The Big Fat Compendium Of Russiagate Debunkery

[Pam]

From the Real News:

Why is a Russian Troll Farm Being Compared to 9/11?

https://youtu.be/SJ49XNEIHdY

https://youtu.be/Ojr4d_h3SlU

[aj3647]

Yes, I think that Russia, Israel, China, Britain, and other countries probably tried to influence our election just like the US tries to influence and interfere with other countries' elections. Why wouldn't they? Former Obama campaign aides sided with and advised Canada's NDP and Liberal partiy campaigns. I find it incredibly hypocritical for any faction in the U.S. to pretend otherwise. Instead of mounting a coup, Democrats and establishment Republicans should be shoring up internet security for starters although taking responsibility for anything is difficult for losers. That's one reason they are losers.

"The U.S. has a long history of attempting to influence presidential elections in other countries – it's done so as many as 81 times between 1946 and 2000, according to a database amassed by political scientist Dov Levin of Carnegie Mellon University." -LA Times 12/21/16

So far, known liar Robert Swan Mueller III has produced pitiful little results unless his point is that our intelligence agencies with their $75B annual budget got boxed around by 13 Russians with a pitifully small budget. His case is based in large part on a British [[foreign) source financed by Hillary's campaign. There is an elephant in the room and Mueller let it in. We have more than 13 illegal dreamers protesting to influence US immigration policy. Democrats are fine with that having even brought that foreign elephant in as guests at the State of the Union speech. Democrats are fine with 11, or is it 35 million, illegal aliens violating laws, taking jobs, and stretching our social services but act horrified about 13 Russians doing what our own government does.

A list of countries the US has overthrown or tried to overthrow since WWII [[not just influenced).

Holy shit, I almost drowned under an avalanche of red herrings and Whataboutism in that post. Even though I specifically challenged you to not do that. Literally going all the way back to the 1950's to find stuff to justify Russians violating our election laws. Would you bend over backwards like that to justify Chinese or North Korean espionage in the United States? Or is your logical gymnastics merely restricted to defending Russian crimes?

[oladub]

Holy shit, I almost drowned under an avalanche of red herrings and Whataboutism in that post. Even though I specifically challenged you to not do that. Literally going all the way back to the 1950's to find stuff to justify Russians violating our election laws. Would you bend over backwards like that to justify Chinese or North Korean espionage in the United States? Or is your logical gymnastics merely restricted to defending Russian crimes?

aj, Who are you, the Grand Inquisitor? Some of us do see obvious foreign influences trying to alter the results of US elections [[e.g. the Hillary campaign paying for dirt on Trump from a foreign source) and the craven hypocrisy of the left's promulgation of the deep state influencing other countries' elections and overthrowing governments and consider such things highly relevant. I didn't justify foreign interference in our election. I did suggest that the left put on its big boy shoes and take responsibility for beefing up our own computer security, even Hillary's, and not being so hypocritical. If you don't like my take: too bad. Since you brought North Korea into the conversation up to make your point that I wasn't observing your rules, I will bring up Libya. Libya did eliminate its nuke program to satisfy the international community. Having done so, Obama killed Khadafi. Maybe Kim noticed. Neo-McCarthyism is dangerous. Fueling a renewal of the cold war instead of negotiating peace is expensive and potentially catastrophic. I proudly, and without apology, prefer detente to cold wars.

[aj3647]

aj, Who are you, the Grand Inquisitor? Some of us do see obvious foreign influences trying to alter the results of US elections [[e.g. the Hillary campaign paying for dirt on Trump from a foreign source) and the craven hypocrisy of the left's promulgation of the deep state influencing other countries' elections and overthrowing governments and consider such things highly relevant. I didn't justify foreign interference in our election.

Yes oladub, you've made it abundantly clear that you believe that because America has spied or engaged in surveillance or espionage in foreign countries, that other countries are justified in doing it to us [[i.e. the Russians). I'm just curious if that same logic extends to non-Russian countries, like China and North Korea for example. Both countries regularly engage in espionage against us, to include hacking our computer systems and stealing technological secrets. Do you believe those actions are justified? Will you defend them? Should we turn a blind eye to them? Should we not prosecute and punish those who are caught spying for the Chinese or committing espionage? Yes or no?

