In the mean time: North Korea....

[Zacha341]

Setting aside Russiagate etc. for a bit, North Korea is becoming a problem to say the least!

North Korea threatens strike on Guam
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/08/politi...ump/index.html

From article:

North Korea's military is "examining the operational plan" to strike areas around the US territory of Guam with medium-to-long-range strategic ballistic missiles, state-run news agency KCNA said early Wednesday local time.

Specifically, the statement mentioned a potential strike on Andersen Air Force Base designed "to send a serious warning signal to the US."

The base is one of two on the Pacific island, which are the closest bases on US soil to North Korea, and represent the westernmost tip of the country's military might.

Key military installation

Dubbed the "tip of the spear," Guam is a key to the US military's forward deployed presence in the Pacific and is home to thousands of American service members and their families.

Its importance has declined since the Second World War, given the creation of military bases in Japan and South Korea, says Carl Schuster, a Hawaii Pacific University professor and former director of operations at the US Pacific Command's Joint Intelligence Center. Now it is essentially a staging area, which sees rotations of bomber groups coming through.

"Guam is the western most US territory that has major military bases. If you [[were to) pull [[the US) out of Japan and South Korea it's the next best location in the Pacific," says Schuster.

While it is around 1,500 miles further out from the Korean peninsula than its next closest base in Japan, it's "still strategic because of its location" and its ability to host long-range bombers.

This Is the Moment of Truth on North Korea
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...ea_134699.html

From article:

The North Korean nuclear threat is a “hinge” moment for the United States and China, and for the new international order both nations say they want.

If Washington and Beijing manage to stay together in dealing with Pyongyang, the door opens on a new era in which China will play a larger and more responsible role in global affairs, commensurate with its economic power. If the great powers can’t cooperate, the door will slam shut — possibly triggering a catastrophic military conflict on the Korean Peninsula.

President Trump’s bullying style, even in dealing with trivial matters of domestic politics, obscures the extent to which he has tried to marry U.S. policy on North Korea with that of China. For the most part, he has been surprisingly successful. Beijing and Washington have mostly been aligned, as in this past weekend’s unanimous U.N. Security Council vote in favor of additional sanctions against Pyongyang to punish its continued missile tests.

Washington’s diplomatic goal, although it hasn’t been stated publicly this way, is to encourage China to interpose itself between the United States and North Korea and organize negotiations to de-nuclearize the Korean Peninsula. The U.S. threat is that if China doesn’t help the United States find such a diplomatic settlement, America will pursue its own solution — by military means if necessary.

Trump amped up the rhetoric Tuesday, telling reporters: “They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen.”....

[Richard]

He was repeating the ankle biters words when he said on his public television channel in his daily proganda speal a few days ago.

If the west does this bla bla bla then they will be met with fire and fury etc.

Maybe he is mad now because Mr Obama is not around anymore to pat him on the head and tell him what a good little dictator he is,I think Cali or Japan,being a pawn for China,is his target,he could care less about what anybody thinks , his people only know what he tells them and really have nothing to lose.

[Honky Tonk]

Maybe he is mad now because Mr Obama is not around anymore to pat him on the head and tell him what a good little dictator he is,I think Cali or Japan,being a pawn for China,is his target,he could care less about what anybody thinks , his people only know what he tells them and really have nothing to lose.

Your post got me thinking about a story I heard on NPR the other day. This is good insight on how the Chinese propaganda machine works, and how the Chinese people respond to it.

http://www.npr.org/2017/08/09/542234...pop-propaganda

[aj3647]

He was repeating the ankle biters words when he said on his public television channel in his daily proganda speal a few days ago.

If the west does this bla bla bla then they will be met with fire and fury etc.

Maybe he is mad now because Mr Obama is not around anymore to pat him on the head and tell him what a good little dictator he is,I think Cali or Japan,being a pawn for China,is his target,he could care less about what anybody thinks , his people only know what he tells them and really have nothing to lose.

Other than bellicose rhetoric, what is Trump doing?

