Detnews Article On The Changing Face Of Vehicle Markets

**emu steve** · January-05-18, 04:20 AM

Couple of takeaways to start the discussion:

1). Market is moving from the traditional car to trucks and SUVs. Some like those vehicles but I dislike to park next to them in the parking lots.

2). Traditional cars will be increasingly be made in China. Trump wants to bring them back to U.S. [[from Mexico) but he's a little late on that one. China, China, China... or tariff, tariff, tariff.

3). Move toward EV.

RE #1 The big fear here is if something happens to the price of oil and gas. Everyone need a truck? Single persons/childless couple need a SUV? What happens if the price of gas goes up a buck?

Vehicles are so important to the U.S. because they provide transportation, employment, have significant energy and carbon footprint considerations, etc. and even the size of parking spaces in front of your local grocery store.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/bus...rer/109138770/

**Hermod** · January-05-18, 05:27 AM

Te way they are designing cars [[and some crossover SUV) now it gets harder and harder to see out of the back windows when maneuvering in a parking lot. A lot of the cross overs and SUVs still have good rear visibility [[as does the Kia Soul). Older couples and single people often prefer a SUV for these reasons.

**emu steve** · January-05-18, 05:51 AM

Originally Posted by Hermod

Te way they are designing cars [[and some crossover SUV) now it gets harder and harder to see out of the back windows when maneuvering in a parking lot. A lot of the cross overs and SUVs still have good rear visibility [[as does the Kia Soul). Older couples and single people often prefer a SUV for these reasons.

I'm have a car in the Accord/Camry class of vehicles and the view out the back for backing up isn't as good as I'd like.

I was not aware that back window visibility was a plus for SUVs.

**Zacha341** · January-05-18, 07:44 AM

Yes, YES. I suggest anyone purchasing a new car, carefully evaluate what you can see when you get into it. Not just the exterior styling!

The back window styling is increasingly smaller owing to the sloping/ slanting styles you see in sedans. That's fun when you look at models and prototypes but could be a problem real-life, day to day.

SUV's and truck back windows tend to remain fairly vertical giving more visual access. The more slopped the less glass you can 'see' out of. It's getting crazy... Chrysler has really gone nuts with their lack of vision out of the car. On top of that, for example with the Buick Lacross you have tiny stingy rear mirrors! Why?

Sure you have the fancy cameras and all but I between the tall doors and ultra sloping of the windows you're really seeing less.

VW's and other European cars tend to slope their glass less re. their styling but I don't really prefer Japanese or US cars.

Originally Posted by Hermod

Te way they are designing cars [[and some crossover SUV) now it gets harder and harder to see out of the back windows when maneuvering in a parking lot. A lot of the cross overs and SUVs still have good rear visibility [[as does the Kia Soul). Older couples and single people often prefer a SUV for these reasons.

**Zacha341** · January-05-18, 07:52 AM

Initially Camry and Accord [[I've owned both) were late [[thankfully) in submitting to the slanted/ sloped rear window thing.

They still at least give you full rear view mirrors. Not those slanted, stingy ones you get on many GM cars.

Originally Posted by emu steve

I'm have a car in the Accord/Camry class of vehicles and the view out the back for backing up isn't as good as I'd like.

I was not aware that back window visibility was a plus for SUVs.

**Honky Tonk** · January-05-18, 08:42 AM

Originally Posted by emu steve

I was not aware that back window visibility was a plus for SUVs.

It's not. That's why the car camera/LCD/beeper market has gotten so big.

**Meddle** · January-05-18, 08:43 AM

Very few people NEED those vehicles. What kills me is seeing a 5'2" 100lb 20 year old girl climbing down out of the biggest Escalade ever built. It's almost comical.

I drive a '95 Taurus GL Wagon and pull a 4x8 trailer when I need to. I've almost completely rebuilt a house [[OK, slight exaggeration, but not much) and pulled every bit of lumber, drywall, pipe, flooring and most of the roofing with it. I have full visibility in all directions and it fits easily into my garage and every common parking space. It isn't horrible on gas either.

