The Ignored Legacy of George H. W. Bush

[Pam]

https://theintercept.com/2018/12/01/...on-of-justice/

Under Bush Sr., the U.S. dropped a whopping

88,500 tons of bombs

on Iraq and Iraqi-occupied Kuwait, many of which resulted in horrific civilian casualties. In February 1991, for example, a U.S. airstrike on an air-raid shelter in the Amiriyah neighborhood of Baghdad killed at least

408 Iraqi civilians

. According to

Human Rights Watch

, the Pentagon knew the Amiriyah facility had been used as a civil defense shelter during the Iran-Iraq war and yet had attacked without warning. It was, concluded HRW, “a serious violation of the laws of war.”

[Ray1936]

Hey, war is a bitch, ain't it?

[Canadian Visitor]

Hey, war is a bitch, ain't it?

Yes.

I'd be the first to say, however unfortunate, that in the event of necessary war, awful and ugly things will happen and will be or seem justified in the circumstance.

However, if the administration in which Bush Sr was VP sold Iraq [[Saddam) the very weapons he used to invade Kuwait; knowing full well the kind of guy he was then too.

Was the war necessary? Or perhaps those weapons sales need not have been made?

Moreover, Saddam was many bad things, but so far I can discern, suicidal was not one of them.

He went into Kuwait in the belief the United States, his ally and patron was ok with it.

Why he believed that is an interesting question.......

Perhaps answered in this Wikipedia article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Glaspie

Just sayin

[Bham1982]

The first Iraq war was justified. Bush was a good man and really the last "gentleman" President, respected by all.

[oladub]

Canadian Visitor, Going back a step further, United States oil policy played a huge role in U.S. middle east affairs. Had the U.S., for instance, paid for its middle east intrigues with fuel taxes, Americans would have been buying smaller cars and perhaps not fighting this resource war.

Given, however, that the war happened, Hubert Walker Bush did 3.5 things right. The Constitution only allows Congress to declare wars.

-Although Congress did not 'declare' war, H.W. Bush went to Congress and received its 'authorization' to use military force against Iraq. [[1/2)

-The U.S. received more financial and military cooperation from allies than normal - a triumph of H.W. Bush's diplomacy.

-H.W. Bush removed troops resisting the unauthorized temptation to roll into Baghdad. He got in. He got out.

-The Gulf War was an unusually successful U.S. ground war.

"The Allied coalition was made up of 39 countries: Afghanistan, Argentina, Australia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Belgium, Canada, Czechoslovakia, Denmark, Egypt, France, Germany, Greece, Honduras, Hungary, Italy, Kuwait, Morocco, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Niger, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Singapore, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, Syria, Turkey, the United Arab Emirates, the United Kingdom and the United States.
The US Department of Defense has estimated the incremental costs of the Gulf War at $61 billion, with US allies providing about $54 billion of that -- Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states covered $36 billion. Germany and Japan covered $16 billion.
Estimates of Iraqi soldier deaths range from 1,500 to 100,000. The United States had 382 military casualties." -CNN

[Canadian Visitor]

Canadian Visitor, Going back a step further, United States oil policy played a huge role in U.S. middle east affairs. Had the U.S., for instance, paid for its middle east intrigues with fuel taxes, Americans would have been buying smaller cars and perhaps not fighting this resource war.

Given, however, that the war happened, Hubert Walker Bush did 3.5 things right. The Constitution only allows Congress to declare wars.

-Although Congress did not 'declare' war, H.W. Bush went to Congress and received its 'authorization' to use military force against Iraq. [[1/2)

-The U.S. received more financial and military cooperation from allies than normal - a triumph of H.W. Bush's diplomacy.

-H.W. Bush removed troops resisting the unauthorized temptation to roll into Baghdad. He got in. He got out.

-The Gulf War was an unusually successful U.S. ground war.

"The Allied coalition was made up of 39 countries: Afghanistan, Argentina, Australia, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Belgium, Canada, Czechoslovakia, Denmark, Egypt, France, Germany, Greece, Honduras, Hungary, Italy, Kuwait, Morocco, the Netherlands, New Zealand, Niger, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Senegal, Sierra Leone, Singapore, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, Syria, Turkey, the United Arab Emirates, the United Kingdom and the United States.
The US Department of Defense has estimated the incremental costs of the Gulf War at $61 billion, with US allies providing about $54 billion of that -- Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states covered $36 billion. Germany and Japan covered $16 billion.
Estimates of Iraqi soldier deaths range from 1,500 to 100,000. The United States had 382 military casualties." -CNN

All fair points.