I'm pretty sure if Americans violated Russian laws in Russia, the Russians would do something about it, so I'm not sure the "We do it too, two wrongs make a right" argument you're tossing about really justifies deliberate inaction or turning a blind eye in the face of deliberate Russian interference in our elections.

I would point out that Donald Trump STILL has yet to enact punitive sanctions against Russia as a consequence for their interference in the 2016 election, even though those sanctions are mandated by a law that received a 517 to 5 vote in Congress [[i.e. 97% approval by Congress). Even though Trump admitted last week that Russia interfered in our election. Even though Trump heavily criticized Obama this week for not doing ENOUGH to punish the Russians. Even though just two weeks ago, Russian mercenaries in Syria attacked the U.S. military. When the rubber meets the road, Trump protects Putin. Strange.

[aj3647]

Meanwhile, this week in "the Big Ol' Nothingburger", Donald Trump's former Deputy Campaign Manager Rick Gates is pleading guilty in federal court to felony charges as I type this.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...921_story.html

He has agreed to plead guilty to two felony charges as part of a plea deal he struck with Robert Mueller, wherein Rick Gates will turn state's evidence and become a "cooperating witness" in the Russia probe.

Gates, as deputy Campaign Manager, oversaw the day-to-day operations of Donald Trump's Presidential campaign for months. Robert Mueller almost certainly would not have cut a deal with Gates unless Gates could provide substantiating evidence of criminal activity on the part of others.

This comes on the heels of Robert Mueller amending his indictment of Gates and Paul Manafort in court yesterday, adding an additional whopping 32 felony charges against the two men, in addition to the 12 felony charges previously filed. I guess we know now why Gates flipped.

Finally, this all comes on the heels of news that earlier this week, Mueller secured yet another guilty plea, this time from London-based lawyer Alex Van Der Zwaan. Van Der Zwaan lied to the FBI about his communications with Manafort and Gates and destroyed emails to cover his tracks. Why does that matter? Van Der Zwaan is small potatoes...except for one somewhat interesting fact. He's the son-in-law of German Khan, a powerful Russian billionaire oligarch with close ties to Vladmir Putin. German Khan is also one of the primary owners of Russian banking-investment conglomerate, Alfa-Bank. You might remember the name Alfa-Bank, they made the news last year when it was revealed that the FBI had investigated "suspicious" communications between Alfa-Bank computer servers in Russia and Trump Organization computer servers in the summer of 2016. The nature of these communications was never explained.

Anyways, now that Gates is spilling his guts to Mueller as of today, things should start to really heat up. The key thing to watch for is if Paul Manafort cuts a deal and turns state's evidence. If THAT happens, then it's Code Brown time at the White House.

[TKshreve]

Meanwhile, this week in "the Big Ol' Nothingburger", Donald Trump's former Deputy Campaign Manager Rick Gates is pleading guilty in federal court to felony charges as I type this.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...921_story.html

He has agreed to plead guilty to two felony charges as part of a plea deal he struck with Robert Mueller, wherein Rick Gates will turn state's evidence and become a "cooperating witness" in the Russia probe.

Gates, as deputy Campaign Manager, oversaw the day-to-day operations of Donald Trump's Presidential campaign for months. Robert Mueller almost certainly would not have cut a deal with Gates unless Gates could provide substantiating evidence of criminal activity on the part of others.

This comes on the heels of Robert Mueller amending his indictment of Gates and Paul Manafort in court yesterday, adding an additional whopping 32 felony charges against the two men, in addition to the 12 felony charges previously filed. I guess we know now why Gates flipped.

Finally, this all comes on the heels of news that earlier this week, Mueller secured yet another guilty plea, this time from London-based lawyer Alex Van Der Zwaan. Van Der Zwaan lied to the FBI about his communications with Manafort and Gates and destroyed emails to cover his tracks. Why does that matter? Van Der Zwaan is small potatoes...except for one somewhat interesting fact. He's the son-in-law of German Khan, a powerful Russian billionaire oligarch with close ties to Vladmir Putin. German Khan is also one of the primary owners of Russian banking-investment conglomerate, Alfa-Bank. You might remember the name Alfa-Bank, they made the news last year when it was revealed that the FBI had investigated "suspicious" communications between Alfa-Bank computer servers in Russia and Trump Organization computer servers in the summer of 2016. The nature of these communications was never explained.

Anyways, now that Gates is spilling his guts to Mueller as of today, things should start to really heat up. The key thing to watch for is if Paul Manafort cuts a deal and turns state's evidence. If THAT happens, then it's Code Brown time at the White House.

