Should a Minister Run for Political Office?

[royce]

I'm also bothered by the high showing of Andre Spivey, a church minister. Does a church minister have the time to serve as a council member and still be the head of a church? Now, if he's an associate minister then I can see him being able to do both jobs. However, if he's head of a church, then I don't think he needs to be on the council. What do you think?

[Stosh]

I'm also bothered by the high showing of Andre Spivey, a church minister. Does a church minister have the time to serve as a council member and still be the head of a church? Now, if he's an associate minister then I can see him being able to do both jobs. However, if he's head of a church, then I don't think he needs to be on the council. What do you think?

I suppose that would depend on how many people he ministers to. If he's got the title, but no flock, then what's the harm. If he's pastor of a mega-church, he's got their votes, and their tacit approval. If they don't like it, his followers can always fire him, or go elsewhere. There's no shortage of ministers around, if you haven't noticed.

[Locke09]

If they're just a minister, they have the time. If they are a pastor, they shouldn't have the time, because they should be available to their parishoners whenever needed. Unless they temporarily step down and let someone else pastor their flock, I don't see how they can properly do both.

But if they step down, then it's like saying this "calling" to public office is higher than the "calling" to "feed God's sheep", which most of them would assert is the highest calling they can get. I personally cannot reconcile the two diverse roles in my mind so I can't bring myself to vote someone into political office who says they were called by God to the ministry.

[MIRepublic]

So, how many more of these "concern trolling" posts are you going to make, Royce? Two seats down to bitch about, and seven more to go, right?

[usa1]

Council is a 4 year term, and hopefully the minister could bring honesty and integrity to the council table. If you look at Monica Conyers - Thief - Jo Ann Watson - Tax Cheat, Martha Reeves - Entertainer, Kwame Kenyatta, Let his home foreclose. The minister is probably fed up with these people and figures it is time to step up and do something for the city. So be it.

[EastsideAl]

There have been several ministers on the Council over the years. Most notably Rev. Nicholas Hood, who served for 7 terms.

[firstandten]

There have been several ministers on the Council over the years. Most notably Rev. Nicholas Hood, who served for 7 terms.

Both Nicholas Hood's

David Eberhard

Keith Butler

John Peoples

[tkelly1986]

The real question is whether the "minister" or "pastor" is qualified to be an elected official. They may be able to spread the word of God, but what about public policy do they understand? Let alone making good policy? We have too few people with advanced degrees in economics, public policy, public administration and dare I say law degrees....The city council seems to be a place where underqualified crooks go to get a paycheck and rob the city coffers....Very few good on there

[Onthe405]

The real question is whether the "minister" or "pastor" is qualified to be an elected official. They may be able to spread the word of God, but what about public policy do they understand? Let alone making good policy? We have too few people with advanced degrees in economics, public policy, public administration and dare I say law degrees

Knowledge and understanding of both theology and public policy don't necessarily have to be mutually exclusive. There is an all-too-common misconception otherwise---much like the perpetual "someone can't be both physically attractive and intelligent at the same time" and "religion and science can't co-exist" myths.

Sen John Danforth [[MO) was both an ordained, practicing Episcopal priest and a sitting Senator. He holds degrees from both seminary and Yale law. The structure of the ECUSA is such that [[unless they are a Rector or Dean) a priest can say Eucharist when their schedule permits, without other substantial responsibilities to the parish as a whole. During his entire service as MO Attorney General, US Senator, and UN Ambassador, Danforth continued to perform his duties as a priest at Christ Church Cathedral in St Louis, and still does.

I have no idea whether any of this applies to Spivey’s particular situation, but it is a cautionary consideration against making sweeping generalizations about how people earn their living outside of the sphere of their public service.

[R8RBOB]

Short answer: HELL NO

Long answer: This country used to be believe in the separation of church and state. Some people believed that they didn't want the nation being under the thumb of religious zealots like some of our fellow Muslim nations.

That said, having a father, a reverend, a minister, a nun, a bishop running for public office is bad, bad, bad. Having a voice that is on the side of "GOD" beyond the council chamber would be the wrong move for Detroit.

[R8RBOB]

Both Nicholas Hood's

David Eberhard

Keith Butler

John Peoples

You have to admit, they don't last long. I suppose there is a reason for that.

[EastsideAl]

You have to admit, they don't last long. I suppose there is a reason for that.

Well, except for Nick Hood the original, who, as I said above, served 7 terms.

I'm not a religious person at all, but I don't really have a problem with ministers serving at this level of government. Oftentimes ministers are very active in their communities and know its needs and understand its people firsthand better than most other people in the community. Their churches are also, particularly in poor African-American communities, some of the very few institutions that have the capability to organize and address problems like blight, crime, affordable housing, etc.

[Onthe405]

Short answer: HELL NO

Long answer: This country used to be believe in the separation of church and state. Some people believed that they didn't want the nation being under the thumb of religious zealots like some of our fellow Muslim nations.

That said, having a father, a reverend, a minister, a nun, a bishop running for public office is bad, bad, bad. Having a voice that is on the side of "GOD" beyond the council chamber would be the wrong move for Detroit.

R8RBOB, I respect your opinion, but my own view is that this a generalization based on self-serving individuals who harbor a political agenda cloaked in the name of religion....and, yes, there a lot of them and they are particularly noisy and out on the forefront of the media. However, not every ordained or deeply religious person is a zealot or disrespectful of the separation of church and state guaranteed by the Constitution. Actually, quite the opposite.

