A few reasons... City of Detroit financial shape

Buy American · August-20-09, 08:26 PM

Here are just a few examples as to why the City of Detroit is in the financial shape it's in. I ask this question....why should the employees have to suffer with wage and benefit cuts because of these people who have raped and pillaged the coffers in Detroit? Why are unions getting blamed? These are just a few out of hundreds of examples.

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...spent-millions

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...s-to-be-probed

http://www.freep.com/article/2009081...ses-under-Bing

http://www.freep.com/article/2008012...-messages-show

48302 · August-23-09, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by Buy American

Here are just a few examples as to why the City of Detroit is in the financial shape it's in. I ask this question....why should the employees have to suffer with wage and benefit cuts because of these people who have raped and pillaged the coffers in Detroit? Why are unions getting blamed? These are just a few out of hundreds of examples.

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...spent-millions

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...s-to-be-probed

http://www.freep.com/article/2009081...ses-under-Bing

http://www.freep.com/article/2008012...-messages-show

because the unions are corrupt as well. do i need to post all of the BS that the unions do on a daily basis?

Where, my friend, would you like the city to get their money from?

is there a sugar daddy out there that's gonna save us?

How about L Brook Pattinson?

LodgeDodger · August-23-09, 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by Buy American

Here are just a few examples as to why the City of Detroit is in the financial shape it's in. I ask this question....why should the employees have to suffer with wage and benefit cuts because of these people who have raped and pillaged the coffers in Detroit? Why are unions getting blamed? These are just a few out of hundreds of examples.

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...spent-millions

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...s-to-be-probed

http://www.freep.com/article/2009081...ses-under-Bing

http://www.freep.com/article/2008012...-messages-show

Why should the employees suffer? Because the money isn't there.

**jcole** · August-23-09, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by LodgeDodger

Why should the employees suffer? Because the money isn't there.

And isn't it better to take a pay cut than to lose a job altogether in this economy. It isn't as if Bing is asking them to take a cut during a good economy and then hiring more people with the money he's saving. He's trying to keep people employed and the city running. Granted there have been some real losers in positions of authority over the last umpteen years, but the money is gone. What's the alternative?

**darwinism** · August-23-09, 11:00 AM

Originally Posted by Buy American

Here are just a few examples as to why the City of Detroit is in the financial shape it's in. I ask this question....why should the employees have to suffer with wage and benefit cuts because of these people who have raped and pillaged the coffers in Detroit? Why are unions getting blamed? These are just a few out of hundreds of examples.

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...spent-millions

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...s-to-be-probed

http://www.freep.com/article/2009081...ses-under-Bing

http://www.freep.com/article/2008012...-messages-show

What has already been 'stolen' is now gone ? What has already been 'robbed' is now gone ? In essence, what is done is done.

The solution is no longer just to complain, the solution is to do something !

48302 and jcole are correct. What can you really do at this point ? If you have a list of tangible and reasonable solutions in mind, we ..... along with city leadership would certainly open an ear to your ideas. Please do share your solution[[s) to this problem[[s).

Buy American · August-23-09, 12:19 PM

I can't believe how deaf, dumb and blind some of you are.

48302 "Where, my friend, would you like the city to get their money from?" Tell me which article that sentence refers to please.

Is Bing asking his cronies to take a pay cut? He's already given them a hefty raise, so EVEN IF THEY TAKE A 10% PAY CUT it won't make a big difference in their earnings. Ask the average employee of Detroit to take a 10% pay cut, after making concessions year after year, is asking a lot. Some employees haven't received a pay raise in more than 5 years. If you want to start cutting jobs and pay, the fat is all at the top. Start there before you ask a hard working City of Detroit employee to give up wages and benefits. Believe me, there's plenty of fat that needs to go.
Why do council members have personal cars with drivers? Why do some city appointees have their own cars to get to and from work?
Some of these appointees are allowed to use their city issued automobiles for personal use, gas and insurance included.

**wash_man** · August-23-09, 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

Here are just a few examples as to why the City of Detroit is in the financial shape it's in. I ask this question....why should the employees have to suffer with wage and benefit cuts because of these people who have raped and pillaged the coffers in Detroit? Why are unions getting blamed? These are just a few out of hundreds of examples.

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...spent-millions

http://www.freep.com/article/2009082...s-to-be-probed

http://www.freep.com/article/2009081...ses-under-Bing

http://www.freep.com/article/2008012...-messages-show

Who is "blaming" the unions? Asking them to cut their wages isn't the same as placing blame.

**digitalvision** · August-23-09, 12:32 PM

There's this big idea by many in union leadership that they like to sell the rank and file that there's this large amount of fat - and there very well is fat at the top.

