Are You Better Or Worse Off Since B.O. Became Prez?

**Detroitej72** · July-30-09, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by ccbatson

Easy, financially worse from investments, more concerningly, we are all poorer by virtue of the most precious commodity...liberty.

Where was your out-cry when you were loosing all your liberties under your man Bush?

Spare us the phony outrage.

**Papasito** · July-30-09, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by Bigb23

You make it sound like the Trillions are already out there and have been spent. In fact very little has been used so far.

Thats one of the big excuses, that most of the stimulus money wont be spent for another year or two. but thats not helping us now.

Originally Posted by Detroitej72

Where was your out-cry when you were loosing all your liberties under your man Bush?

The blame falls on both parties, and for far too long. As we all know, the President only has limited power, Congress has the rest. And then there's the Judges making policy from the bench. Both our parties have sold us out a long time ago, and we are seeing the results.

Lobbyists and special interests are still running rampant in Washington, and nothing is really going to change other then the apparant expansion of Government for a population that can't afford to maintain it. It's hard to be positive when everyone is bracing for worse, and not recovering.

**gibran** · July-30-09, 07:20 PM

a post note to the above discussion: what would life be like with four more years of a Bush like presidency?
Drums of War in Iran with the neocons leading the charge? Middle-east stalemate [[even though some are seeing the games are being played again: BIBI's right-wingers stalling and building)...still waiting for the Iraqi's to use their monies to pay for their war of independence...we would be far worse off with McCain's assessment of the economy.
And I agree with the above poster..look at Insurance and Drug Lobbies, APIAC and AMA they are still running amuck...and that is what needs to be changed...for all parties.

ccbatson · July-31-09, 12:26 AM

What liberties did you or I lose under GWB?

Remember the most important liberty is the right to dispose of the results of your individual efforts so long as this does not encroach on someone else's rights, as you please.

**reddog289** · July-31-09, 12:34 AM

No BETTER, No WORSE.. More CC debt, Yet at least the only MARVIN I talk to is my Uncle.

ccbatson · July-31-09, 12:36 AM

More debt isn't worse?

**reddog289** · August-01-09, 01:58 AM

It is but ain't everyone

ccbatson · August-01-09, 10:05 PM

No, not everyone. You said no better and no worse but more debt, and then you say that more debt is worse, so isn't your overall answer that you [[and by your later reply, everyone) are worse off?

**firstandten** · August-03-09, 12:14 PM

For questions such as this unless you put some context into the question it is meaningless and doesn't enlighten or educate us. For example, if you were better off a year ago or worst off now one needs to understand the forces at work that caused that outcome.

The implicit assumption behind that question is that Obama promised change and he's not bringing it.

I maintain that for reasons that we discussed many times on this forum, our economic health, our jobs etc was a house of cards held up by housing bubbles, consumer debt etc until it collaspsed and this had been going on for years.

Now you have a president who could have followed the same script and created more bubbles and maybe in the short run you would have been better off for a short time. but the change he's talking about is a more substantial foundation rather than a house of cards. Or course investments, and a reallocation of resources is needed for this to happen.

So the bottom line is that its going to take time, and money for this to change.

Whats working against Obama is politics and the deficit.

Even the deficit needs to be put in perpective. Years of "starving the beast" has given the president very little wiggle room to build a substantial foundation. The resultant fear mongering makes "change" a political hot potato.

My feelings are that we are on the correct course, we just need to stay the course.

**gibran** · August-03-09, 12:29 PM

why are we in such debt? I agree no short fixes. Real solutions takes time and staying power something the " i need mine now" crowd doesnt get...

**firstandten** · August-03-09, 01:04 PM

Originally Posted by gibran

why are we in such debt? I agree no short fixes. Real solutions takes time and staying power something the " i need mine now" crowd doesnt get...

In the eight years after Clinton, the Bush administration used the "starve the beast" approach first used by Reagan and his economic advisor David Stockman. This approach cuts taxes and increases spending which in time will create massive deficits. This makes the public happy because taxes are reduced, and you can still spend to keep certain conservative voters happy or say we can't afford social safety nets for the folks you don't care about and of course you spend for national defense especially after 9-11. Once the reigns of government is handed back over to the Dems they are looking at a massive amount of debt and Republicans hollering about generational debt that our grandkids will need to pay off. Great talking points that help Republicans win elections.

Plus in this case Obama had to deal with a potential collaspe of the national [[maybe world) economy, something Clinton didn't have to deal coming behind HW Bush who used the same philosophy. Therefore, Clinton was able to leave office with the country in a surplus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starve_the_beast

**Jimaz** · August-03-09, 01:14 PM

Are You Better Or Worse Off Since B.O. Became Prez?

'Bout the same. For historical perspective, I was best off after Jimmy Carter became president and worst off after George W. Bush became president.

I'm not claiming those presidents necessarily influenced my situation though. That just happens to be the truth in my case.

**EMG** · August-03-09, 02:35 PM

I haven't personally been affected yet one way or the other. However, I strongly suspect that the only people who are going to come out of this "better off" in the long run are those who don't work for a living. I predict a MASSIVE Republican revolt in '10 sort of like what we got after Carter and Clinton, once the real workers start doing their tax returns.

ccbatson · August-03-09, 03:14 PM

Amen EMG...but this time, maybe we can retain the knowledge from the lesson of socialism for a lot longer and avoid history repeating itself. In addition, hopefully this revolution will cull out the Republicans that are milder statists that spend like crazy.

