Rosa Parks Transit Center problems

**467riverfix** · January-20-16, 11:37 AM

One possible solution to people using the transit center as a mass public restroom, and its consequent filth, is to charge a fee - say 25 or 50 cents - to use a restroom stall, a common practice in Europe.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/loca...uate/77502118/

**Bham1982** · January-20-16, 12:29 PM

Are cats still getting bathed in the sinks?

I agree that a nominal fee, normal in the rest of the world, would solve most bathroom issues.

**Zacha341** · January-20-16, 02:27 PM

^^^ OH the horrors...

... I heard cats don't like water!

Heaven forbid anyone that has to go into one of those 'eh, bathrooms!

**Honky Tonk** · January-20-16, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

Are cats still getting bathed in the sinks?

Isn't THAT what transit centers are for?

**Jimaz** · January-20-16, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by 467riverfix

One possible solution to people using the transit center as a mass public restroom, and its consequent filth, is to charge a fee - say 25 or 50 cents - to use a restroom stall, a common practice in Europe.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/loca...uate/77502118/

From the article:

Because of a limited number of free restroom facilities in the downtown area, the transit center plays host to more people than it was designed to accommodate, he said.

Heck, if the number of free restroom facilities is limited even more, maybe DetroitYES! will enjoy another cesspool thread.

**softailrider** · January-20-16, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by 467riverfix

One possible solution to people using the transit center as a mass public restroom, and its consequent filth, is to charge a fee - say 25 or 50 cents - to use a restroom stall, a common practice in Europe.

http://www.freep.com/story/news/loca...uate/77502118/

I have a friend who lives in France. He's from around here, he went to Mumford. He said in France people just go the bathroom in alleys or anywhere there's a little privacy. He said that's acceptable over there.

**Johnnny5** · January-20-16, 06:03 PM

Cleaning the restrooms 3-4 times daily is insufficient for a public facility that sees this many visitors and that attracts a sizable homeless population. I've never been in the transit center, but if they don't already have them, full time attendants /custodians during peak usage times would be the obvious solution. Also, lines at the men's room are almost certainly due to a shortage of urinals. That's an easy and inexpensive addition to just about any public restroom facility.

**SDCC** · January-20-16, 08:06 PM

I utilize the transit center; I’ve seen the recent stories on television. I have never seen a line to use the restrooms – not in the year I’ve been back in Detroit. There are issues with the electronic boards, they generally work as far as displaying which bus stops at which bay, departure time portion of the board seems to have more off days than on days, this is a moot issue as the buses hardly follow the times displayed on the boards. The transit center can be something of a bazaar – cigarettes, chips, pop, candy, H20, weed, bus tickets, bus passes, cell phones are sold en masse.
Typically, the transit police are hermetically attached to their chairs; the chairs, as well as the guards, can be found in the security office. There are cameras everywhere, I have never seen an issue inside or outside the transit center. Not sure about the ticket machine being out of order, tickets can be purchased at the walk up window during business hours, I buy my passes at my local CVS. The transit center is not a warming shelter, there is a time limit as far waiting for a bus goes – 45 minutes I think, a person would have to far exceed that time limit prior to one of the guards getting up out of their chair and asking someone to move along. I never knew, or was even aware of the fact that there were heating elements – who knew.
Worry about late buses, drivers leaving the yards late.
And DDOT, to increase revenue try repairing the fare boxes, there are some days I don’t pay all day, as every bus I gotten on, the fare box is not in service.

**Hypestyles** · January-20-16, 10:41 PM

everything needs to be fixed there. Total renovation is in order.

**Honky Tonk** · January-21-16, 05:07 AM

Originally Posted by Hypestyles

everything needs to be fixed there. Total renovation is in order.

Again? Maybe you'd like to underwrite the project?

**davewindsor** · January-21-16, 07:04 AM

Originally Posted by SDCC

I utilize the transit center; I’ve seen the recent stories on television. I have never seen a line to use the restrooms – not in the year I’ve been back in Detroit. There are issues with the electronic boards, they generally work as far as displaying which bus stops at which bay, departure time portion of the board seems to have more off days than on days, this is a moot issue as the buses hardly follow the times displayed on the boards. The transit center can be something of a bazaar – cigarettes, chips, pop, candy, H20, weed, bus tickets, bus passes, cell phones are sold en masse.
Typically, the transit police are hermetically attached to their chairs; the chairs, as well as the guards, can be found in the security office. There are cameras everywhere, I have never seen an issue inside or outside the transit center. Not sure about the ticket machine being out of order, tickets can be purchased at the walk up window during business hours, I buy my passes at my local CVS. The transit center is not a warming shelter, there is a time limit as far waiting for a bus goes – 45 minutes I think, a person would have to far exceed that time limit prior to one of the guards getting up out of their chair and asking someone to move along. I never knew, or was even aware of the fact that there were heating elements – who knew.
Worry about late buses, drivers leaving the yards late.
And DDOT, to increase revenue try repairing the fare boxes, there are some days I don’t pay all day, as every bus I gotten on, the fare box is not in service.

