first roundabouts, now this... 'diverging diamond' interchange

**edgar_rhode** · April-10-15, 11:10 AM

it will be interesting to see how this plays out here in michigan. watch the video within the story to understand the concept. >

http://www.mlive.com/lansing-news/in...eather_article

**Pam** · April-10-15, 11:19 AM

Well, that was confusing. I question any of these so-called improvements that they claim are safer. I don't see how anything with a learning curve is safer at least in the short term.

**Scottathew** · April-10-15, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by Pam

Well, that was confusing. I question any of these so-called improvements that they claim are safer. I don't see how anything with a learning curve is safer at least in the short term.

[Sarcasm]Yeah, if it's new and I have to learn something, then it must suck. We should always keep everything the same.[/Sarcasm]

Or, perhaps people will need to adapt to new things so that they can reap their benefits.

Roundabouts are more efficient, eliminate 90 degree T-Bone collisions, eliminate head-on collisions, and reduce the speed of collisions.

DDI's eliminates opposing traffic to left-hand turns as wells as conflict points within an interchange. It also gets rid of the huge 270 degree turns. This will result in only a two-phase signal and better traffic flow.

I see the merits and I'd like to see it implemented. If it works well, then we may see more in the future. If it doesn't work well, then we should stay away from them.

**Gpwrangler** · April-10-15, 11:52 AM

The left turn is inherently a cluster fuck for most drivers. At least this design will keep drivers safe from left turners who run the light or fail to yield to oncoming traffic. Now if we could just teach people to MERGE instead of waiting for others to move over.

**warsaw7** · April-10-15, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by edgar_rhode

it will be interesting to see how this plays out here in michigan. watch the video within the story to understand the concept. >

http://www.mlive.com/lansing-news/in...eather_article

What is wrong with roundabouts?

**subsidized** · April-10-15, 12:06 PM

Looks like a pain in the ass for pedestrians.

**dtowncitylover** · April-10-15, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by subsidized

Looks like a pain in the ass for pedestrians.

This area isn't pedestrian friendly nor is it meant to be. It's in the heart of suburbia.

That interchange is due for major upgrades and kinda excited to see the finished product if only to feel like I'm in the UK for a minute.

**Pam** · April-10-15, 12:26 PM

[Sarcasm]Yeah, if it's new and I have to learn something, then it must suck. We should always keep everything the same.[/Sarcasm]

I didn't say that. When it comes to driving habits it can take people a while to adapt. For example I live near an intersection with the new left turn signal with the blinking yellow. It's been there for months and people are still confused.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · April-10-15, 12:27 PM

The roundabout being installed at 14 Mile, Northwestern and Orchard Lake roads is already causing a stir, and it is snarling traffic big time. Avoid at all costs during the morning and evening rush hour. Won't be completed until the fall I'm told.

**Scottathew** · April-10-15, 12:47 PM

Originally Posted by Pam

I didn't say that. When it comes to driving habits it can take people a while to adapt. For example I live near an intersection with the new left turn signal with the blinking yellow. It's been there for months and people are still confused.

Your point is valid that there will be short-term issues. My apologies if I was a little hostile. I was more annoyed with the thread title, which you didn't write.

**sirrealone** · April-10-15, 01:35 PM

Originally Posted by warsaw7

What is wrong with roundabouts?

Nothing, but many people dislike them because it forces them to actually pay attention and understand the rules to know when they can properly proceed through the intersection versus relying on a non-intelligent traffic signal to do the work for them.

When utilized properly, they move traffic through an intersection much more effectively than a traffic signal, and they're also safer in that they reduce the number of crashes and the crashes that do take place are much less catastrophic because of the design lowers speeds while in the roundabout.

People are all over the new one going in at 14 Mile and Orchard Lake as a potential disaster, but I think it will work out. They put one in a few years ago at the M-5 / Pontiac Trail / Martin Parkway intersection. That's a pretty high volume area and I was aghast and thought it would be doomed to failure when I first heard the plans, but I've eaten my words because it's a dramatic improvement and I always feel very safe when going through it.

**Gpwrangler** · April-10-15, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by Pam

[Sarcasm]Yeah, if it's new and I have to learn something, then it must suck. We should always keep everything the same.[/Sarcasm]

I didn't say that. When it comes to driving habits it can take people a while to adapt. For example I live near an intersection with the new left turn signal with the blinking yellow. It's been there for months and people are still confused.

And they should be confused. When was the last time you encountered a flashing yellow with the opposing light green? Stupidest thing I ever heard of. Flashing yellow at an intersection ALWAYS means the opposing traffic has a stop.

For or kicks, stop at a flashing yellow, get rear ended, and see who gets blamed.

**1953** · April-10-15, 03:42 PM

Roundabouts are stupid and ugly.

And driving on the wrong side of the road sounds like a recipe for confusion and delay!

Sometimes, safety isn't the only variable, traffic engineers.

Keep this in mind when you try to cram self-driving cars down our throat.

