Interesting: "Placeholder" Skateboard Park On Monroe Block

[emu steve]

http://www.freep.com/story/entertain...ock/493193001/

Interesting concept.

[SpartanDawg]

In an article talking about installing a new skate park on the Monroe Block, Crains casually dropped this line:

Monroe Blocks, bounded by Randolph Street, Bates Street, Cadillac Square and Monroe Avenue, will be home to a mixed-use development with retail, residential and office space. The installation will stay open until construction on Monroe Blocks breaks ground around January — but Wayfinding's mobile design means it could move to another location afterward.

Some people speculated when the bill passed allowing for tax captures on transformational projects that hudson would break ground this year, thus using his 2017 allotment for this bill... and monroe would break ground in 2018 allowing 2018's allotment to be used for that [[remember you can only use this bill on one project per year)

Seems we might be on track for that!!

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article..._medium=social

[emu steve]

BTW, connecting some 'dots'.

According to this article, ground is expected to be broken there Jan. 2018 for the development there.

And isn't the Hudson's site supposed to break ground Dec. 2017?

If so, two key projects two blocks away will be 'shovels in the ground' within say 6 months or so.

Downtown is being rebuilt block by block...

[EGrant]

Really cool! Both the park and the construction news.

[SpartanDawg]

woops.. you guys can delete my thread i didn't see this

here's a copy paste from mine

in an article talking about installing a new skate park on the monroe block, crains casually dropped this line:

Monroe Blocks, bounded by Randolph Street, Bates Street, Cadillac Square and Monroe Avenue, will be home to a mixed-use development with retail, residential and office space. The installation will stay open until construction on Monroe Blocks breaks ground around January — but Wayfinding's mobile design means it could move to another location afterward.




Some people speculated when the bill passed allowing for tax captures on transformational projects that hudson would break ground this year, thus using his 2017 allotment for this bill... and monroe would break ground in 2018 allowing 2018's allotment to be used for that [[remember you can only use this bill on one project per year)

Seems we might be on track for that!!




EDIT: free press seems to confirm it http://www.freep.com/story/entertainment/2017/07/20/tony-hawk-skatepark-downtown-detroit-bedrock/493193001/

"Wayfinding will be a placeholder until Bedrock’s massive Monroe Block development breaks ground in the area, which is expected in January 2018. At that point, the modular design of the park will allow it to be moved to another part of the city. "

[southen]

It they plan on breaking ground in January hopefully we will see some finalized renderings before then. What was released before was cool but I believe conceptual to help pass the legislation. I'd like to see some more fleshed out plans that hopefully are grander and go beyond 20 stories. Gilbert keeps talking about how much more class A space will be needed in the coming years, surely that warrants something larger than what was proposed.

[Junjie]

It they plan on breaking ground in January hopefully we will see some finalized renderings before then. What was released before was cool but I believe conceptual to help pass the legislation. I'd like to see some more fleshed out plans that hopefully are grander and go beyond 20 stories. Gilbert keeps talking about how much more class A space will be needed in the coming years, surely that warrants something larger than what was proposed.

Agree that I'd like to see something more "marquee" right on Campus Martius, but on the other hand it might be better to spread the demand out, so to speak. I think I'd rather see ten empty lots filled with fifteen story buildings rather than see five lots filled with thirty story buildings. [[Obviously the real estate market isn't that simple, but in general.) I also look forward to the final designs and hope we get something a bit more striking even if not a lot taller.

[southen]

Agree that I'd like to see something more "marquee" right on Campus Martius, but on the other hand it might be better to spread the demand out, so to speak. I think I'd rather see ten empty lots filled with fifteen story buildings rather than see five lots filled with thirty story buildings. [[Obviously the real estate market isn't that simple, but in general.) I also look forward to the final designs and hope we get something a bit more striking even if not a lot taller.

For the most part I tend to agree with you, but for certain parcels of land like Hudson's and Monroe, I think we need to aim higher... literally.

If the demand is there go big. I would love something 800'+ with some sort of observation space.

[EGrant]

For the most part I tend to agree with you, but for certain parcels of land like Hudson's and Monroe, I think we need to aim higher... literally.