North Korea has carried out 14 missile tests so far in 2017. During the entire 8 years of Obama's Presidency, they only carried out 12 missile tests. They have literally fired more missiles in the first 8 months of Trump's Presidency than they did in the entire 8 years under Obama.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._missile_tests

But yeah, they must be really scared of Trump! Trump's really showing them who's boss! Maybe he'll tweet something mean about Kim Jong Un and call him "fat", that'll get him!

[GMan]

But yeah, they must be really scared of Trump! Trump's really showing them who's boss! Maybe he'll tweet something mean about Kim Jong Un an call him "fat", that'll get him!

Trump should tweet "Nice Haircut" Nyuck Nyuck Nyuk.

[Honky Tonk]

Trump should tweet "Nice Haircut" Nyuck Nyuck Nyuk.

That would be the kettle calling the pot black. [[no racist slur intended)

[Richard]

Other than bellicose rhetoric, what is Trump doing?

North Korea has carried out 14 missile tests so far in 2017. During the entire 8 years of Obama's Presidency, they only carried out 12 missile tests. They have literally fired more missiles in the first 8 months of Trump's Presidency than they did in the entire 8 years under Obama.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._missile_tests

But yeah, they must be really scared of Trump! Trump's really showing them who's boss! Maybe he'll tweet something mean about Kim Jong Un and call him "fat", that'll get him!

Stands to reason that as one progresses more tests would incur,he had eight years to get to this point,when it was blantly clear where it was headed.

I am pretty sure,at the time,the intelligence agencies either said that he was not a problem or it would be some time before he was.

To me,when he first started knocking off his relatives in power,that was when he made it clear of his intentions.

He has no second thought about killing relatives why would he have a second thought about nuking Americans,well other then his supporters in this country who actually think that they will be spared.

He should have been spanked along time ago,it is to late now.

[aj3647]

He has no second thought about killing relatives why would he have a second thought about nuking Americans,

Mutually Assured Destruction. Kim Jong Un probably wants to stay alive and not die in a nuclear counterstrike as much as the next man.

well other then his supporters in this country who actually think that they will be spared.

Who are his supporters in this country?

If the west does this bla bla bla then they will be met with fire and fury etc.

So when Kim says it, it's propaganda. When Trump says literally the exact same thing, it's not? Kind of sounds like Trump and Kim are cut from the same cloth. Teddy Roosevelt's foreign policy was summed up as "speak softly and carry a big stick." Trump does the exact opposite. He speaks loudly and that's it [[probably can't carry a big stick due to his tiny hands). Kim Jong Un is an unimpressed by Trump's threats as you are by his.

[Richard]

It is called saber rattling and President Trump did not invent it.

He represents socialism in its worst form,and yes if you are an American living in America supporting socialism then you are also supporting him.

Because there is no picking and choosing in socialism,either you follow the rules or you die,actually pretty simple concept.

Kim could care less about living through a nuclear attack,because he would go down in history for 100s of years to come as the one who had the balls to nuke mainland America on thier soil.

Think how many countries he would be a martyr in after launching an attack on the capitalist pigs.

You are trying to throw rational into the frey when he is anything but,funny how some feel he is rational but thier own president is not.

[aj3647]

He represents socialism in its worst form,and yes if you are an American living in America supporting socialism then you are also supporting him.

I'll ask again, who is supporting Kim Jong Un here? Can't seem to ever get a straight answer out of you, on anything, ever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

[ABetterDetroit]

So... would it be out of line to ask what in the hell the end game plan is this time around before it starts?

Assuming the purpose of this war is to prevent nuclear war let's say for the sake of argument that goal is achieved through military victory.

Then what?

Hopefully not another occupation by Americans in a country full of guns and explosives and 10s of millions of pissed off people where everyone knows everybody and speaks the language except us. Anybody else stepping to the plate saying they have that covered? Some other idea perhaps?

[Jimaz]

...Then what?

Hopefully not another occupation by Americans in a country full of guns and explosives and 10s of millions of pissed off people where everyone knows everybody and speaks the language except us. Anybody else stepping to the plate saying they have that covered? Some other idea perhaps?