Bwahahahaha. I don't even know why you try, AJ. Your thought process directly falls in line with your prose. You don't beat around the bush, and ask very simple and direct questions which remain pertinent to the topic at hand. In return your get obfuscation, whattaboutism, tired talking points and [[yup, you called it) red herrings galore. The more nothing-burger links and "butter emails" comments you receive in return only reeks of an uncomfortable seat your detractors here sit in, as they squirm to redesign the facts and point fingers in every direction but the one this thread is dedicated to. I appreciate the steadfast line you take, while displaying utmost patience as words, thoughts and facts are twisted before our eyes.

Thanks for the dedication. Looking forward to "The Big Reveal" when Mueller opens the cupboard to show us all what Daddy Donny has really been up to. And we'll need your expert rebuttal once again [[more so than ever) when his defenders are once again here spinning and spitting the same old yarn and sap we get to enjoy everyday. Go get em!

As a side note, anyone who relies on the talking point of: "there has been no collusion found" is certainly being willfully ignorant of how an FBI investigation really proceeds. Not worth your efforts IMO. Cheers!!!

[TKshreve]

Butter Emails!!!

[Honky Tonk]

As a side note, anyone who relies on the talking point of: "there has been no collusion found" is certainly being willfully ignorant of how an FBI investigation really proceeds.

We saw good evidence of that with the Parkland shooter.

[TKshreve]

We saw good evidence of that with the Parkland shooter.

Really feeling the apples and the oranges on that one, HT.

[Honky Tonk]

Really feeling the apples and the oranges on that one, HT.

That earns you today's Butterball award....

[Richard]

Bwahahahaha. I don't even know why you try, AJ. Your thought process directly falls in line with your prose. You don't beat around the bush, and ask very simple and direct questions which remain pertinent to the topic at hand. In return your get obfuscation, whattaboutism, tired talking points and [[yup, you called it) red herrings galore. The more nothing-burger links and "butter emails" comments you receive in return only reeks of an uncomfortable seat your detractors here sit in, as they squirm to redesign the facts and point fingers in every direction but the one this thread is dedicated to. I appreciate the steadfast line you take, while displaying utmost patience as words, thoughts and facts are twisted before our eyes.

Thanks for the dedication. Looking forward to "The Big Reveal" when Mueller opens the cupboard to show us all what Daddy Donny has really been up to. And we'll need your expert rebuttal once again [[more so than ever) when his defenders are once again here spinning and spitting the same old yarn and sap we get to enjoy everyday. Go get em!

As a side note, anyone who relies on the talking point of: "there has been no collusion found" is certainly being willfully ignorant of how an FBI investigation really proceeds. Not worth your efforts IMO. Cheers!!!

You clearly do not understand about how an FBI investigation works either,totally irrelevant as they have also many times stated no evidence of collusion found.

What do they have to do ,come personally knock on your door and tell it to your face.

No wonder you are applauding AJ you both are standing there with your fingers in your ears going bla blah blah refusing to except the truth.

[TKshreve]

That earns you today's Butterball award....

Is that some kind of inside DYes joke around here? Haven't been around in awhile, but even Urban Dictionary doesn't really give much credence into whatever you're trying to call me.

[TKshreve]

You clearly do not understand about how an FBI investigation works either,totally irrelevant as they have also many times stated no evidence of collusion found.

Lol - this should be good. Hold on my popcorn is almost done.

Who is they? Oh, and back that up.

Pretty please with salt and butter on top.

[Richard]

Lol - this should be good. Hold on my popcorn is almost done.

Who is they? Oh, and back that up.

Pretty please with salt and butter on top.

well that clears a lot up on the thought pattern,you mentioned FBI,I referred to the FBI so you ask who is they.

You get to back it up,you can post a gif but cannot figure out how to do your own search,when you and AJ ask for links you are not asking for facts you are looking for reasons to discredit the source,neither one of you can handle the truth.

Butter goes on top of the popcorn and not the beer.

[TKshreve]

well that clears a lot up on the thought pattern,you mentioned FBI,I referred to the FBI so you ask who is they.

You get to back it up,you can post a gif but cannot figure out how to do your own search,when you and AJ ask for links you are not asking for facts you are looking for reasons to discredit the source,neither one of you can handle the truth.

