Gordie Howe International Bridge

[Rocket]

Take a peak at the 2025 Shanghai Auto Show if you want to see what amazing means. lol

China is so caving in, not. lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hq9vXFGGbcg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xuv87xMDBho

Auto Shows are the definition of Hype. The reality is FAR different.

Most of their companies are bankrupt. Even the biggest of them BYD is $44 BILLION in debt, and likely won't survive the next 2 years.

Making junk cars that look pretty isn't something to brag about.

[Rocket]

Temper your enthusiasm. It hasn't worked yet.

You're not serious?

You think 100+ trade deals happens in 2 weeks?

We haven't suffered at all, and china and others are in free-fall collapse.

A bigger issue than 50% unemployment might be that much of China's construction done over the last 30 years is litteraly falling down.

It is believed the reason is that contractors not only cut corners in their cement, but they use sea sand, which contains salt. The rebar [if they even bothered to use any] is all rusting, and buildings, bridges etc are falling down by the hundreds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPlEcy8vPFU

Major bridge in Bejing a couple days ago.
Built in '99, rebuilt and re-enforced in 2015.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/6Kktod0-aKI

You should watch these guys channel. They lived, worked in and toured China on motorcycles for a decade or more.
Trigger warning,. their facts will clash with the CCP propaganda you're feeding yourself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4S9igjJgwA

Tofu Dreg by the way is the junk at the bottom of the pot when making tofu. You throw it out. Modern Chinese construction is referred to as that by Chinese because of the horrible quality.

New buildings sometimes fall over before then can even be occupied. That and the resulting death tolls are covered up by the CCP.


Ghost Cities
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJ8JBTIVUVw

https://youtu.be/H2Bk5O6yzT0?t=317

[Bong-Man]

You think 100+ trade deals happens in 2 weeks?

I'd be happy to see one before the shelves start emptying. I think we're all getting the grift of what's going on. Your sides endless '10% for the big guy' complaints are sounding pretty hollow at this point. Kind of like past claims of stopping the Russian/Ukraine War in 24 hours.

[Jimaz]

On the plus side, domestically produced agricultural goods should become abundant when farmers are no longer able to dump them overseas. That should make them super cheap here — until farmers can't afford to continue producing them at a loss and go out of business.

So, enjoy cheap soy and porcine byproducts while they last. Yay! Pig snouts, yummy!

[canuck]

On the plus side, domestically produced agricultural goods should become abundant when farmers are no longer able to dump them overseas. That should make them super cheap here — until farmers can't afford to continue producing them at a loss and go out of business.

So, enjoy cheap soy and porcine byproducts while they last. Yay! Pig snouts, yummy!

Rocket is crazy about tofu. Lol

[ABetterDetroit]

On the plus side, domestically produced agricultural goods should become abundant when farmers are no longer able to dump them overseas. That should make them super cheap here — until farmers can't afford to continue producing them at a loss and go out of business.

So, enjoy cheap soy and porcine byproducts while they last. Yay! Pig snouts, yummy!

Any minute they are going to start shoveling many Billions of dollars at the farming maga base because any foreign nation with half a brain cell is not going to risk putting their food supply in the hands of a American megalomaniac with little regard for human rights or life. This whole thing is filled with failed simple 5th grade logic. Nothing comes cheap.

[canuck]

Auto Shows are the definition of Hype. The reality is FAR different.

Most of their companies are bankrupt. Even the biggest of them BYD is $44 BILLION in debt, and likely won't survive the next 2 years.

Making junk cars that look pretty isn't something to brag about.

Okay, so, how many American car companies left, and how are they doing, how long are they to last?

Chrysler, no longer US, and Stellantis has Jeep as a performer in terms of sales, but quality wise; crap.

Ford has, at least not relied on government bailout, maybe the best performer overall.

GM would nothave gone the way of American Motors; kaput, if the bailout hadn’t happened. Talk about commienism.

