Obama Visiting Detroit Tomorrow

**Lowell** · January-19-16, 11:10 AM

President Obama may be making his last trip to Detroit as President to visit the Auto Show and check out the city. It is unimaginable what the auto show would have been like had he not acted vigorously to save GM and Chrysler, so I think he deserves a victory lap.

I'm not sure of when his last visit was, but I know he was here on Labor Day 2011 when I shot this picture on the east riverfront.

That would also be about the time Dan Gilbert was beginning to make his presence felt and the remarkable transformation of Downtown Detroit began in earnest. Much change has occurred in the years since.

If you were the President's guide what would you show him?

**Jimaz** · January-19-16, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by Lowell

...

If you were the President's guide what would you show him?

The Henry Ford but that might not be practical for him.

[Edit:Thanks, Lowell

]

**GPCharles** · January-19-16, 12:19 PM

FYI - if you were planning to attend the Auto Show tomorrow and you don't want to see POTUS, you may want to rethink things.

They are planning to curtain off the Chrysler/Ford/GM sections for a good part of the day - security sweeps and his visit. The rest of the show will be very restricted.

**hewettbr** · January-19-16, 01:34 PM

Originally Posted by Lowell

President Obama may be making his last trip to Detroit as President to visit the Auto Show and check out the city. It is unimaginable what the auto show would have been like had he not acted vigorously to save GM and Chrysler, so I think he deserves a victory lap.

I'm not sure of when his last visit was, but I know he was here on Labor Day 2011 when I shot this picture on the east riverfront.

That would also be about the time Dan Gilbert was beginning to make his presence felt and the remarkable transformation of Downtown Detroit began in earnest. Much change has occurred in the years since.

If you were the President's guide what would you show him?

Did he save them or did they save themselves? They got federal money but still filed bankruptcy.

**Zacha341** · January-19-16, 03:35 PM

Wow. That's going to be wild as tomorrow is the NAIAS 'Education Day' with schools bused in from all over the state!

Originally Posted by GPCharles

They are planning to curtain off the Chrysler/Ford/GM sections for a good part of the day - security sweeps and his visit. The rest of the show will be very restricted.

**Lowell** · January-19-16, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by hewettbr

Did he save them or did they save themselves? They got federal money but still filed bankruptcy.

It wouldn't have happened without him getting them the $. After that it was up to them. Sometimes a helping hand is what is needed. The other side openly said, most notably Mitt Romney, they would have let Detroit [automakers] die.

**bust** · January-19-16, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by Lowell

It wouldn't have happened without him getting them the $. After that it was up to them. Sometimes a helping hand is what is needed. The other side openly said, most notably Mitt Romney, they would have let Detroit [automakers] die.

So true. It's important to remember how much opposition Obama overcame to help the automakers, GM and Chrysler in particular. Detroit would not be on the path toward recovery without that. I consider it one of the enduring legacies of Obama's presidency. Don't be misled or forget!

**Ray1936** · January-19-16, 07:10 PM

Well, it looks to me like the Democrats have done a wonderful job in Detroit. Such a dynamic, beautiful town!

[[Not.)

**Honky Tonk** · January-19-16, 08:50 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Well, it looks to me like the Democrats have done a wonderful job in Detroit. Such a dynamic, beautiful town!

[[Not.)

Well, they did manage to keep the doors open and didn't poison anyone.

**bust** · January-19-16, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Well, it looks to me like the Democrats have done a wonderful job in Detroit. Such a dynamic, beautiful town!

[[Not.)

Detroit doesn't exist in a vacuum.

And if I remember correctly, you live in Las Vegas. The economy there is based on what? Why does Vegas deserve all those precious water resources at the expense of so many others? Now there's a model that doesn't scale. What perverse politics even allows it to exist?

**Danny** · January-19-16, 10:37 PM

While Obama visiting Detroit for the Auto Show. The DFT Teachers and Protesters from Flint will be marching into to Cobo Hall with picket signs and flaming tourches like it's the Bolshevik Communists' Party Revolution of 1917 saying SAVE OUR STATE! SAVE OUR SCHOOLS, SAVE OUR PEOPLE IN FLINT, ARREST SNYDER! and cheering Black Lives Matter at the same time.

**oladub** · January-19-16, 11:52 PM

Originally Posted by Lowell

It wouldn't have happened without him getting them the $. After that it was up to them. Sometimes a helping hand is what is needed. The other side openly said, most notably Mitt Romney, they would have let Detroit [automakers] die.

There would have been a different outcome without the dollars. Ford would have expanded more but instead had to compete with government subsidized competition. Foreign manufacturers would have probably picked up some vacant factories and business. As it was, Chrysler became a subsidiary of foreign company and GM expanded into China. As a fringe benefit, GM is about to import a line of Chinese built Buicks. Thanks from GM Obama! Then there are the ex-employees of Pontiac, Saturn, Hummer, and all those GM dealerships Obama shut down.