In that vein........

Former Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney was among those giving eulogies today at the funeral.

Here's a link to the text of his speech, which I gather was well received. Video is also available at the link.

https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/...ll-transcript/

[Pam]

The phony incubator story:

https://youtu.be/v94WsjWKQ3U

[Johnnny5]

The cynical nature and the political views on this site really show through when the death of an ex-President [[And a highly decorated WWII veteran) doesn't warrant a thread, but instead we get one second guessing his decades old decisions.

[Pam]

The cynical nature and the political views on this site really show through when the death of an ex-President [[And a highly decorated WWII veteran) doesn't warrant a thread, but instead we get one second guessing his decades old decisions.

The mainstream media has got you covered if you want wall to wall praise, no questions asked. On this type of forum, I think we should have alternative viewpoints.

[oladub]

All fair points.

In that vein........

Former Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney was among those giving eulogies today at the funeral.

Here's a link to the text of his speech, which I gather was well received. Video is also available at the link.

https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/...ll-transcript/

Lovely speech with a good offhand Bush joke and anecdotes included.

[Bong-Man]

One thing I'll always appreciate about him was his total understanding that in the 1992 election he was facing not only a political change, but the headwinds of a generational change. He was the last of the WW2 Presidents, and he lost to the first baby boomer to hold the office. Regardless of any opinions regarding President Trump and his policies, he's going to face the same generational headwinds in the 2020 election.

[Johnnny5]

The mainstream media has got you covered if you want wall to wall praise, no questions asked. On this type of forum, I think we should have alternative viewpoints.

I have no problem with alternative viewpoints, or criticism of his actions as President. I just question the timing.

[Maof]

I have no problem with alternative viewpoints, or criticism of his actions as President. I just question the timing.

You're right. True family values, last President of the greatest generation and a wonderful send off.

[Jimaz]

18 minute interview of the author dated Dec. 3^rd:
Mehdi Hasan on George H.W. Bush’s Ignored Legacy: War Crimes, Racism and Obstruction of Justice

[Pam]

18 minute interview of the author dated Dec. 3^rd:
Mehdi Hasan on George H.W. Bush’s Ignored Legacy: War Crimes, Racism and Obstruction of Justice

Thanks for the link.

[Pam]

Has anyone ever read this book?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_..._House_of_Saud

[JBMcB]

The mainstream media has got you covered if you want wall to wall praise, no questions asked. On this type of forum, I think we should have alternative viewpoints.

I understand the desire for alternative viewpoints. However, in some quarters, leveling criticism at someone *after* they are dead is considered a sniveling, cowardly act.

In the case of Bush, Sr., books have been written, articles published, documentaries made, and opinions known. Now he's dead. End of story.

[Jimaz]

Here's something more about which to contrive selective indignity:
DetroitYES Forums » Non Detroit Issues » Thom Hartmann » The Life And Crimes Of George Herbert Walker Bush [[w/Guest Lamar Waldron)

[Meddle]

However, in some quarters, leveling criticism at someone *after* they are dead is considered a sniveling, cowardly act.

I don't change my view of someone because they stop sucking air.

[Meddle]

Here's something more about which to contrive selective indignity:

More clicks for your referral commissions? Cha-Ching!!

[Jimaz]

More clicks for your referral commissions? Cha-Ching!!

Unlike that post, mine was germane to this topic.

For the record, once again, I receive no compensation for posting here.

That your persistent accusations continue to be intended to be injurious has been noted.

I have a spare pair of binoculars to lend you since yours aren't seeing true.

[JBMcB]

I don't change my view of someone because they stop sucking air.

That's fine. I didn't particularly care for him, either. What's the use in dumping on him after he's dead, then?

[Pam]

That's fine. I didn't particularly care for him, either. What's the use in dumping on him after he's dead, then?

When people die, their legacy is examined. The author was trying to give some truth to that instead of the total whitewash in the mainstream media.

[Ray1936]

Lot of snowflakes on DetroitYes any more, eh?