IMO, each person should be evaluated on their own suitability to serve office, religiosity neither a detriment nor a virtue. The reason I brought up Sen Danforth in the previous post is that he has written a thoughtful book, "Faith & Politics" addressing this particular subject:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionande...4/feature.html

[R8RBOB]

R8RBOB, I respect your opinion, but my own view is that this a generalization based on self-serving individuals who harbor a political agenda cloaked in the name of religion....and, yes, there a lot of them and they are particularly noisy and out on the forefront of the media. However, not every ordained or deeply religious person is a zealot or disrespectful of the separation of church and state guaranteed by the Constitution. Actually, quite the opposite.

IMO, each person should be evaluated on their own suitability to serve office, religiosity neither a detriment nor a virtue. The reason I brought up Sen Danforth in the previous post is that he has written a thoughtful book, "Faith & Politics" addressing this particular subject:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionande...4/feature.html

I was on the 405 heading to San Diego six years ago when I experience LA traffic during rush hour. Never again.

I am in agremeet with you. I suppose my long answer was not long enough. Your explanation was what I was attempt to channel but I didn't have the right words at the time. I'm not trying to paint all men and women of GOD with the same dirty brush. I just would not want someone from the church attempting to instill their agenda in council chambers. The attempt to reign in the strip bars is a church driven action. Imagine if they one or two of their own were in council. We may see agendas that are church-based instead of population-based.

[Locke09]

I was on the 405 heading to San Diego six years ago when I experience LA traffic during rush hour. Never again.

I am in agremeet with you. I suppose my long answer was not long enough. Your explanation was what I was attempt to channel but I didn't have the right words at the time. I'm not trying to paint all men and women of GOD with the same dirty brush. I just would not want someone from the church attempting to instill their agenda in council chambers. The attempt to reign in the strip bars is a church driven action. Imagine if they one or two of their own were in council. We may see agendas that are church-based instead of population-based.

I guess I see it from a different angle. I'm not so concerned with the men and women of God tainting the council. I'm concerned with the council tainting them. The Christian bible, which I assume Spivey subscribes to, does not support the same person pulling double duty as a priest/minister and king/politician. Serve on community-oriented committees. Speak "truth" to those in power. Lead community coalitions. Etc. But be a politican? I just can't wrap my mind around that. Maybe I'm just close-minded

[Bobl]

NO
A one word reply would suffice, but there is a ten character minimum!

[buildingsofdetroit]

I'm also bothered by the high showing of Andre Spivey, a church minister. Does a church minister have the time to serve as a council member and still be the head of a church? Now, if he's an associate minister then I can see him being able to do both jobs. However, if he's head of a church, then I don't think he needs to be on the council. What do you think?

Sure. I think Spivey is one of the better candidates for council - and I'm agnostic. Maybe I don't know what being a minister entails, but keep in mind that other council members [[see Reeves, Martha-Rose ... or is that Rose-Reeves, Martha?) are "too busy" to serve 24/7. But I can't imagine that speaking at church on Sunday is going to tie him up too much to be a council member.

[jonesy]

Someone should ask Pastor Spivey if his position at his church is full or part-time. And, if he plans to continue in his current compacity if elect. I doubt he can effectively work two full time jobs. Especially those as demanding as a politican and a pastor.
On a side note, anyone know where can I find the attendance records of the incumbents.

[Downtown diva]

while i think it is kind of Cheesy, i have absolutely no problem with Spivey...that is if he were competent...which i am not so sure of.

just becasue he is a man of the cloth, it shouldnt preclude him from office

[turkeycall]

You have to admit, they don't last long. I suppose there is a reason for that.

David Eberhard served on City Council from 1976 to 1994 - 18 years. That doesn't sound "short term" to me.

[Danny]

R8RBOB,

I agree with you. I don't want to see Detroit as a church governing the city, but as a peacekeeping force to prevent corruption.

[preserve]

I have to agree with R&B. I do not want this mix of church and state. I'm already fed up with all the "God" invoking that goes on.

[SWMAP]

Roman Catholic priests are forbidden to run for or hold a public office - as political work necessarily [[and correctly) often involves comprimises that a representative of the Church cannot make. It is thought that you cannot serve two masters and that the excercise of both religious and civil powersby one person is conflicting.

I believe that a local example of the stringency of this regulation is Judge Michael Callahan's [[a priest and a lawyer) resignation from the priesthood when he was elected as a judge.

[Locke09]

I wouldn't go so far as to call this as a mixture of church and state. People of faith have a right to run for political office and even invoke God every five minutes if they want to. I don't get offended when people invoke who or whatever they want to invoke [[although I do cringe sometimes). I just push past their posturing and dramatics and judge what they say and what they propose/do on its own merit. Of course I have to do that with people who are not religious as well

[Locke09]

Roman Catholic priests are forbidden to run for or hold a public office - as political work necessarily [[and correctly) often involves comprimises that a representative of the Church cannot make. It is thought that you cannot serve two masters and that the excercise of both religious and civil powersby one person is conflicting.

I believe that a local example of the stringency of this regulation is Judge Michael Callahan's [[a priest and a lawyer) resignation from the priesthood when he was elected as a judge.

Thanks for the real life example. That's what I was trying to express earlier. While Protestant churches may not expressly forbid this, and it's not a violation of separation of church and state, it is contrary to what the Protestant bible calls for, a consecration of priests/ministers to spiritual service and a separation of the same from anything that might pollute them [[like politics).