1953

**edgar_rhode** · April-10-15, 04:46 PM

warsaw7 and 48307 - i don’t see anything wrong with roundabouts. growing up on the east coast we used to call them “circles” [[ go figure ) and they usually merged larger highways. the title was just indicating the sequence of the changes happening in traffic management. thats all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._in_New_Jersey

**ABetterDetroit** · April-10-15, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by 48307

[Sarcasm]Yeah, if it's new and I have to learn something, then it must suck. We should always keep everything the same.[/Sarcasm]

Or, perhaps people will need to adapt to new things so that they can reap their benefits.

Roundabouts are more efficient, eliminate 90 degree T-Bone collisions, eliminate head-on collisions, and reduce the speed of collisions.

Thank You.

Lose a pair of immediate family members at once to a drunk driver in a intersection like I did and the inherent safety factor of roundabouts is crystal clear.

Vehicles can ALWAYS be replaced, it isn't possible with loved ones.

**belleislerunner** · April-10-15, 05:31 PM

These diverging diamonds are common in Atlanta [[especially Gwinnett County) off 85. They actually do move traffic much faster. It will take people one month to get used to them and then you won't even notice - you just become a creature of habit following traffic in front of you.

**DetroiterOnTheWestCoast** · April-10-15, 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by belleislerunner

These diverging diamonds are common in Atlanta [[especially Gwinnett County) off 85. They actually do move traffic much faster. It will take people one month to get used to them and then you won't even notice - you just become a creature of habit following traffic in front of you.

I'd agree with that. I found it surprisingly easy to drive on the left side of the road the first time I was in an "English" driving environment - just learned to follow. Remembering which way to look when pulling out into traffic was the only difficult part.

**Jimaz** · April-10-15, 06:51 PM

Aw, hell. Let's just make a pretzel-shaped roundabout and be done with it. That ought to calm traffic waaay down.

What could possibly go wrong?

**Scottathew** · April-10-15, 08:23 PM

It could be worse...

Five clockwise roundabouts with a counter-clockwise roundabout in the middle!

**rb336** · April-11-15, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by DetroiterOnTheWestCoast

I'd agree with that. I found it surprisingly easy to drive on the left side of the road the first time I was in an "English" driving environment - just learned to follow. Remembering which way to look when pulling out into traffic was the only difficult part.

Yep, changes in traffic rules just take some getting used to. Driving on the left side was no issue for me. Much more difficult was driving on the right side with right-hand drive

**mikeg19** · April-13-15, 06:49 AM

Originally Posted by 1953

Roundabouts are stupid and ugly. 1953

Did a 5 year old type that?

I personally don't think there is anything wrong with a roundabout. Seems like traffic moves so much quicker through those then a typical intersection [[save for the morons who stop in the middle of them to let traffic enter the roundabout). Plus I find them much more asthetically pleasing to look at than a typical paved over intersection. They are usually nicely landscaped and have lighting.

I feel like the only people who are having trouble with them are the older crowd. But hey, what do I know?

**Gpwrangler** · April-13-15, 07:44 AM

Originally Posted by mikeg19

Did a 5 year old type that?

I personally don't think there is anything wrong with a roundabout. Seems like traffic moves so much quicker through those then a typical intersection [[save for the morons who stop in the middle of them to let traffic enter the roundabout). Plus I find them much more asthetically pleasing to look at than a typical paved over intersection. They are usually nicely landscaped and have lighting.

I feel like the only people who are having trouble with them are the older crowd. But hey, what do I know?

The people who stop in the middle are the same ones who can't merge: usually younger folks, entry level car like a '98 gran prix or Malibu, surprising number of them on the phone or not even looking. Don't blame us old farts lol I step on the gas when I merge.

**mikeg19** · April-13-15, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by Gpwrangler

The people who stop in the middle are the same ones who can't merge: usually younger folks, entry level car like a '98 gran prix or Malibu, surprising number of them on the phone or not even looking. Don't blame us old farts lol I step on the gas when I merge.

Well, I'll have to give you that one as well. lol

**dtowncitylover** · April-13-15, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by Gpwrangler

The people who stop in the middle are the same ones who can't merge: usually younger folks, entry level car like a '98 gran prix or Malibu, surprising number of them on the phone or not even looking. Don't blame us old farts lol I step on the gas when I merge.

This is not what I've found. It seems the older generation [[60+) is not used to roundabouts at all so they stop instead of yield when there's no traffic, and when they get into the circle they go slow because they don't have a clue what they're doing.

My friend broadsided a woman though who didn't stop or yield and just flew right out into her. And just this weekend I had to slam on my brakes because no one knows how to merge and the person in front of me, an older woman, stopped because she thought she was gonna get hit. Never mind the fact she cut me off entering the circle. I wouldn't have been on her tail if she just waited.

**Scottathew** · April-13-15, 10:27 AM

Keep in mind there's plenty of horror stories about traditional intersections, where the chance of fatality is much higher. I don't believe there have been any fatalities in Michigan roundabouts.