**Honky Tonk** · January-05-18, 08:50 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Initially Camry and Accord [[I've owned both) were late [[thankfully) in submitting to the slanted/ sloped rear window thing.

They still at least give you full rear view mirrors. Not those slanted, stingy ones you get on many GM cars.

Sorry Zacha341, I disagree. The rear window, side and rear view mirrors on my GM product are the best I've ever had, and I've owned Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Ford, Volvo, and Mitsubishi. The view is great, and once they're set, there's never any second guessing, like with my old vehicle. Surprising, considering all the trouble they had with the Hubbell telescope mirrors. That said, the slanted rear window is a BEAR to clean. Damn near impossible unless you're a contortionist Anyone have any rear window cleaning suggestions, I'm interested. The other problem is the body rise where it meets the rear window. It leaves a blind spot, and it's hard to judge distance when backing up.

**401don** · January-05-18, 08:57 AM

All the bland suv's are going to make auto shows obsolete unless you are either in the market for a new vehicle or like to see the exotics. I used to look forward to seeing the new car models each year if it was something I might realistically acquire a few years down the road. The Buick Regal is the only complete redesign of a mainstream car I can think of from the Big 3 this year.

**Zacha341** · January-05-18, 09:04 AM

Well, yes GM does encompass many vehicles -- my bad HT. I meant a few specific items such as the Buick Lacross. I drove one a few tmes and felt I was in a thimble in regards to visibility out of the car.

Yeah I can only imagine what cleaning that rear window from the inside must be! No wonder those detailers charge what they do!!!

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Sorry Zacha341, I disagree. The rear window, side and rear view mirrors on my GM product are the best I've ever had, and I've owned Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Ford, Volvo, and Mitsubishi....

**Zacha341** · January-05-18, 09:08 AM

Some people purchase without thinking and need if often secondary on the show room floor per that the salesperson is pushin'.

I'm fairly tall and now prefer the medium SUV I can just open the door and almost walk into without either 'falling' into, or 'climbing' aboard!

I had alot of tiny hatchbacks and low to the ground sedans in the past but just too uncomfortable now.

Originally Posted by Meddle

Very few people NEED those vehicles. What kills me is seeing a 5'2" 100lb 20 year old girl climbing down out of the biggest Escalade ever built. It's almost comical...

**Honky Tonk** · January-05-18, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Well, yes GM does encompass many vehicles -- my bad HT. I meant a few specific items such as the Buick Lacross. I drove one a few tmes and felt I was in a thimble in regards to visibility out of the car.

Yeah I can only imagine what cleaning that rear window from the inside must be! No wonder those detailers charge what they do!!!

No harm, we handled it like adults..... Buick does make some good looking vehicles, though. I can tell I'm getting older. I keep thinking how great I'd look in one on my way to Bill Knapp's....

**Zacha341** · January-05-18, 09:47 AM

^^^ LOL! Me on the way to my favorite Chinese sit down!

I love that little Buick Verano [[sp?). I'm a CCS grad, so I've seen many concept cars from sketch to digital, to final clay and now 3D model presentation. It's wild to see the ideas out there. Just some are not too practical.

I'm tending more to comfort and being able to see as I get older. There's that issue of getting into and out of a said vehicle with comfort too.

Course my dream car is as old as a mint condition Buick Grand National, and as current as the Audi A8 with the nutso shallow sloped-back window! Yet nice wide rear view rear view mirrors!

**Honky Tonk** · January-05-18, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Course my dream car is as old as a mint condition Buick Grand National, and as current as the Audi A8 with the nutso shallow sloped-back window! Yet nice wide rear view rear view mirrors!

Palled around with a guy who owned a Buick Grand National. I never thought much of it, kinda meh.... Then one Dream Cruise, he talked me into going with him. He was challenged to drag racing by a handful of young whipper-snappers. HOLY MACKEREL! He blew the doors off of each and every one of them, some had very large engines. I didn't realize the Grand Nationals were that quick. I thought of them more as retro eye candy. Audi's are problematic, Zacha341, don't do it.