Tesler is experiencing a bit of a rocky time, and will need to rebrand if it wants to conquer the lefty clientele, since the MAGA nuts are sleeping in their old jalopies.

So, out of maybe 600 car companies in 1920 in the US, that dwindled to 200 in the late twenties, 10 in 1960, there are only 2 traditional and a couple of electric, Rivian and Lucid which is majority owned by Saudis. The process of elimination in the Chinese market follows the same logic that the American one does.

As far as bridges falling, the US and Canada have also had failing infrastructure, flooded tunnels and viaducts, exploding city water mains. There are tons of problems in building failures in North America. Hell, we have a major tunnel; the Louis-Hyppolyte-Lafontaine tunnel getting a major rehab done in Montreal that cost 3 billion dollars to do. The tunnel was completed in 1966. We had to replace another span that was a little more than 60 years old because of salt degradation, etc… with a new Champlain bridge 5 years ago. That was in the 3 billion dollar range too.

As far as building ghost cities goes, you should maybe check out the silly construction of buildings in areas prone to hurricanes and flooding, massive fires all over the US and Canada, to be fair.
The annual cost of reconstruction in a repeat cycle is a,built-in feature of that, too.

[mwilbert]

Most of their companies are bankrupt. Even the biggest of them BYD is $44 BILLION in debt, and likely won't survive the next 2 years.

As far as I can see, BYD does not have $44 billion in debt, looks like it had $26 billion in debt at end of 2024. And they had cash and short term investments worth over $19 billion, so net debt of around $7 billion, which is not a lot for a company of this size.

There is essentially zero chance BYD won't survive the next 2 years. The Chinese EV market is insanely competitive, and no doubt their profits will always be under pressure, but they are more or less cash flow neutral, so they are fine. Even if they were not, I can't see any way they would not be able to get financing.

[Rocket]

As far as I can see, BYD does not have $44 billion in debt, looks like it had $26 billion in debt at end of 2024.

There is essentially zero chance BYD won't survive the next 2 years. The Chinese EV market is insanely competitive, and no doubt their profits will always be under pressure, but they are more or less cash flow neutral, so they are fine.

Direct debt yes, 27.7 Billion yuan [about $5.4B USD], but they depend [like many CCP companies do] on "supplier financing." This has the added bonus of keeping the debt number on their books artificially low. To get the real debt number you have to add in what they owe their suppliers too.

[mwilbert]

Direct debt yes, 27.7 Billion yuan [about $5.4B USD], but they depend [like many CCP companies do] on "supplier financing." This has the added bonus of keeping the debt number on their books artificially low. To get the real debt number you have to add in what they owe their suppliers too.

I can't verify that number one way or another, but it doesn't matter. They are at worst cash flow neutral, and if they weren't, they have financing available. They are not in any danger of going bankrupt.

[Rocket]

Compare bridges and building built in China V.s. the US or Europe. Not even close.

The Ambassador has been in continuous operation for since 1927,

Yet many Chinese bridges are unsafe to travel on after just 3-5 years.
We've had a bridge in Baltimore collapse when a ship hit it, but we don't have 37 bridges collapse in 5 years just from their own weight.

Everything there is corrupt, and there are few standards. Every corner will be cut.

The media is censored, so we don't hear about the thousands that die in building collapses. New schools that collapse under their own weight, high-rise buildings put up with no rebar, or walls filled with Styrofoam or rocks to save cement.

https://youtu.be/s-2DtL-Wjkc
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/y0ci-...?feature=share
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/q8D1U...?feature=share
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/gHFkF...?feature=share
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAPEyGiA5_8
https://youtu.be/q00nTSAcMhs?t=164

One of the big issues now is that China has never has a property tax. So the local governments only form of income is to lease land to developers. But that has all stopped, and developers are giving back land. Things are hyper-desperate there these days.

Youth unemployment may be over 65%, and college graduates are returning to the countryside as there is no hope of finding a job in the big city.

