No American unions outside of the USA and Canada?

[Colombian Dan]

Today I took a walk past the US embassy in Bogota Colombia. Camped outside the embassy on the street were a couple of Colombian men, one named Carlos Ernesto Trujillo, a former GM worker at a plant in Bogota [[GM Colombia; Colomotores). These men were apparently injured on the job and subsequently terminated from GM. So after listening to his story it made me think, if GM, Ford, Chrylser etc can conduct business in Colombia without issues, and if the Mormans and Jehova's Witnesses can evangelize without issues, why then are American labor unions absent from organizing outside of the USA and Canada?

[Dumpling]

Back when the lawsuit was active the UAW here in Detroit screened a film
about


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinalt...._Coca-Cola_Co.

This link is not directing correctly, but there is a Wikipedia page
for the Coca-Cola boycott called after several employees of
Coca-Cola bottlers in Colombia were killed.

[Jimaz]

... This link is not directing correctly,....

Sinaltrainal v. Coca-Cola Co.

[Colombian Dan]

Sinaltrainal v. Coca-Cola Co.

Thanks Jimaz. What is preventing an American Union to organize outside the USA?

[JBMcB]

Thanks Jimaz. What is preventing an American Union to organize outside the USA?

Depends on the country. In some countries where the labor market is highly regulated, unions need government approval to form. In some cases you have to join a government-run union, there are no alternatives.

Another factor is that in many countries with large governments that provide most services, any large organization is often seen as a part of the government, as that's how it usually is in their country. A foreign union attempting to organize could be seen as an "invasion" as most people would assume the UAW is run by the US government. A lot of charities have this problem working in certain countries.

As for Columbia, they have fairly strong labor laws, and there are no exceptions made for foreign workers or companies. You'd have to ask the workers why they aren't unionized.

https://www.export.gov/article?id=Co...-and-practices

[Colombian Dan]

Thanks. Would the UAW, Teamsters or other American union ever think about organizing or merging with other unions outside of the USA? Every time I hear the UAW say it's an "international" union I wonder if that's true. Also, with all this global trade and partnerships of American business with foreign companies, and yet American unions seem timid to join forces directly with other unions. The best example I can think of is why didn't the UAW join forces with German unions when Daimler bought out Chrysler.

[JBMcB]

The best example I can think of is why didn't the UAW join forces with German unions when Daimler bought out Chrysler.

In Germany there are two levels of union - the national union and the local worker councils. The national unions are similar to the UAW and set national labor policy. The local worker councils are much more decentralized and independent. This gives them more autonomy and control over their individual labor contracts.

The UAW is dead-set against this model, and rejected proposals to set up a similar situation in German-run factories in the US.

[Meddle]

In my country [[should I ever run one), even mentioning the word 'union' would get you killed, jailed for life or at least deported.

Unions are among the ultimate evils of society. Extorting and blackmailing employers should be outlawed.

[ASilvaman]

In my country [[should I ever run one), even mentioning the word 'union' would get you killed, jailed for life or at least deported.

Unions are among the ultimate evils of society. Extorting and blackmailing employers should be outlawed.

Fortunately you don't have a coumtry. People with murderous tendencies such as yourself should keep disturbing comments internally or amongst like-minded comrades. You and tRump should talk, your minds think alike, both don't seem to give a #uck about people's wellbeing. Yes you are desturbed indeed young man. Unionization bad, killing good?

[Bham1982]

In my country [[should I ever run one), even mentioning the word 'union' would get you killed, jailed for life or at least deported.

Unions are among the ultimate evils of society. Extorting and blackmailing employers should be outlawed.

There are many such countries around the world. Saudi Arabia, China, UAE. Basically terrorist states and third-world dictatorships.

There are also many countries with much stronger unions than the U.S. Sweden, Germany, Austria, Netherlands. Pretty sure I'd rather live in the pro-union countries.

[Wesley Mouch]

There are many such countries around the world. Saudi Arabia, China, UAE. Basically terrorist states and third-world dictatorships.

There are also many countries with much stronger unions than the U.S. Sweden, Germany, Austria, Netherlands. Pretty sure I'd rather live in the pro-union countries.

I reject the idea that its a simple anti vs. pro union world. A lot depends on how you do things. The Germany model that VW wanted to import to the US [[and the UAW rejected) seems like a more collaborative arrangement, rather than the antagonistic approach the USA takes.

It may be that we don't need stronger union laws, but different, wiser laws.

[Meddle]

It may be that we don't need stronger ... laws, but different, wiser laws.

In many, many areas to expand that more generally.