Butter goes on top of the popcorn and not the beer.

Ok, so you get to state [[as fact) that "they" have said many times there is no evidence of collusion. And when I ask you who is "they", and also to provide proof that your facts are permissible, you suggest the onus of proving your "facts" is on me? Yikes.

Boy you really like to spin it don't you? Why don't you simply back peddle a little and admit that no one has stated there was no evidence of collusion found? Outside of your incredibly biased and corrupt sources. Like the Russian Times.

Oh, because you cannot. That's why.

[Richard]

Ok, so you get to state [[as fact) that "they" have said many times there is no evidence of collusion. And when I ask you who is "they", and also to provide proof that your facts are permissible, you suggest the onus of proving your "facts" is on me? Yikes.

Boy you really like to spin it don't you? Why don't you simply back peddle a little and admit that no one has stated there was no evidence of collusion found? Outside of your incredibly biased and corrupt sources. Like the Russian Times.

Oh, because you cannot. That's why.

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2...arges-unsubst/

https://www.westernjournal.com/repor...lluded-russia/

https://www.investors.com/politics/e...investigation/

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/11/0...Dc3I-/RV=2/RE=1519451492/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.nytimes.com%2f2016%2f11%2f01% 2fus%2fpolitics%2ffbi-russia-election-donald-trump.html/RK=2/RS=Q0DCjc86IDilJ2ARXZq7SuxZnbw-

http://thehill.com/policy/national-s...administration

https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2017/05/23/there-remains-
no-evidence-of-trump-russia-collusion/#65fe4361242c

Now show me your proof that the president colluded with the Russians,the democrats placed the accusations of collusion,where is the evidence before calling the claim and wasting millions of taxpayer dollars,just think how many illegal immigrants that could have helped.

[oladub]

Yes oladub, you've made it abundantly clear that you believe that because America has spied or engaged in surveillance or espionage in foreign countries, that other countries are justified in doing it to us [[i.e. the Russians). I'm just curious if that same logic extends to non-Russian countries, like China and North Korea for example. Both countries regularly engage in espionage against us, to include hacking our computer systems and stealing technological secrets. Do you believe those actions are justified? Will you defend them? Should we turn a blind eye to them? Should we not prosecute and punish those who are caught spying for the Chinese or committing espionage? Yes or no?

I'm pretty sure if Americans violated Russian laws in Russia, the Russians would do something about it, so I'm not sure the "We do it too, two wrongs make a right" argument you're tossing about really justifies deliberate inaction or turning a blind eye in the face of deliberate Russian interference in our elections.

I would point out that Donald Trump STILL has yet to enact punitive sanctions against Russia as a consequence for their interference in the 2016 election, even though those sanctions are mandated by a law that received a 517 to 5 vote in Congress [[i.e. 97% approval by Congress). Even though Trump admitted last week that Russia interfered in our election. Even though Trump heavily criticized Obama this week for not doing ENOUGH to punish the Russians. Even though just two weeks ago, Russian mercenaries in Syria attacked the U.S. military. When the rubber meets the road, Trump protects Putin. Strange.

No one mentioned military spying but yes let's punish Chinese and other spies who steal our military secrets. Let's also punish individuals like Hillary and corporations who violate our security by breaking security laws.

You missed my point that all countries look after their own interests. I accept that as a reality and prefer to work around that by negotiating and securing our own information. You instead prioritize a cold war mentality supporting "punitive sanctions" against countries doing what the U.S. does. What is the U.S. even doing in Syria? I'm disappointed that Trump has continued Obama's idiotic attempt to topple Assad. As Sec. of State Kerry suggested, the thought was that allowing ISIS some space would put pressure on Assad but it backfired when Russia came to Syria's defense. How many more U.S. troops are you willing to sacrifice in all these undeclared wars in places like Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and now Syria? Any troops we have in Syria are violating Syria's sovereignty. Policies of politicians you support led to people being tortured, killed, and driven off in Syria by ISIS and now here you are seemingly in favor of policies that keep U.S. troops in harms way and for what? Those warmongering interventionist policies have driven Russia and China into each others arms militarily and economically while undoing detente. The damage to the U.S. is enormous but you support more of the same.