The results of Obama's meddling were much like the Cash for Clunkers program which benefited Korean manufacturers more than US manufacturers. The losers were people who had to pay more for used cars after many were taken off the road upping the demand for used cars still on the market.

However, I have a soft spot for Obama's subsidization of EV technology. Even though sales of Volts haven't gone through the roof, Obama's subsidies of EV technology helped US EV's compete with cars from Europe and Japan. Had Obama promoted this EV market intervention as being for the national defense, which it is because it makes us less dependent on foreign oil, that measure would have even been consistent with the 10th Amendment. I'll pretend that's what he had in mind to offer my kudos to Obama for jump starting EV's.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · January-20-16, 03:23 AM

The bottom line is, his tenure as POTUS had it's ups and downs, trials and tribulations just like the administrations, prior to his. They've ALL made mistakes, doesn't make his any worse or better for it.

**emu steve** · January-20-16, 06:14 AM

Originally Posted by Lowell

It wouldn't have happened without him getting them the $. After that it was up to them. Sometimes a helping hand is what is needed. The other side openly said, most notably Mitt Romney, they would have let Detroit [automakers] die.

Great, great discussion...

I was at a GM dealer in December 2008. They had the television on when a terse George W. Bush announced some cash to GM to keep them from going broke. Being broke [[without cash) and bankrupt [[too much debt) are entirely different. [[e.g., people go bankrupt and keep their houses, etc. Broke people are at risk of being homeless).

On that December day, GM wasn't facing bankruptcy they were facing shuttering the operation.

Bush kicked the can to Obama who made it a priority to see that the domestic automobile industry did not succumb to the Great Recession.

IF GM had gone under and liquidated George W. Bush would have gone down in history with Hoover. The liquidation of GM would be something ingrained in U.S. history books.

As far as Romney, it is sad when politicians literally take stands contrary to what they KNOW to be true. It is called pandering. Romney is a businessman and knows the difference between a company which has too much debt and a company which has no money and a candidate for shutting down the operation and liquidating.

**emu steve** · January-20-16, 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by Ray1936

Well, it looks to me like the Democrats have done a wonderful job in Detroit. Such a dynamic, beautiful town!

[[Not.)

Other than die hard Republicans, I don't think anyone would want to go back to January 19, 2009.

Detroit went down, down, down under George W. Bush and coming back under Barack H. Obama.

**jfk** · January-20-16, 09:58 AM

Detroit is coming back because of the Bankruptcy courts and Dan Gilbert, not Obama. If Detroit hadn't been allowed to shed it's debt and had Dan Gilbert not infused the money he has which in turn created further investment from others, Detroit would be in the same place it was 6 years ago. But why let the truth get in the way of fantasy.

**southen** · January-20-16, 10:38 AM

Just playing devil's advocate here, but would Dan Gilbert be investing in downtown if the economy and housing markets weren't on the rebound here and nationally? I find it hard to believe we would be seeing this if the economic climate was as it was when Obama was first elected in 2008.

**jfk** · January-20-16, 10:45 AM

Where was the investment in Detroit in 2004 when the economy was good and the Automakers were making annual profits.

**Shai_Hulud** · January-20-16, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by oladub

Then there are the ex-employees of Pontiac, Saturn, Hummer, and all those GM dealerships Obama shut down.

Did we forget about how much GM spent to shut down Oldsmobile? GM knew, and had known for a long time they had too many brands and too many dealerships. It simply required too much for them to shut down the brands and buy out the dealers.

Yes, the feds may have "recommended" shuttering brands and dealers but that would have happened either way. Either GM would have done it when they were able too or the brands and dealers would have died of starvation.

**Honky Tonk** · January-20-16, 11:14 AM

Originally Posted by jfk

Detroit is coming back because of the Bankruptcy courts and Dan Gilbert, not Obama. If Detroit hadn't been allowed to shed it's debt and had Dan Gilbert not infused the money he has which in turn created further investment from others, Detroit would be in the same place it was 6 years ago. But why let the truth get in the way of fantasy.

Speaking of fantasy..... Do you recall the general attitude of the Nation back then? When Mitt announced "Let Them Go Under", you could hear cheering all the way from Rhode Island. Detroit was the most hated City in the Country. Republicans tore Obama a new one for backing GM and Chrysler. [[Ford declined the Government bail-out) Now that Detroit has some new development going on, and, @ least Downtown and Midtown, seem to be doing Ok, everyone is attaching the "D" to their car windows and posting handles. Yes, let's try to keep it real, shall we?