Another solution is to at least double the bus fare price. In Windsor, it's a single fare of $2.75 getting raised to $3 in July. I looked it up for New York City, it also says $2.75.

I googled the fare price in Detroit. It's only $1.50 adults, $0.75 students, $0.50 seniors. Fares should be raised to at least $2.75 to cover those costs. More fares = more money to deal with your issues. Rents and real estate prices have skyrocketed in downtown. Raise the bus fares too.

**Bham1982** · January-21-16, 07:56 AM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Another solution is to at least double the bus fare price. In Windsor, it's a single fare of $2.75 getting raised to $3 in July. I looked it up for New York City, it also says $2.75.

I googled the fare price in Detroit. It's only $1.50 adults, $0.75 students, $0.50 seniors. Fares should be raised to at least $2.75 to cover those costs. More fares = more money to deal with your issues. Rents and real estate prices have skyrocketed in downtown. Raise the bus fares too.

It would be terrible public policy to force riders, who are among the poorest, most desperate, most vulnerable Metro Detroiters, to absorb 100% increases in transit costs. They shouldn't have to pay a huge regressive tax for management's stunning incompetence.

And Detroit's fares aren't too low; Windsor's fares are too high. Detroit's fares are in line with most cities. In NYC the average cost of a fare is something around $1.80. The $2.75 fare you're quoting is for a single one-way ticket which almost no one uses, because every other ticket option is much cheaper. There are daily, weekly, monthly, reduced-price for certain groups, and various bulk ticket options.

**belleislerunner** · January-21-16, 07:58 AM

Why would we expect people who use something to have to pay for it? That's far too logical. It's more fun to expect another entity, or group of people, to pay for it once we choose to not maintain it and let it fall into disarray. Our middle name is Entitled. We are Detroit proud.

**Bham1982** · January-21-16, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by belleislerunner

Why would we expect people who use something to have to pay for it? That's far too logical. It's more fun to expect another entity, or group of people, to pay for it once we choose to not maintain it and let it fall into disarray. Our middle name is Entitled. We are Detroit proud.

It's hardly "entitlement" to not ask the poorest Detroiters to pay the full cost of transit fares. There's no place in the Western world where transit fares are fully covered by the farebox.

That's why we have an graduated federal income tax system. I guess we could do away with taxation and go 100% user fees, forcing the poor to pay $10 for a bus ride, but I'm not sure why that would make any sense.

**Honky Tonk** · January-21-16, 09:10 AM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Another solution is to at least double the bus fare price. In Windsor, it's a single fare of $2.75 getting raised to $3 in July. I looked it up for New York City, it also says $2.75.

I googled the fare price in Detroit. It's only $1.50 adults, $0.75 students, $0.50 seniors. Fares should be raised to at least $2.75 to cover those costs. More fares = more money to deal with your issues. Rents and real estate prices have skyrocketed in downtown. Raise the bus fares too.

Still another solution would be to restore it to it's intended purpose as a Transit Center, and not a mismanaged hang out for for the homeless. Now before we get all up in arms @ Honky Tonk for being a white privileged racist, hear me out. Gilbert and Ilitch effectively did away with all of the low income housing in the Cass Corridor. People write about the deplorable conditions @ shelters. Doesn't anyone think maybe it's time to address some real issues, like homelessness, in Detroit, and not shelter them @ the City's Transit Center? From Wikipedia:

"It began construction in 2007 and was opened for service in July 2009 at a total cost of $22.5 million."

7 years old, $22.5 mil, and it's already falling apart? Now what? Scrap it, put the taxpayers on the hook for another one, and start the downfall process all over again?

**EastsideAl** · January-21-16, 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

It's hardly "entitlement" to not ask the poorest Detroiters to pay the full cost of transit fares. There's no place in the Western world where transit fares are fully covered by the farebox.

That's why we have an graduated federal income tax system. I guess we could do away with taxation and go 100% user fees, forcing the poor to pay $10 for a bus ride, but I'm not sure why that would make any sense.

Damn, I actually agree wholeheartedly with Bham. Maybe I better check myself...

**davewindsor** · January-21-16, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Still another solution would be to restore it to it's intended purpose as a Transit Center, and not a mismanaged hang out for for the homeless. Now before we get all up in arms @ Honky Tonk for being a white privileged racist, hear me out. Gilbert and Ilitch effectively did away with all of the low income housing in the Cass Corridor. People write about the deplorable conditions @ shelters. Doesn't anyone think maybe it's time to address some real issues, like homelessness, in Detroit, and not shelter them @ the City's Transit Center? From Wikipedia:

OK, I'm listening. So what exactly is your solution? How do you get there? Turn the fail jail into a large homeless shelter and ship downtown's homeless there? Who's going to pay for it? A large bond issue funded by the difference in doubling the bus fares?