If the demand is there go big. I would love something 800'+ with some sort of observation space.

It would be amazing to have Campus Martius surrounded by a wall of buildings. Really would give you the impression of being submersed in the city.

[313WX]

The bigger story to me is that we have an offical groundbreaking date for the Monroe Block high-rises.

Bring it! Detroit's finally going vertical like other cities.

[313WX]

It they plan on breaking ground in January hopefully we will see some finalized renderings before then. What was released before was cool but I believe conceptual to help pass the legislation. I'd like to see some more fleshed out plans that hopefully are grander and go beyond 20 stories. Gilbert keeps talking about how much more class A space will be needed in the coming years, surely that warrants something larger than what was proposed.

Floor count isn't everything.

It's possible to have a 20 story building that's 300+ feet [[which is pretty impressive from the ground level), for example. If the renderings are any sign, this one may even go as high as 400 feet [[Cadillac Tower is 438 ft).

BTW, I thought the official proposed floor count was 22 floors?

I want to focus on infill though. If we can fill downtown with a bunch of 15-35 story buildings, that's a bigger win in my book than some dick-measuring supertall skyscraper. There's really no difference between a 15-story and 800 foot build from the ground level any way.

[ABetterDetroit]

Cut the millage rate 40% and all you guys will get what your looking for and fast. High rise, low rise, and infill. All of it in short order.

Neighborhoods will get the biggest shot in the arm they have ever had in most of our lifetimes.

Growth, real growth. Not just one building a year garbage.

Then finally a diversified growing economy that would have a fighting chance in a economic downturn.

Schools with actual hope of improvement instead of smoke and mirrors.

[emu steve]

Cut the millage rate 40% and all you guys will get what your looking for and fast. High rise, low rise, and infill. All of it in short order.

Neighborhoods will get the biggest shot in the arm they have ever had in most of our lifetimes.

Growth, real growth. Not just one building a year garbage.

Then finally a diversified growing economy that would have a fighting chance in a economic downturn.

Schools with actual hope of improvement instead of smoke and mirrors.

I completely disagree with that approach.

Some think that a city can grow by cutting taxes, spending, etc. That is usually signs of a city [[or state) in decline. At the state level both Louisiana and Kansas tried it and both were miserable failures.

Folks aren't going to move from Southfield because taxes in Detroit were cut, but rather Detroit, to them, is a better place to live.

I assume that with the financial crisis and bankruptcy that the city has a budget, workforce, etc. which is fiscally responsible.

What I learned from D.C., as a case study of sorts, is:

1). The city needs to clean its act up. Financially responsible, lower crime rate, better police, fire, EMS, better lighting, better roads, schools, etc. etc.

2). Once that happens residents will move to solid existing neighborhoods or new neighborhoods will develop based on some factor, e.g., location near another neighborhood which is revitalizing. Neighborhoods which develop amenities will grow first [[this is the story today of downtown and Midtown. Amenities, amenities, amenities). In D.C. 'Capitol Hill' neighborhood used to be the blocks closest to the Capitol. Later it extended out further and further and now it could take a person 20 minutes to walk to the Capitol from the edge of 'Capitol Hill' neighborhood. In Detroit, Midtown, Brush Park, etc. could expand further and further [[west or east, as appropriate) from Woodward

3). Someone needs to pay the taxes. Need big commercial landowners like Gilbert to pay taxes which support the ENTIRE city. Gilbert can pay taxes for a downtown building and those taxes can be used to plow streets, fix street lights, etc. even in desolate parts of the city. If Gilbert [[and Gilbert-Gores) build the Hudson site + fail jail site that is a nice boost to the tax base [[2B?). Baby boomers may remember what effect the Ford Rouge plant had on the city of Dearborn finances. That plant paid tons of taxes to support schools, etc. and kept property taxes low.

4). City needs as much private sector employment as it can. In Detroit that seems to be more concentrated in several areas [[e.g., downtown, Midtown, New Center/HFH, etc.). Workers will then decide where they want to live. It could be any of Detroit's neighborhoods or a suburb. Taxes might be a consideration, but it would be one of many.