However, that fat is nowhere enough to make up the gap. The bulk of cost of almost any organization is in employees, and is the only place where the city can make enough cuts to make up the large gap. It's impossible to bridge the gap without employee cuts.

**Bobl** · August-23-09, 12:52 PM

BA:

"...Why do council members have personal cars with drivers? Why do some city appointees have their own cars to get to and from work?
Some of these appointees are allowed to use their city issued automobiles for personal use, gas and insurance included..."

Good questions. Another would be: "what about all of the corruption?".

These should all be addressed, but even if all of these wasteful conditions are immediately corrected, it would not have any significant effect on the dire financial situation. Pennies per dollar, at best.

It is better to take a wage hit of 10 percent than to lose one's job. Ask anyone who has been seeking employment the past few years. Most find jobs paying half to two thirds of former wages, if they are fortunate enough to find a job.

The City of Detroit needs less crime, more education, and JOBS, which would provide some tax income to fund basic services.

Buy American · August-23-09, 08:51 PM

Originally Posted by Bobl

BA:

"...Why do council members have personal cars with drivers? Why do some city appointees have their own cars to get to and from work?
Some of these appointees are allowed to use their city issued automobiles for personal use, gas and insurance included..."

Good questions. Another would be: "what about all of the corruption?".

These should all be addressed, but even if all of these wasteful conditions are immediately corrected, it would not have any significant effect on the dire financial situation. Pennies per dollar, at best.

It is better to take a wage hit of 10 percent than to lose one's job. Ask anyone who has been seeking employment the past few years. Most find jobs paying half to two thirds of former wages, if they are fortunate enough to find a job.

The City of Detroit needs less crime, more education, and JOBS, which would provide some tax income to fund basic services.

Of course, the corruption should be investigated and the players should be fired, that goes without saying. All I am saying is that if Bing wants to start cutting, start cutting through all the fat at the top and work your way down.

People can't afford to take any more cuts. The City employee, whether he/she is a secretary or a garbage truck driver, a police officer or a fireman, have given up wages and benefits until the bone is showing. The appointees, the council, the mayor's office, haven't given up a damn thing. They get more. You better believe that Bing has gone in to the Mayor's office and done his redecorating at taxpayer expense.
If the council members drove their own cars, the City is off the hook for auto insurance, gas, new cars, driver salaries, overtime for the drivers. Why on earth does a council member need a bodyguard? When you have crooks like thug KK raping and pillaging the City day after day, it takes it toll...unfortunately the employees suffer the consequences.

48302 · August-23-09, 09:28 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

I can't believe how deaf, dumb and blind some of you are.

48302 "Where, my friend, would you like the city to get their money from?" Tell me which article that sentence refers to please.

Is Bing asking his cronies to take a pay cut? He's already given them a hefty raise, so EVEN IF THEY TAKE A 10% PAY CUT it won't make a big difference in their earnings. Ask the average employee of Detroit to take a 10% pay cut, after making concessions year after year, is asking a lot. Some employees haven't received a pay raise in more than 5 years. If you want to start cutting jobs and pay, the fat is all at the top. Start there before you ask a hard working City of Detroit employee to give up wages and benefits. Believe me, there's plenty of fat that needs to go.
Why do council members have personal cars with drivers? Why do some city appointees have their own cars to get to and from work?
Some of these appointees are allowed to use their city issued automobiles for personal use, gas and insurance included.

i must be the deaf one here, becasue i sure ain't dumb

48302 · August-23-09, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by Buy American

You better believe that Bing has gone in to the Mayor's office and done his redecorating at taxpayer expense.

proof>

dont throw around rumors without proof

**jcole** · August-23-09, 09:39 PM

Originally Posted by 48302

i must be the deaf one here, becasue i sure ain't dumb

Okay,then, I'm calling blind

**mwilbert** · August-23-09, 09:46 PM

There are at least two kinds of waste. One is just spending money on foolish stuff. The other trying to do useful things but in an inefficient way. I'm sure the city spends some money on foolish stuff; it has been documented, and you can cut that out quickly if you can get people to agree that the activity itself is needless. However most of the cost of inefficiency is spread throughout the whole organization, in all its operations. Over time, you could probably make the city substantially more efficient by improving management, changing work rules, and generally tightening the ship.

The problem is that you can't possibly do that in the next few months; it would probably take 5-10 years, assuming you had administrations throughout that time that made it their main priority. And even if you did, you would have to cut jobs anyway; it would just mean a smaller reduction in services. But since there isn't time to do that, all you can do is cut services and the people who provide them, or cut the pay of the people who provide the services. Given the depth of the problem, probably both.

That stinks for city workers, toward whom I have no ill will, but you can't get blood from a turnip. It doesn't matter how much you need a transfusion.