NOTSteve's always eager to step up to the plate when easy & simply solutions are required!

♪That's the way we can get things done & that's how i do it.♪
♪It's easy & simple cuz you know what to do.♪

10 characters

[Richard]

I'll ask again, who is supporting Kim Jong Un here? Can't seem to ever get a straight answer out of you, on anything, ever.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

You are starting to be like the other one,I gave you my answer in my reply,you are just choosing not to except it.

The time has actually come where you and others need to decide where your loyalties lie,they have a saying,lead,follow or get out of the way.

[Richard]

So... would it be out of line to ask what in the hell the end game plan is this time around before it starts?

Assuming the purpose of this war is to prevent nuclear war let's say for the sake of argument that goal is achieved through military victory.

Then what?

Hopefully not another occupation by Americans in a country full of guns and explosives and 10s of millions of pissed off people where everyone knows everybody and speaks the language except us. Anybody else stepping to the plate saying they have that covered? Some other idea perhaps?

It already started,end game and use of nukes is speculation.

Russia has already built up troops on the east,China is after India,and Kim is after a US statement and a trigger pawn.

Crimea has been battling Russian separatists for over three years,but Russia has stockpiled troops and weapons on the border.All we need to do is supply the Crimean people with weapons they are all ready.

Russia has stockpiled troops and weapons on the polish border,the UN is there with a multinational force on maneuvers.

Eastern front is covered short term.

China comes in on India and Japan ,hopefully they will concentrate there instead of helping Korea.

Our force is spread out across the world but also has the ability to mobilize allies from a central location.

Our west coast has a missile defense system combination of land based,ships and aircraft.Drone related stuff was already moved away from there,it still gives them a 30% chance if they strike first and with multiple missiles.Which Kim does not have unless China slips a few over the border.

The end game for the majority of the big players is the same as always,the spread of communism and socialism.

The elephant in the room becomes the Middle East if we and the UN are distracted elsewhere then there are a few countries that will try and take advantage of it.

Isreal and our other allies there can keep a lid on that aspect short term.

There was a reason President Trump was pushing allies to beef up thier military commitments,this stuff started 3 years ago and had nothing to do with Trump but yet everybody was quick to jump on him and while they were doing that somebody else was preparing to climb up thier rear end while they were distracted.

End game in Korea is to eliminate the 38th parallel and those who choose the socialist lifestyle can migrate to China.The Koreans can run that country like they have and we have already had a prolonged presence there so not much difference anyways.

Which leaves the Philippines,they are kinda like Italy was during WW2 they are going to flip to whatever winning side is currently to suit there needs.

We have been pumping millions into their military to build it up and they have also been buying bulk equipment from France and Israel,we still have a presence there also if not an iffy one.

As far as nuke use ? Maybe India if they feel that they are being overrun,China,Russia,the United States and allies all have huge amounts of conventional warfare equipment so no need there because it renders useless land so really no point.

Kim if we allow him to continue,Pakistan our allies if they feel overwhelmed.

That is the jist of it and worse case scenario of everything that is already in position.

Do we need to freak out stateside? Not yet if we do not become complacent,and like I said this stuff was already in play years ago,nobody woke up and said hey let's do this now that Trump is in office,it was going to happen already.


Personal wise in the event if something happens here just follow the 15 day hurricane plan,stockpile food,water,some cash to cover 30 days expenses,extra meds. That is not being paranoid that is what one does in case of a natural disaster.It takes on the adverage of 15 days for emergency relief to mobilize.

Then go back to worrying about the Russians hacking the election.

A lot of Americans are going to have to take a good hard look at where they stand when it comes to supporting this country and its values.

[TKshreve]

It already started,end game and use of nukes is speculation.......
...... to supporting this country and its values.

Holy Robin's Batman. Have you been playing too much Risk, or Axis and Allies lately?

[Richard]

Lol no I used to play AOE but that was before most people's time.