**oladub** · January-20-16, 11:32 AM

Originally Posted by Shai_Hulud

Did we forget about how much GM spent to shut down Oldsmobile? GM knew, and had known for a long time they had too many brands and too many dealerships. It simply required too much for them to shut down the brands and buy out the dealers.

Yes, the feds may have "recommended" shuttering brands and dealers but that would have happened either way. Either GM would have done it when they were able too or the brands and dealers would have died of starvation.

You are correct. it was Oldsmobile, not Pontiac that team Obama shuttered. I also failed to mention the illegal shearing GM bond holders received at the hands of team Obama to help pay for shutting down Olds, Hummer, Saturn, and GM dealers while building new Chinese factories.

**jfk** · January-20-16, 11:38 AM

And this is anyway related to Obama how? Do you think that without Dan Gilbert who now owns 80 buildings in the city, that there would be a need for the M-1. Do you really believe that others would magically come in and be Detroit's savior. Again, where was all the investment prior to 2008. And since 2008 who invested in Detroit. Was it Obama? And don't just blame the Republicans for hammering Obama over the bail-outs, its was the lefties and moderates too. 51% of all Americans were against the bailouts. But again why let the truth get in the way of fantasy

**Honky Tonk** · January-20-16, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by jfk

And this is anyway related to Obama how? Do you think that without Dan Gilbert who now owns 80 buildings in the city, that there would be a need for the M-1. Do you really believe that others would magically come in and be Detroit's savior. Again, where was all the investment prior to 2008. And since 2008 who invested in Detroit. Was it Obama? And don't just blame the Republicans for hammering Obama over the bail-outs, its was the lefties and moderates too. 51% of all Americans were against the bailouts. But again why let the truth get in the way of fantasy

Had the auto industries been allowed "To Go Under", and thousands upon thousands of Detroiters, Lincoln Parkers, Bloomfield Hillers, etc., both directly in the auto industry, and auto industry OEM related fields, had lost their jobs, do you really think Dan Gilbert would have built storefronts for expensive cufflink shops? Do you think Mike Ilitch would have built a new Coliseum, or made due with the one he had? Do you think the City elite would have subsidized a Blight Rail? I think we would have been lucky to get lead tainted water from the Governor. That is those of us left who hadn't sold their homes for pennies on the dollar, or let them lapse into foreclosure, as we moved out for greener pastures.

**southen** · January-20-16, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Had the auto industries been allowed "To Go Under", and thousands upon thousands of Detroiters, Lincoln Parkers, Bloomfield Hillers, etc., both directly in the auto industry, and auto industry OEM related fields, had lost their jobs, do you really think Dan Gilbert would have built storefronts for expensive cufflink shops? Do you think Mike Ilitch would have built a new Coliseum, or made due with the one he had? Do you think the City elite would have subsidized a Blight Rail? I think we would have been lucky to get lead tainted water from the Governor. That is those of us left who hadn't sold their homes for pennies on the dollar, or let them lapse into foreclosure, as we moved out for greener pastures.

Exactly. Gilbert's investments don't exist in a vacuum, they are very much the result of the region getting healthier post bailout and post recession.

**emu steve** · January-20-16, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Had the auto industries been allowed "To Go Under", and thousands upon thousands of Detroiters, Lincoln Parkers, Bloomfield Hillers, etc., both directly in the auto industry, and auto industry OEM related fields, had lost their jobs, do you really think Dan Gilbert would have built storefronts for expensive cufflink shops? Do you think Mike Ilitch would have built a new Coliseum, or made due with the one he had? Do you think the City elite would have subsidized a Blight Rail? I think we would have been lucky to get lead tainted water from the Governor. That is those of us left who hadn't sold their homes for pennies on the dollar, or let them lapse into foreclosure, as we moved out for greener pastures.

HT, you and I are on the same page.

To the others, it is hard to say 'who saved the nation [[economically)?'

My understanding of what happened in [[late) 2008 and 2009 was 180 degrees different than what happened 80 years before.

The policies, monetary and fiscal, of the Fed and central government [[that's Washington) was designed NOT to do what was done 80 years ago which was believed to have made the Great Depression much worse than it had to be.

So Obama had a hand in steering [[pun intended) a supportive fiscal policy toward the automobile industry, fiscal policy for the nation, appointing a chair for the Fed to guide monetary policy.

Sometimes we 'disaggregate' monetary and fiscal policies, yet the president is most responsible for fiscal policy AND nominates governors to the Fed who conduct monetary policy.

So his fingerprints are on both fiscal and monetary policy.

P.S. I DO believe that a very accommodating monetary policy was very important.

I DO believe that tight fiscal and monetary policies would have made the Great Recession much, much worse, and maybe Great Depression II.

When I hear balancing the budget during a severe recession or the 'gold standard' I just say, "Lord, please no..."