The glory days under president Hu are long gone.

[Meddle]

Is there some news or information about the title bridge in here somewhere?

[canuck]

Compare bridges and building built in China V.s. the US or Europe. Not even close.

The Ambassador has been in continuous operation for since 1927,

Yet many Chinese bridges are unsafe to travel on after just 3-5 years.
We've had a bridge in Baltimore collapse when a ship hit it, but we don't have 37 bridges collapse in 5 years just from their own weight.

Everything there is corrupt, and there are few standards. Every corner will be cut.

The media is censored, so we don't hear about the thousands that die in building collapses. New schools that collapse under their own weight, high-rise buildings put up with no rebar, or walls filled with Styrofoam or rocks to save cement.

https://youtu.be/s-2DtL-Wjkc
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/y0ci-...?feature=share
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/q8D1U...?feature=share
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/gHFkF...?feature=share
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAPEyGiA5_8
https://youtu.be/q00nTSAcMhs?t=164

One of the big issues now is that China has never has a property tax. So the local governments only form of income is to lease land to developers. But that has all stopped, and developers are giving back land. Things are hyper-desperate there these days.

Youth unemployment may be over 65%, and college graduates are returning to the countryside as there is no hope of finding a job in the big city.

The glory days under president Hu are long gone.

So, how is your real estate investment doing over there in crappy Cathay? Lol

You forgot to give us an overview of the endless derailments on the forty thousand kms of high speed rail.

So, in San Francisco, I’ll remind you of the leaning Millenium tower. They’ve tried to stop it from settling with advanced measures, but it appears that they are stopgap as the luxury condo tower is still leaning.

Same with the Seaport tower in NYC. These two towers by the way are in two of the most expensive neighborhoods of the most sophist-o-cated cities on earth. Then there is the little matter of the Citicorp Tower in New York. Who needs Saudis [[Bush buddies) do a 9/11 when you can have a homemade disaster waiting to happen?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citi...neering_crisis

[Henry Whalley]

Is there some news or information about the title bridge in here somewhere?

No, Rocket kidnapped the thread.

[Rocket]

You forgot to give us an overview of the endless derailments on the forty thousand kms of high speed rail.

So, in San Francisco, I’ll remind you of the leaning Millenium tower. They’ve tried to stop it from settling with advanced measures, but it appears that they are stopgap as the luxury condo tower is still leaning.

Same with the Seaport tower in NYC. These two towers by the way are in two of the most expensive neighborhoods of the most sophist-o-cated cities on earth. Then there is the little matter of the Citicorp Tower in New York. Who needs Saudis [[Bush buddies) do a 9/11 when you can have a homemade disaster waiting to happen?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citi...neering_crisis

4-5 flawed U.S. projects v.s. hundreds of Chinese buildings falling over and 37+ bridges collapsing in the last few years.

The two are virtually the same, I see your point.


Still, somehow, the Ambassador Bridge remains stranding, even though it's more than 20 years old. Just luck I guess.

[Gistok]

No, Rocket kidnapped the thread.

You notice he doesn't mention his 401K... but damn sleepy Joe and the price of eggs!!

[5939DT]

Compare bridges and building built in China V.s. the US or Europe. Not even close.

The Ambassador has been in continuous operation for since 1927,

Yet many Chinese bridges are unsafe to travel on after just 3-5 years.
We've had a bridge in Baltimore collapse when a ship hit it, but we don't have 37 bridges collapse in 5 years just from their own weight.

Everything there is corrupt, and there are few standards. Every corner will be cut.

Normally I wouldn't jump into a thread when the posts are starting with "So, ..." followed by some twisted logic and personal attack. But for this one I have thousands of words. I had to go to Nanchang, China in 2018 on business - now retired so no worries about employment repercussions.
I'm not sure about the construction standards, but electrical, hoo boy.