Ron Paul's 2009 'What if" speech

..."don't let anybody make you think that God chose America as his divine, messianic force to be a sort of policeman of the whole world. God has a way of standing before the nations with judgment, and it seems that I can hear God saying to America, "You're too arrogant! And if you don't change your ways, I will rise up and break the backbone of your power, and I'll place it in the hands of a nation that doesn't even know my name. Be still and know that I'm God." "

-MLK 1967

[Pam]

Mainstream media hits a new low. WTF.

CNN Confronts Old Lady For Posting Russian-Made Memes On Facebook

https://youtu.be/XKwjU812h2E

[aj3647]

No one mentioned military spying but yes let's punish Chinese and other spies who steal our military secrets. Let's also punish individuals like Hillary and corporations who violate our security by breaking security laws.

You have to charge her with a crime first. Didn't Trump promise to "lock her up?" It's been over a year, how's that going?


OK, so since you seemingly agree that China and North Korea should be punished when they break our laws and commit espionage, why do you not feel that Russia should be punished for doing the same thing? Why do you, oladub, have a blatant double standard that protects ONLY Russia?

Oh right, something about a "Cold War mentality." Obviously we should let Russians break our laws, hack our computer systems, interfere in our elections, etc because if we stand up to them, we're bringing back the Cold War. Have you considered the distinct possibility that Putin has already done that? Are you both ignorant and oblivious to the fact that Putin isn't just doing this to us, but is also doing this across Europe as well? You got some creative justifications for why that was OK too? Maybe some past misdeeds on the part of the Dutch justify Russian interference in their affairs?


Meanwhile, here's what Admiral Mike Rogers [[head of the NSA and the US military's Cyber Command) told Congress yesterday:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.aaed0a6e3ca9

Rogers acknowledged that Russian President Vladimir Putin probably believes he’s paid “little price” for the interference and thus hasn’t stopped. He also said flatly that Trump has not granted him any new authorities to strike at Russian cyber-operations.Rogers’s statements were delivered rather plainly, but it became clear as the hearing progressed that he sensed a lack of drive to prevent a repeat of 2016.
“What I see on the Cyber Command side leads me to believe that if we don’t change the dynamic here, that this is going to continue, and 2016 won’t be viewed as isolated,” Rogers said. “This is something that will be sustained over time.”
He said of Russian interference: “We’re taking steps, but we’re probably not doing enough.” He said that sanctions and other measures haven’t “changed the calculus or the behavior” by Moscow. “They haven’t paid a price at least that’s sufficient to get them to change their behavior,” he added.

Our next election is at risk, and this White House is openly protecting Vladmir Putin as he interferes in our democracy. What gives? Even your bullshit Cold War argument doesn't justify that kind of inaction. Even if you don't want to punish Russia, we can at least DEFEND ourselves from cyber attacks, but we aren't even doing that. Trump won't let us. Why? What don't we know that explains Trump's actions? I read that Mueller is now looking into Trump's Russian business connections prior to 2015, so we may have some answers soon...

[oladub]

I wrote' "No one mentioned military spying but yes let's punish Chinese and other spies who steal our military secrets. Let's also punish individuals like Hillary and corporations who violate our security by breaking security laws."

I advocated prioritizing taking responsibility for our own cyber security over arrogant beligerence. You must have missed the word "other" before you went off rambling about Russia being an exception. You must have also missed my points about hypocrisy, Hillary's illegal and inept use of her private server making it so easy for any number of players including Russia to harvest state secrets. Your sort of deep state Joe McCarthy revival memes have cost enough American lives in endless undeclared wars. Kissinger worked hard to triangulate Russian and China but the stupidity of policies you promote have thrown Russia and China back together as military and economic allies at the expense of the United States. Reread that MLK quote I included in my February 24 post. He was talking about people who support the policeman of the world positions you take aj.

[aj3647]

Your sort of deep state Joe McCarthy revival memes have cost enough American lives in endless undeclared wars. Kissinger worked hard to triangulate Russian and China but the stupidity of policies you promote have thrown Russia and China back together as military and economic allies at the expense of the United States. Reread that MLK quote I included in my February 24 post. He was talking about people who support the policeman of the world positions you take aj.

I'm glad that you at the very least "advocate prioritizing taking responsibility for our own cyber security over arrogant beligerence." Good for you. How are we doing on that front? Admiral Mike Rogers just told Congress that we aren't dong enough to protect ourselves from cyber attack. CIA Director Mike Pompeo said the same thing. As has pretty much everyone else...except Trump. Trump, seemingly, is the only one who doesn't think we need to invest significant time and resources in simply protecting our own voting systems from Russian intrusion. What is your explanation for this? Can you explain?