President Trump made his first European stop in Poland,this was why.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wS3DROvygAw

China is after India because they will not let them cut a road that will cut off thier northern territories.

It is all just triggers and all it takes is one.

During the start WW2 Germany was not going to bomb civilians,until one night,on a bombing mission one of the bombers went off course and bombed Coventry killing thousands of civilians,England retaliated and after that Coventry was bombed day and night for four days straight.

The rest is history.

All it took was a crew of 5 to be off course one time and the mass destruction of cities and civilians became the standard.

[noise]

You are starting to be like the other one,I gave you my answer in my reply,you are just choosing not to except it.

The time has actually come where you and others need to decide where your loyalties lie,they have a saying,lead,follow or get out of the way.

*accept.

This is ironic given your completely misplaced and traitorous loyalties.

[Richard]

*accept.

This is ironic given your completely misplaced and traitorous loyalties.

Well according to you,anybody that agrees with President Trump is considered a traitor anyways,so in that perspective then okay I am a traitor in your eyes.

Which matters to me about as much as the sex life of an indigent flea.

[Ray1936]

If push comes to shove, the NK government can be wiped out with conventional weapons in a day or two. No need for nukes.

[Jimaz]

Listen to this applause in support for Guam:

Stephen Doesn't Want The Earth To Blow Up.

[Maof]

"i would like to denuke the world".

[Zacha341]

President Trumps "fire and fury" response could've been more strategically tempered. The best retort to a threat is NEVER showing your 'complete' hand. Maybe a paperback of Sun Tsu, Art of War might in order, hand delivered! Or a DVD of Godfather 1, 2, and 3. Never let an enemy know everything on your mind... For example 0:17 ......

Setting aside Trump's un-parced comments, let's not forget what he was responding to. Some of our millennials have jettisoned an appreciation of boring history, but those of us over say 40? Eh, well.

The Korean conflict didn't start last week, or when Trump took office, but in 1950. My father faught in the first joyful round [[Army); that war leaving behind a divided pennusula. Families split for decades. Korea presents clear evidence in stark contrast two types of governance, resultant industry and options [[and lack thereof) for a people: enduring in one side, thriving the other. Kia's aren't made in North Korea.

Locally we've many local Korean merchants - some immigrated years back, whom I'm certain can detail life under a dictator - fullout. Many came here escaping that - leaving family behind. Trump's response was extreme in parts, but Jong Un's not simply suggesting a new hair cut for Trump. This is bigger than the Donald! Surpringly, former VP Gore had this to say:

"The former VP says “his [Trump] intemperate comments on North Korea were really unwise,” but reasons, “I think it’s only fair to point out he inherited this crisis. The previous three presidents were not able to find an adequate solution [to the North Korea crisis], so he can’t be blamed for all this.” http://www.newsweek.com/al-gore-inco...-crisis-649880

Uh, yep. The can of Korea was kicked for decades [[most recently by appeasement ala the Bushes; Clinton, Obama two terms etc.) and now we have a craven dictator no longer interested in mumbly peg or cans.

[Honky Tonk]

and now we have a craven dictator no longer interested in mumbly peg or cans.

And they have a nuclear warhead and a missile capable of delivering it.

[Richard]

If push comes to shove, the NK government can be wiped out with conventional weapons in a day or two. No need for nukes.

That all day long ^ Even with what accets we have in the region.


Now,reportedly China is saying if Kim makes the first move then they will not help them but if we make the first move they will.

But yet they have also told India if they do not remove the bulldozers then it will be war over there.As India is our allies.

70% of the Korean Kim's trade comes from China,there are you tube videos of the residents or subjects eating grass for food.

It is also coming up on thier harvest season,if it goes to war they are out of food on the onset,they are not prepared to engage economic wise with out China's help.

[oladub]

China played that very well knowing that the US doesn't want WWIII with China and that N. Korea doesn't want to get pulverized without Chinese assistance. Even if Kim gets crazy, lucky and manages to take out a few US population centers thereby destroying the US economy before being flattened in retaliation, its still a win for China.