At the Hotel: Here's a great place for an electrical outlet [that's the bathtub, not the sink]:


I wonder why our telephone/internet is so flaky:



And we complain about DTE?


Organic utility pole:

[Meddle]

What does any of that have to do with the Howe bridge?

[Meddle]

@admin

@lowell

We need a mass cleanup of this thread.

[Rocket]

What does any of that have to do with the Howe bridge?

Nothing.

401don back at post 209 and canuck a few posts later used someone's question to launch personal attacks at the president, sending this thread off the rails. Any attempt to bring it back causes them to respond with more personal attacks.

401don then tried to send it off in yet another unrelated direction with attacks in post 220, but no one took the bait.



One of the questions was, if Canada doesn't eliminate it's tariffs on us, and the current administration puts long term tariffs on Canada, will the new bridge get enough traffic to be able to pay for itself? And if not, will we get stuck with a bill somehow?

Truck traffic on the Ambassador was already down by 1/3 in the 7 years leading up to the pandemic.

Glad it's not my problem.

[canuck]

Nothing.

401don back at post 209 and canuck a few posts later used someone's question to launch personal attacks at the president, sending this thread off the rails. Any attempt to bring it back causes them to respond with more personal attacks.

401don then tried to send it off in yet another unrelated direction with attacks in post 220, but no one took the bait.



One of the questions was, if Canada doesn't eliminate it's tariffs on us, and the current administration puts long term tariffs on Canada, will the new bridge get enough traffic to be able to pay for itself? And if not, will we get stuck with a bill somehow?

Truck traffic on the Ambassador was already down by 1/3 in the 7 years leading up to the pandemic.

Glad it's not my problem.

Sez Mr Pure-as-Detroit-Snow.

[Jimaz]

I do appreciate 5939DT's photos. That was an interesting first-hand insight into China's notoriously deregulated infrastructure. I think we can assume that the bathtub outlet was not even ground fault protected.

[Vic01]

Nothing.

401don back at post 209 and canuck a few posts later used someone's question to launch personal attacks at the president, sending this thread off the rails. Any attempt to bring it back causes them to respond with more personal attacks.

401don then tried to send it off in yet another unrelated direction with attacks in post 220, but no one took the bait.



One of the questions was, if Canada doesn't eliminate it's tariffs on us, and the current administration puts long term tariffs on Canada, will the new bridge get enough traffic to be able to pay for itself? And if not, will we get stuck with a bill somehow?

Truck traffic on the Ambassador was already down by 1/3 in the 7 years leading up to the pandemic.

Glad it's not my problem.

Here's a big F all that... to the "he hit me first" stuff. I really don't care who posted what or when, it needs to stop. The forum policy is to as much as possible leave politics out of our comments [[ideally, only posting the effects locally), and if someone slips up with a minor dig at an elected official or party, that doesn't give the OK to respond in kind

[Rocket]

I do appreciate 5939DT's photos. That was an interesting first-hand insight into China's notoriously deregulated infrastructure. I think we can assume that the bathtub outlet was not even ground fault protected.

For sure not, and it's also 240v. It's amazing how fast your phone charges over there.

Bigger issues are fake fire hydrants, fake storm drains, fire suppression systems in buildings that aren't hooked up to a water supply, etc.

[canuck]

For sure not, and it's also 240v. It's amazing how fast your phone charges over there.

Bigger issues are fake fire hydrants, fake storm drains, fire suppression systems in buildings that aren't hooked up to a water supply, etc.

Yeah.

The irony of course is that you post this from your iphone, in the poster child of devastated cities category. The devastation and violence far predates the time the Chinese were only riding bikes, and outskyscraping you. Just saying.

If Chump wakes up early enough tomorrow morning, he might be able to finish his great wall. The Chinese have a 12,000 mile long one they started building 2,000 years before the US was born.

Just saying, again.

I would rather build bridges than walls, but then again, if the US became the 11th province, you might enjoy some of the freedoms you once had…