Rents go up, but if they go up enough, you have another shuttered store. I don't see anything illegal about working to keep a store that contributed to the appeal of a place - that can only increase the value of your apartments. Besides, the article mentioned the upper floors in the buildings were empty, so there's new revenue beyond the ground floor store.

And obviously, things change. But there might be ways to keep some of the ambiance as things get renovated and improved.

[SammyS]

Some urgently needed PR work or maybe he's not the cigar smoking open shirt sleezebag he was portrayed to be.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/bu...es/3213514002/

[archfan]

Whether PR or not, it's a smart move to explain what they're doing, and why. Also from the article, just going to leave this here:

Nelson now commits to working with existing tenants to keep them in the market district, even at below-market rates, although some may be offered new space in a different location as he renovates their older buildings.

[masterblaster]

But, yeah, Eastern Market is too big and commodity-ridden. Ann Arbor Farmers Market is virtually all farmers and all organic and has balanced the junk-selling by having a "craft day" and separating the two.

What does commodity-ridden mean?

Eastern Market has a craft day, on Sundays

Sunday Market

Our Sunday Market is not your traditional farmers market. This street market seeks to showcase the work of local artists, cooks, jewelers, musicians, and more. This market is the perfect chance to discover items that are uniquely Detroit and Michigan made

https://www.easternmarket.org/market...-street-market

[stasu1213]

I dont mind some gentrification but please leave the neighborhoods alone. The handwriting was on the wall for the Eastern Market when Busy Bee Hardware announced their closing after many of years there and a developer had so called purchased the building but has done nothing to the building. Hopefully this new person will do something to the buildings instead of sitting on them as such as other developers had done over the years especially the owner of Nikis pizza. I think that his name is Stefanos or something. I hear Horace Sheffield on his radio show claim that some contaminated water or something is under the Eastern Market area. I dont trust anything that he says especially having a daughter on the city council. As long as fruit and vegetables are still sold in the market I would welcome a developer or two to purchase the buildings. I hate that Motorless City Bicycles were forced out of their location by a developer who had purchased the building that they were operating in

[casscorridor65]

I agree that most of the vegetables are not that great. They use to be. I've been going there for over 40 years but honestly, I don't like what the market has become. I much prefer the vegetables at E&L Supermercado on Vernor.

[Honky Tonk]

I agree that most of the vegetables are not that great. They use to be. I've been going there for over 40 years but honestly, I don't like what the market has become. I much prefer the vegetables at E&L Supermercado on Vernor.

Super Greenland in Dearborn, or either Al Haramain in Hamtramck.

[Zacha341]

^^^ Two thumbs up on both of those HT. Particularly Super Greenland on Miller and Warren, East Dearborn.

[Honky Tonk]

^^^ Two thumbs up on both of those HT. Particularly Super Greenland on Miller and Warren, East Dearborn.

I walked through Eastern Mark-up last Saturday. I found their prices to be pretty amazing.

[msamslex]

I live a minute’s drive from Eastborn market on Wyoming in Dearborn. No need for me to go all the way down to the E M.

Eastborn has a small bakery, fresh meat, & spice counters. They also sell fresh olives. Freshly baked pita bread is brought in from local Dearborn middle eastern bakeries. Once or twice, I’ve been fortunate enough to be there when pita bread was delivered & the loaves were still warm from the oven. Wednesday is discount day & the place is so busy, you can barely move through the store.