Trump's Cyber-security Advisors Resign, Citing "Insufficient Attention" to Threats
http://fortune.com/2017/08/26/trump-...visors-resign/

This might explain it:

"Every time he sees me he says, 'I didn't do that,' and I really believe that when he tells me that, he means it," Trump told reporters in November after meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin at the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit in Vietnam.

Your thoughts, oladub? Trump doesn't think it's a problem, do you? He believes Putin. Are we doing enough to protect ourselves from cyber attack and digital meddling, and is Trump helping or hurting in that regard?

As for "arrogant belligerence", Putin yesterday unveiled a new generation of "invincible" nuclear missiles that can hit anywhere in the world and evade missile defense systems. He showcased these by showing a computer animation in which Russia nukes Florida.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...g-florida.html

But hey, Putin's not doing anything to bring back the Cold War, it's only us. Putin just wants to be our friend, if only we let him. Right oladub?

[oladub]

"How are we going to do that?" Prosecute Hillary for starters. Take our security agencies to task for too often being politically weaponized. $75B/year and they can't even secure the Mexican border or round up people who overstayed their visas including some of Mohammed Atta's helpers.

Yes, Putin announced that Russia has outflanked us with new missiles. We spend a lot more but Chinese and Russian military technology is leapfrogging us with new space technology, high speed torpedoes, new rockets, new islands, military robots... Just like with out security agencies, our military technology spending isn't producing much bang for the buck. I'm disappointed. We get overpriced sitting duck aircraft carriers to fight the last war. But that's a different problem than Hillary using an illegal server that was easily hacked if we were referencing why Hillary lost having spent twice as much money as Trump. It was Hillary's campaign that hired foreign British agents to dig up dirt on Trump. $88M of Australian taxpayer money were given to the Clinton Family Foundation. How much did you say Russia spent on Facebook ads or whatever?

We have to take responsibility for our own computer security assuming that it will be challenged instead of acting shocked that other countries do the same thing to us as we do to them. We should try more negotiation and less foreign interventionism to reduce wars and hostilities. But thanks to you and yours, we have been heading in the wrong direction with increasingly bad results for the United States.

My last quote, by the way, was by MLK berating arrogance and our attempting to be policeman of the world [[post#417). Your last quote was of the head of the NSA berating his Commander in Chief for not making Russia pay enough of a price.[[post#419). These are opposite viewpoints.

[Pam]

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...issent-w517486

If you don't think that the endgame to all of this lunacy is a world where every America-critical movement from Black Lives Matter to Our Revolution to the Green Party is ultimately swept up in the collusion narrative along with Donald Trump and his alt-right minions, you haven't been paying attention.

[Bong-Man]

Last night was pretty weird by anyone's standard. Nunberg may have totally lost it, but it was interesting as hell. He's not interested in talking to Mueller, but he'll talk with anyone else who cared to listen ! Unlike some of the various media outlets, I give Erin Burnett full credit for mentioning he smelled like alcohol on the air. Fox even borrowed the clip. It's not like I could smell him at home thru the tv ! Now if you want to argue that he shouldn't have been on the air, I can understand your point. Even the President must have had a wtf moment during that mess.

Trump won't sign what Congress has approved, nor has any allocated money been spent. Congress isn't saying much about his inaction towards the Russians, and that makes me wonder if they already know something we don't. Why risk any political capital when the FBI is probably going to do it for you ?

At this point, there's only one thing my gut knows for sure. Pick any scenario you choose...none of this ends well.

[aj3647]

Putin strikes again. UK authorities believe former Russian spy poisoned by nerve agent:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...307-story.html

Colonel Sergei Skripal, a retired Russian military intelligence officer, spent years in a Russian prison when the Russians found out that he was a double agent passing information to MI6. He was freed in a prisoner swap in 2010 when the U.S. handed over 10 Russian spies in exchange for American/British spies being held by Russia.

He is, of course, one of a long line of Russian dissidents, Putin enemies, and former spies who have been targeted for assassination while living in the West.

But hey, if there's a new Cold War going on, clearly it's America's fault, just ask Oladub. Putin's a great guy, oladub will attest to that. I'm sure he has some creative reason for how this is actually the fault of Obama and Hillary. Putin is our friend and we should trust him.