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

"It began construction in 2007 and was opened for service in July 2009 at a total cost of $22.5 million."

7 years old, $22.5 mil, and it's already falling apart? Now what? Scrap it, put the taxpayers on the hook for another one, and start the downfall process all over again?

Government corruption and wasteful overspending has been a problem in Detroit for a long time. What's your solution, aside from stating the obvious? Privatization? Contracting bus services out to a private company like toll collection and maintenance of the US side of the tunnel?

**preserve** · January-21-16, 12:37 PM

Change the name to the Kwame Kilpatrick Transit Center then all the disfunction would make sense

**bust** · January-21-16, 12:48 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

It would be terrible public policy to force riders, who are among the poorest, most desperate, most vulnerable Metro Detroiters, to absorb 100% increases in transit costs. They shouldn't have to pay a huge regressive tax for management's stunning incompetence.

And Detroit's fares aren't too low; Windsor's fares are too high. Detroit's fares are in line with most cities. In NYC the average cost of a fare is something around $1.80. The $2.75 fare you're quoting is for a single one-way ticket which almost no one uses, because every other ticket option is much cheaper. There are daily, weekly, monthly, reduced-price for certain groups, and various bulk ticket options.

Bus fare in New York also includes free transfers, including into its expansive subway system. Service is 24-hours, relatively very frequent, and reliable. Mass transit is the preferred option for most people in NYC, regardless of income. Clearly that is not the case in Detroit. Besides everything is more expensive in New York. People make a lot more money there too. The median household income is about $26,000 in Detroit compared to $51,000 in New York.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroi...and_employment
http://project.wnyc.org/median-income-nabes/

I'm totally with you on this: Bus fare in Detroit should not cost as much as in New York.

**Honky Tonk** · January-21-16, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

OK, I'm listening. So what exactly is your solution? How do you get there? Turn the fail jail into a large homeless shelter and ship downtown's homeless there? Who's going to pay for it? A large bond issue funded by the difference in doubling the bus fares?

Government corruption and wasteful overspending has been a problem in Detroit for a long time. What's your solution, aside from stating the obvious? Privatization? Contracting bus services out to a private company like toll collection and maintenance of the US side of the tunnel?

Maybe just getting the employees to do their damn jobs and police the Center like they're supposed to, would be a great start. As far as turning the Fail Jail into a Homeless Shelter, that would be a start too. Here, read this. It's a different way to approach the issue other then throwing them out in the street because Hipsters want to stare @ Herringbone floors, or letting them reside in a public transit center.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...aved-millions/

**EastsideAl** · January-21-16, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Maybe just getting the employees to do their damn jobs and police the Center like they're supposed to, would be a great start. As far as turning the Fail Jail into a Homeless Shelter, that would be a start too. Here, read this. It's a different way to approach the issue other then throwing them out in the street because Hipsters want to stare @ Herringbone floors, or letting them reside in a public transit center.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...aved-millions/

Wow, and I agree with Honky too [[in fact, he posted a link to the very same subject I was about to post about). Will wonders never cease?

**drjeff** · January-21-16, 03:41 PM

Originally Posted by softailrider

I have a friend who lives in France. He's from around here, he went to Mumford. He said in France people just go the bathroom in alleys or anywhere there's a little privacy. He said that's acceptable over there.

This is true to some degree in Paris [[ I saw a guy taking a shit inside the metro there once and it's pretty common to encounter the smell of piss or shit there) but not in any other city or town I've visited in France.

**softailrider** · January-21-16, 10:35 PM

Originally Posted by drjeff

This is true to some degree in Paris [[ I saw a guy taking a shit inside the metro there once and it's pretty common to encounter the smell of piss or shit there) but not in any other city or town I've visited in France.

This guy said they consider it a human right to go to the bathroom in France and they do it just about anywhere. I've never been there, but that's what he said.

**Honky Tonk** · January-22-16, 12:52 AM

Originally Posted by softailrider

This guy said they consider it a human right to go to the bathroom in France and they do it just about anywhere. I've never been there, but that's what he said.

I guess that's what makes Paris such a huge tourist destination, the public defication.

**DetroitSoldier** · January-22-16, 02:15 AM

We live near Nuremberg Germany. Here the going rate for a public restroom is 50 cents. However in both the urban centers of Nuremberg and Munich there are free facilities for homeless. Included with the restroom facilities is a free shower once a week.

I do not know who funds this but I will say that both city centers are extremely clean and smell fine. I have walked through several ally ways and actually noticed the lack of urine smell [[the exception being during Oktoberfest.)

On the opposite side of the spectrum we visited Paris last weekend and as beautiful as it was the smell of urine was everywhwre! We stayed right on the Avenue De Champs Elysees and even there we were not immune to the smells.