5). Need to get folks to want to visit the city. Tourists will only come if there are major attractions, usually downtown. My favorite is sports. Comerica Park and LCA will attract over 5M patrons over a 12 month period. LCA could attract 3M [[say 2.75 - 3.25M) patrons from Sept 1 through Aug 31 [['18). Say 150 dates x 20K = 3M. Red Wings + Pistons = 100 dates.

6). City needs to do what it can to help neighborhoods but quite frankly neighborhoods are composed of thousands of housing units and thousands of people. Gilbert can't save a neighborhood of 500 or 1,000 single family homes from further decline. I assume the mayor is doing all that a city can do to help distressed neighborhoods.

[ABetterDetroit]

I completely disagree with that approach.

Some think that a city can grow by cutting taxes, spending, etc. That is usually signs of a city [[or state) in decline. At the state level both Louisiana and Kansas tried it and both were miserable failures.

Folks aren't going to move from Southfield because taxes in Detroit were cut, but rather Detroit, to them, is a better place to live.

I assume that with the financial crisis and bankruptcy that the city has a budget, workforce, etc. which is fiscally responsible.

What I learned from D.C., as a case study of sorts, is:

1). The city needs to clean its act up. Financially responsible, lower crime rate, better police, fire, EMS, better lighting, better roads, better DMV, schools, etc. etc.

2). Once that happens residents will move to solid existing neighborhoods or new neighborhoods will develop based on some factor, e.g., location near another neighborhood which is revitalizing. Neighborhoods which develop amenities will grow first [[this is the story today of downtown and Midtown. Amenities, amenities, amenities). In D.C. 'Capitol Hill' neighborhood used to be the blocks closest to the Capitol. Later it extended out further and further and now it could take a person 20 minutes to walk to the Capitol from the edge of 'Capitol Hill' neighborhood. In Detroit, Midtown, Brush Park, etc. could expand further and further [[west or east, as appropriate) from Woodward

3). Someone needs to pay the taxes. Need big commercial landowners like Gilbert to pay taxes which support the ENTIRE city. Gilbert can pay taxes for a downtown building and those taxes can be used to plow streets, fix street lights, etc. even in desolate parts of the city. If Gilbert [[and Gilbert-Gores) build the Hudson site + fail jail site that is a nice boost to the tax base [[2B?). Baby boomers may remember what effect the Ford Rouge plant had on the city of Dearborn finances. That plant paid tons of taxes to support schools, etc. and kept property taxes low.

4). City needs as much private sector employment as it can. In Detroit that seems to be more concentrated in several areas [[e.g., downtown, Midtown, New Center/HFH, etc.). Workers will then decide where they want to live. It could be any of Detroit's neighborhoods or a suburb. Taxes might be a consideration, but it would be one of many.

5). Need to get folks to want to visit the city. Tourists will only come if there are major attractions, usually downtown. My favorite is sports. Comerica Park and LCA will attract over 5M patrons over a 12 month period. LCA could attract 3M [[say 2.75 - 3.25M) patrons from Sept 1 through Aug 31 [['18). Say 150 dates x 20K = 3M. Red Wings + Pistons = 100 dates.

6). City needs to do what it can to help neighborhoods but quite frankly neighborhoods are composed of thousands of housing units and thousands of people. Gilbert can't save a neighborhood of 500 or 1,000 single family homes from further decline. I assume the mayor is doing all that a city can do to help distressed neighborhoods.

D.C.???

D.C. is doing well, building stuff, more jobs etc?

You make my point exactly. The property taxes in D.C. are a mere fraction of what they are in Detroit. A pittance in comparison. One of the lowest in the country [[D.C.) for a city to the highest [[Detroit)

https://smartasset.com/taxes/distric...tax-calculator

[emu steve]

This stuff is hard to calculate.

As folks know, property tax = assessed value x tax rate.

It might surprise folks, but the population of D.C. and Detroit are very similar.

A house which sells for say $100K in Detroit might go for $500 - 750K in D.C. and the housing stock in D.C. is downright awesome.

I'd bet D.C. collects 10 times more property taxes from housing than Detroit does.

The problem in Detroit is that assessed values are so low so tax rates have to be high.

If assessed values would increase 50% in 10 years than tax rates could go down say 25% and the city of Detroit would be in decent shape tax revenue rise.