American Torture

**carolcb** · December-16-14, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by noise

Dear god, yes. Unless we're just animals.

Thank you for saying that.

And - why shouldn't I blame Bush? He was in charge. Personally, I hope he lies awake at night with guilt, but I am certain he doesn't miss a wink.

**Jimaz** · December-16-14, 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by noise

Dear god, yes. Unless we're just animals.

Lately I've been trying to think of what other species use torture. The only one I've come up with is maybe a cat playing with its prey before killing it. But is its intent to terrorize its victim or to prolong the thrill of the hunt? I'd guess the latter.

Can anyone think of any other species? Sincerely curious.

**oladub** · December-16-14, 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by Jimaz

Lately I've been trying to think of what other species use torture. The only one I've come up with is maybe a cat playing with its prey before killing it. But is its intent to terrorize its victim or to prolong the thrill of the hunt? I'd guess the latter.

Can anyone think of any other species? Sincerely curious.

When we bought our farm, it came with a hunting dog, Freckles, the owners couldn't bring to town. Once, I saw Freckles catch a rabbit while looking out the back window. Instead of just killing the rabbit, Freckles was tearing the hair off it. I went out and put the rabbit out of its misery. That dog was playing with its meal.

"the only thing that results from this abuse is a very certain increase of pleasure for the despot who does the tormenting or vexing" - the Marquis-de-Sade

**Jimaz** · December-16-14, 11:18 PM

Originally Posted by carolcb

... why shouldn't I blame Bush? He was in charge. Personally, I hope he lies awake at night with guilt, but I am certain he doesn't miss a wink.

True that.

DetroitYES Home » Non Detroit Issues » Thom Hartmann » The Prosecution of an American President

Near the end they discuss the psychology of sociopathy and its similarity to GWB's recent behavior.

Sociopaths not only show no remorse but they truly have no remorse to show. Indeed, that's the key trait that discloses their very sociopathy. They're simply unaware of their lack of remorse.

**Zacha341** · December-17-14, 05:36 AM

Yep, Bush did that. Fast forward: In the meantime those who plot our destruction, collectively and individually withstanding party affiliation and politics remain, vigilant.

Were applicable, we must find a way to obtain information in a manner that is humane yet effective to stop them. Right?

**lpg** · December-17-14, 02:40 PM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Yep, Bush did that. Fast forward: In the meantime those who plot our destruction, collectively and individually withstanding party affiliation and politics remain, vigilant.

Were applicable, we must find a way to obtain information in a manner that is humane yet effective to stop them. Right?

I've asked the same basic question here, but the only response has been it's all Bush's fault. It's like we've confessed to our sins, so can we all be friends now. I don't understand some people's thoughts here. If anyone has watched the news in the last couple of days, what the terrorists have done in Pakistan will happen here if given the chance. God help us if they ever get their hands on a chemical, biological or a nuclear weapon here.

**noise** · December-18-14, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by Jimaz

Lately I've been trying to think of what other species use torture. The only one I've come up with is maybe a cat playing with its prey before killing it. But is its intent to terrorize its victim or to prolong the thrill of the hunt? I'd guess the latter.

Can anyone think of any other species? Sincerely curious.

Good point. My apologies to all other animals.

**Jimaz** · December-22-14, 07:42 PM

From 2009: Jesse Ventura: You Give Me a Water Board, Dick Cheney and One Hour and I'll have him confess to the Sharon Tate murders."

**Jimaz** · January-03-15, 03:53 PM

Attachment 25417
Karl Rove Approves Of Rectal Feeding

**Pam** · January-10-15, 09:02 PM

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/0...n_6449352.html

WASHINGTON, Jan 10 [[Reuters) - Two protesters were arrested at the McLean, Virginia, home of former Vice President Dick Cheney on Saturday after 20 demonstrators, some in orange prison jumpsuits, walked onto his property to mark the 14th anniversary of the opening of Guantanamo Bay prison.

**frankfrank** · January-12-15, 07:52 PM

I don't feel that torture is ever appropriate...for any reason.

The scenario of the "ticking time bomb" is nothing but a tired movie or TV plot, entirely unlikely in real life.

**G-DDT** · January-24-15, 02:52 PM

The best thing I saw come from a Presbyterian church was a huge sign in front of one in Ithaca that said in plain white on black "Torture is not a policy". It is never about survival. By protecting Nazi refugees and adopting their research and tactics we never "won" WW2. Their cruel ideology won when we adopted it.
Better still, it's about living with yourself. I'd rather die on my feet for what I believe in [[die for not kill for), than just "do anything it takes" [[notice how Malcolm X became the "real threat" when he was no longer "scary negro on the T.V.", ditched that ideology, and adopted a more peaceful abiding of things. That's when the threats and phone calls came with very accurate precision. Yet, Gandhi, Oscar Romero, MLK, and countless others got treated the same way by the unabiding and viral nature of others worked up by a demonic idealogy that they are sadly blind to.) just to lengthen my "tiny span" on this poisoned mudball planet. It becomes a classic "end justifys the means" argument, which is no argument, it's just plain fallacy. Plus, as past incidents have shown with Inquisitions, police "third degree", and recently with the Senate report on CIA torture [["recruitment of black Muslims in Montana"?), torture isn't effective for gathering much in accuracy.
I think anyone actually considering torture really needs a serious time-out to reflect upon just what it is they are supporting. No revenge or the escalation that results from it nor upholding any subtle inklings of pride are worth violating any aspect of the Golden Rule. Just how convoluted and twisted up have you allowed yourself to become. You will be no different than those they deem as their "violent or ugly enemy". You think anyone as a child ever wanted to grow up to become a monster or enemy of anyone? Quit sputtering and spouting about "them them them" and look at what "you you you" are considering. If you can not do this, than I can't force change on you. I can only hope God "grants" you that "time out" to seriously look deep at what you are avoiding to consider.

By the way, how do having fighter drones flown by remote control really make us the "home of the brave"?

**Gpwrangler** · February-04-15, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by TKshreve

It's certainly a good topic to discuss. On one hand, I have zero sympathy for extremists without morals - those who kill in the name of their god. Fucking charlatans. I also believe that [[through torture) the US distances itself from what it has always tried to exemplify; freedom.

You have to acknowledge the fact that it is 2014 and it's a much different, scarier world out there. It requires special considerations and unique tactics to overcome an enemy that has evolved into a cowardly beast intent upon harming/killing anyone who does not conform to their ways of life. There is no consideration for the innocent - in fact the innocent are prime targets due to the high profile that accompanies their deaths. Sickening it has come to this.

...and it just got a lot sicker.