[Cincinnati_Kid]

Unions are being repeatedly voted down in the South. Why would unionizing in other countries outside the US and Canada, be any different ?

[Colombian Dan]

Unions are being repeatedly voted down in the South. Why would unionizing in other countries outside the US and Canada, be any different ?

Well... in areas outside of Europe, Canada and the USA, the conditions are challenging at best. Workers in much of the world, including Colombia have multiple issues regarding the workplace. Land mines, private armed militias, toxic substances, existing laws ignored, etc... If you read "The Jungle" by Upton Sinclair you might have an idea how much of the world works.

[Dumpling]

I'm impressed with how Jimaz got the link to work.

[Jimaz]

I'm impressed with how Jimaz got the link to work.

Don't mention it. But since you did [[for benefit of all): The "Automatically parse links in text" feature here omits trailing periods from URLs even if they're essential. To manually retain them, you can type this:

[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaltrainal_v._Coca-Cola_Co.][u]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaltrainal_v._Coca-Cola_Co.[/u][/url]

[[with autoparse unchecked) to get this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinaltrainal_v._Coca-Cola_Co.

A similar problem occurs when the censorbot here replaces URL text with ellipses. In those cases the URL can be laundered through a service like https://tinyurl.com/ before posting.

[Honky Tonk]

I don't know why that bothers me so much.

[Colombian Dan]

Jeje.. you the man Honky Tonk.. Thanks

[Wesley Mouch]

In many, many areas to expand that more generally.

Yes. But the trick is that laws are written by women and men who are imperfect. So sometimes its also better to reduce the volume of laws, and avoid thinking that the only solution is more intervention in affairs between individuals.

[MizMotown]

Well unions may have gone off track but I'm thankful for one. For one, the majority of upper psychotic management cannot bully me and I make enough for at least the basic needs in life.

[Dumpling]

https://www.theatlantic.com/video/in...ocial-leaders/

[Colombian Dan]

https://www.theatlantic.com/video/in...ocial-leaders/

Thanks Dumpling, I saw this the other day. Unlike Detroit, where shootings/killings are over a Faygo pop or a look at the gas station, people here in Colombia are killed over their beliefs. I was told 2 years ago not to go walking at night because of the "Aguilas Negras" aka The Black Eagles. There are many paramilitary groups, mostly retired police/military and some current, that go around in the cities and in the countryside on "cleaning" missions. Here in Bogota, the homeless and drug addicts are frequent targets along with union organizers. This is why many Colombians want unions from the USA to come here and organize directly. With the cover of US citizens, under a US organization, these paramilitaries would have a much more difficult time. I am a big supporter of the 2nd Amendment, and try to explain and promote self defense to the average Colombian. However, Simon Bolivar was correct, the triple yoke of ignorance, tyranny and vice is too strong in South America...

[Richard]

^ you know exactly what would happen,Dan says let's have unions and try's to organize and the next day nobody would be asking where Dan was because they would already know.

It would be like early days of union head bashing here in the states,I do business in Bogota and partial ownership in taxi services in the outlying small towns,you pay your cut but it is really no difference then here in the states,there is always somebody wanting their cut and it just becomes the cost of doing business.

The problem is in Latin America and other countries,is lack of stability in government as we see in Venezuela,you may be able to establish unions but all it takes is a change of government and it would be back to square one the next day.

It is no different in Mexico,the big corporations pay a stipend in order to do business if they do not the executives or managers are kidnaped and released when the account is cleared.

[aj3647]

In my country [[should I ever run one), even mentioning the word 'union' would get you killed, jailed for life or at least deported.

You would murder people for forming a union? Seek legitimate help.

Unions are being repeatedly voted down in the South. Why would unionizing in other countries outside the US and Canada, be any different ?

Because very few nations on Earth have the type of ultra-conservative political culture found in the American Deep South.

[Colombian Dan]

Richard, I agree Latin American countries are unstable when compared to the USA. Colombia as well as the other Latin American countries, are controlled by a few families within each country. These families control the natural resources, infrastructure and government. Living here gives me great pride in the US Constitution, especially the Bill of Rights. To my surprise it seems much of Latin America more identifies with Europe [[of the 15th century) rather than an independent "American" mindset and culture. British English is taught in the schools. The term "campesino" literally means peasant. For me living here is like a history lesson but in the present moment. I live in barrio Bosa, about the size of Dearborn but with over 650,000 people. Next week I will be travelling with my Colombian partner to Tolima to investigate farm lands for coffee growing. Hopefully I'll make it back.. if not it's been a good run..