**Hermod** · January-05-18, 10:52 AM

Young single lady I know fell in love with a Chevy Camaro and "just had to have it". After a year, she traded it in on a SUV. I asked her why and shw said that she couldn's see to back up in the Camaro.

**Jimaz** · January-05-18, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

... That said, the slanted rear window is a BEAR to clean. Damn near impossible unless you're a contortionist Anyone have any rear window cleaning suggestions, I'm interested....

I just recently had to solve this problem myself. The inside of the front windshield was dirty to the point of being unsafe. Reaching my hand into the corners would have surely given me a cramp or worse. So I tied some old dish towels over the head of one of these "picker uppers" to reach deep into the corners. That, and a little Windex did the trick pain free!

The rear view mirror comments above reminded me of an unusual problem in Phoenix. It gets so hot there that it melts the adhesive holding the mirror on the windshield. They just fall off. When it happened to me I looked around to find a lot of other people driving without rear view mirrors too!

**Honky Tonk** · January-05-18, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Jimaz

I just recently had to solve this problem myself. The inside of the front windshield was dirty to the point of being unsafe. Reaching my hand into the corners would have surely given me a cramp or worse. So I tied some old dish towels over the head of one of these "picker uppers" to reach deep into the corners. That, and a little Windex did the trick pain free!

Clever idea, Jimaz! One of those gizmos is available @ the local rummage store. I'll give it a try. Thanx.

**Ray1936** · January-05-18, 12:37 PM

I've had an SUV since 1984. On my yearly trips from home in Las Vegas to Detroit, I sleep in the back very comfortably. Bet you SUV haters never thought of that, did ya?

**Cincinnati_Kid** · January-05-18, 01:32 PM

Reported on the news yesterday, that new vehicle sales are expected to decline drastically this year from last year, when over 17 million were sold. What goes up, must come down.

**313WX** · January-05-18, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

Reported on the news yesterday, that new vehicle sales are expected to decline drastically this year from last year, when over 17 million were sold. What goes up, must come down.

Indeed....

**emu steve** · January-05-18, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

I've had an SUV since 1984. On my yearly trips from home in Las Vegas to Detroit, I sleep in the back very comfortably. Bet you SUV haters never thought of that, did ya?

Yes, I never thought of SUVs as residential vehicles.

**Honky Tonk** · January-05-18, 03:19 PM

Originally Posted by emu steve

Yes, I never thought of SUVs as residential vehicles.

A lot of people live in them in NV. It's a poor mans snowbird home.

**emu steve** · January-05-18, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

A lot of people live in them in NV. It's a poor mans snowbird home.

Never thought of that too. [[lot of things I apparently have never thought).

Just hope someone doesn't post that with drapes it could be a...

**Ray1936** · January-05-18, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

A lot of people live in them in NV. It's a poor mans snowbird home.

Naw, ya just pull into a truck stop, pick a quiet corner, get your coffee, get some zzzs. Morning? Get your coffee again and off ya go. Only way to travel. Before my old dog passed on, he made the trips with me many times. We wuz good company. We both loved each trip. Except when driving through Nebraska. I don't like Nebraska. He only liked it for the pee stops, me too.

**O3H** · January-06-18, 02:42 PM

Note that no Battery Electric Vehicle [[BEV) available currently is profitable.
The intense need for charging infrastructure is immense.
A plug-in hybrid electric vehicle [[PHEV) have about
1/5 battery cost of BEVs & engine, fuel line/tank,
exhaust components still less than extra battery.
Near future will have more all electric drive vehicles on the market.

Sports Car Manufacturers are really great at mastering the
three key components of any electric car
~ weight, aerodynamic drag and rolling resistance ~

Even a vehicle styled like a Pontiac Vibe / Toyota Matrix
can fit an 8ft piece of lumber, have a tow package installed,
and haul quite a bit of cargo with the rear seats folded down.