**reddog289** · August-03-09, 03:49 PM

The real answer in my case would be worse, Yet IT IS NOT the fault of the President. It would be due to my mortgage going up $177.00 per month.Which has led to my increased use of credit cards instead of cash. On one hand I am better off because my water bill went down with the "HONEYMOONERS" moving out,Yet they also bought alot of the groceries.So there is that added expense. You have to take the good with the bad no matter who is in charge.

**Papasito** · August-04-09, 10:57 AM

All I'm saying is when they guy rides into the White House on a white horse, after promising the world and putting himself on a pedastal, saying he had plans to fix the economy [[hasnt happened yet), plans to pull out of Iraq [[hasnt happened yet), spends trillions of our children's dollars because he said it would fix things in a hurry [[hasnt happened yet), while me and millions of Americans who are normally productive, hard working taxpayers are out of work with no job leads, and employers looking to shrink rather then expand, has made me one disappointed American citizen.

Things are getting worse, not better.
I don't see hundreds of new fruitful businesses sprouting in the ruins of Detroit anytime soon.....
or anywhere else in the country for that matter

I'm sorry to be Debbie Downer here, trust me, I'd prefer to be wrong about all this

**gazhekwe** · August-04-09, 03:08 PM

Debby Papasito, you need to get a reality check. The mess we are in was more than a decade in the making. Expecting it to be fixed in eight months is quite silly. For the record, NPR is reporting the economy has entered what may be the first phase of recovery, coming in for a landing at the bottom of the downturn.

**Sstashmoo** · August-04-09, 03:25 PM

Quote: "NPR is reporting the economy has entered what may be the first phase of recovery"

With the Government pumping Billions of our future earnings into the economy, some things are going to upturn. The fact that the influx is having so little effect should concern us all. The crux of the problem is businesses are still dropping like flies. Gotta have jobs to build an economy. Can't borrow one.

ccbatson · August-04-09, 04:19 PM

Correct again Sstash. Printiong/borrowing money to bolster some numbers is not recovery...actually it is the opposite of recovery and masking its' true nature until it is too late to do anything about it.

**Bobl** · September-01-09, 12:05 PM

S&P 500 index is up about seven percent. We all know that the unemployment rate is horrible, and that it is a lagging indicator. If it is reduced by even a couple points in a year, he [[Obama) can claim that his actions have helped.
The real problem was not the persons who held the presidency, but the 1999 deregulation of the financial industries. It is simply illogical to put the fox in charge of the hen house, as the savings and loan scandal showed us twenty years ago. Turned out, it was merely a trial run!

**ghettopalmetto** · September-01-09, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by Papasito

All I'm saying is when they guy rides into the White House on a white horse, after promising the world and putting himself on a pedastal, saying he had plans to fix the economy [[hasnt happened yet), plans to pull out of Iraq [[hasnt happened yet), spends trillions of our children's dollars because he said it would fix things in a hurry [[hasnt happened yet), while me and millions of Americans who are normally productive, hard working taxpayers are out of work with no job leads, and employers looking to shrink rather then expand, has made me one disappointed American citizen.

Things are getting worse, not better.
I don't see hundreds of new fruitful businesses sprouting in the ruins of Detroit anytime soon.....
or anywhere else in the country for that matter

I've always been of the opinion that crisis spurs innovation. In my own personal experiences, my biggest triumphs have always been a result of a dark period. That's not to say that I regularly invite crisis into my life, but it happens.

What are YOU doing about it, though? Are you thinking about how to apply your skills differently? Learn new skills? Start your own business? Where's your innovation? I've been unemployed--it sucks. But it's not Barack Obama's fault you don't have a job. Get over it and move your ass like the "hard-working American" you say you are.

**rb336** · September-01-09, 01:03 PM

My portfolio is now up 60% from April. I am better off

UFO · September-01-09, 01:12 PM

When it gets close too a %100, may I suggest that you pull it and buy gold because our economy is going to completely tank.

We are far from hitting bottom but don't be fooled,we will. All of us.

The world has been living too long on imaginary currency and now the creators are pulling it from us in the form of a tanking world economy.

This little comeback is only a taste for those that still have a little something to basically hand over their money unwittingly to them.

The suffering and oppression has just begun and m afraid this is their way to reduce the world's population.

They will succeed if we continue to depend on them.

**Sstashmoo** · September-01-09, 01:17 PM

Worse off.

Some of you claim the economy is getting better??????? Where????

Some of you take the "he's only been in office X months" route. As dire as the situation is, his crew should have hit the ground running, they didn't, they don't have a clue. Nafta has been put on the back burner, we are now further obligated to the Chinese government and they are looking for new third world trade partners. We are NOT better off and we are not going to be under the sort of leadership we have seen so far. .

When Reagan took office the economy did an immediate 180 for the better, you wingers can say what ever you want, I know I was there. There was optimism in the air immediately. It isn't the same now. It's hard to be optimistic when the real numbers like unemployment, sing a different song.

I know of several businesses right now that are borrowed to the line and are teetering on the edge of collapse. Their situations are not turning around. Your portfolio is up? So is mine, yipee. The dollar is weaker but we have more of them. Do the math.