So...M1 Officially Having Money Issues Now...

[stinkytofu]

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...ew-fed-funding

[stinkytofu]

I thought this deserved a new thread. I swear - if this thing ever gets built - its story from conception to birth could make like a 400 page epic novel.

[Dexlin]

Cullens wants to have it both ways. At the very worst, they are going to have to dip into their future operational funds, which become less of an obligation for them the quicker the RTA takes this over. They are planning on ten years of operations the article says when the RTA will almost certainly have operational control over the thing before then.

I hope they get the grant, but this sounds more like an engineered crisis than an actual crisis, and Matt pretty much admits as much in the article.

[dmike76]

Ugh.....I don't see how Gilbert and the others can let this fail now. There has been too much money and time put into this. I think it's probably that they'll kick in more money if they have to, but who knows? This is Detroit, after all.

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

Cullens wants to have it both ways. At the very worst, they are going to have to dip into their future operational funds, which become less of an obligation for them the quicker the RTA takes this over. They are planning on ten years of operations the article says when the RTA will almost certainly have operational control over the thing before then.

I hope they get the grant, but this sounds more like an engineered crisis than an actual crisis, and Matt pretty much admits as much in the article.

That is totally accurate. They have the money to build it, but obviously, they'd like more "free money" if they can get it. This really isn't news; most not-for-profits apply for all sorts of government money, and they put forward sob stories and press releases in an attempt to get it. I am 100% in favor of the project, and plan to use. But I don't care if they get this grant. It's coming anyways.

Regarding the story of M1 Rail being novel-worthy, I must say it is not one of the lengthier, costly, or scandalous construction projects in history. A boring book.

[corktownyuppie]

That is totally accurate. They have the money to build it, but obviously, they'd like more "free money" if they can get it. This really isn't news; most not-for-profits apply for all sorts of government money, and they put forward sob stories and press releases in an attempt to get it. I am 100% in favor of the project, and plan to use. But I don't care if they get this grant. It's coming anyways.

Regarding the story of M1 Rail being novel-worthy, I must say it is not one of the lengthier, costly, or scandalous construction projects in history. A boring book.

Yeah, the Big Dig in Boston at $14.6 Billion, billons over original budget, makes M1 Rail look like a routine shopping trip to Target.

[professorscott]

That is totally accurate. They have the money to build it, but obviously, they'd like more "free money" if they can get it. This really isn't news; most not-for-profits apply for all sorts of government money, and they put forward sob stories and press releases in an attempt to get it. I am 100% in favor of the project, and plan to use. But I don't care if they get this grant. It's coming anyways.

Regarding the story of M1 Rail being novel-worthy, I must say it is not one of the lengthier, costly, or scandalous construction projects in history. A boring book.

Agreed. There have been "money issues" since 2007; that will never go away, it is a part of this business. I hope they get it just because the more non-local money that goes into this, the less local money it will need.

To me the interesting challenges of this project are the technical ones: how do we get under the railroad tracks, will an off-wire system actually work in a cold climate, how much can we mitigate the slowing effects of traffic, and so on.

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

As a general principle, I don't agree with funding local things with federal money. Besides dubious constitutional authority for such spending, it just seems to detach responsible behavior from spending money. Every local government, NGO, and politician justifies it with the explanation that we're just getting back what we sent there. But honestly, because the feds can print money and endlessly borrow [[both of which we do), it is more correct to say that we're just getting back what currently unborn people will send there. There is enough money here to build and operate M1 Rail. But why pay for something yourself when you can stick someone else with the bill?

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

Yeah, the Big Dig in Boston at $14.6 Billion, billons over original budget, makes M1 Rail look like a routine shopping trip to Target.

Wait till the book gets written on California's High Speed Rail project! There is neither the money nor the potential for the money, but that is not an impediment to Governor Brown! It's going to be a crazy book called "The Emperor Has No Railroad".

[SDCC]

Wait till the book gets written on California's High Speed Rail project! There is neither the money nor the potential for the money, but that is not an impediment to Governor Brown! It's going to be a crazy book called "The Emperor Has No Railroad".

One of the governor's opponents [[Kashkari) refers to the high speed train as "Jerry's Crazy Train"...which he states will be the first thing he cuts...There was money approved for the project, but I believe the new guess-ta-mates have ballooned by billions.

[bailey]

But even without federal funds, officials of the so-called M-1 project says it would survive — but concede it might have to be scaled back.

Gosh... we've heard that song before now haven't we?

Scaled back to what? Congress to GCP?

[Detroitnerd]

Good. Scrap the plan and do real, center-running rapid transit with decently spaced stops.

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

Good. Scrap the plan and do real, center-running rapid transit with decently spaced stops.

Where would that money come from? And fewer stops will mean less use, I would guess. It's not designed to be rapid transit [[express buses on the freeways would be much faster than street rail).

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

One of the governor's opponents [[Kashkari) refers to the high speed train as "Jerry's Crazy Train"...which he states will be the first thing he cuts...There was money approved for the project, but I believe the new guess-ta-mates have ballooned by billions.

Voters approved $9B when the whole project was estimated to be in the $30B range. After the cost estimate zoomed to $100B, it was scaled back [[to no longer go into downtown LA & San Fran; commuters would have to transfer to different, slower, also unbuilt transit for the ride into town). The scaled back plan disqualified it from receiving the original $9B [[because voters approved the money attached to the plan). The state's agency in charge is being sued left and right by landowners, other transit agencies, farm and environmental groups. Voters of all stripes have overwhelming soured on the project. All Republicans and a good chunk of Democrats [[including Brown's own Lt. Gov.) have publicly denounced it as an ongoing waste of money that won't get built. If everything fell into place today by some miracle, they hope to begin service in 25-30 years.

The ultimate hubris is demonstrated by three things: they will have spent several billion dollars in design, land acquisition, and legal fees for something that doesn't have a future; even the rosiest of scenarios envisioned by its proponents do not suggest that it will take very many cars off the road; and it was always going to be elite transportation for the wealthy. Even subsidized it's projected fare was higher than flying.

California could have spent $9B on significant improvements to local bus and rail service that would be more beneficial for their economy, environment and traffic than this fancifully fake plan ever would have.

[Detroitnerd]

Where would that money come from? And fewer stops will mean less use, I would guess. It's not designed to be rapid transit [[express buses on the freeways would be much faster than street rail).

Easy: Get rid of the corrupt DDA that usurps city taxes, scrap plans for Ilitch's "You Paid For It" arena, take away Danny Boy's $60 million in tax abatements and I think that's more than enough money to build what those poor, benighted rich folks can't.

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

Take Gilbert, Ilitch and downtown developers out of the equation and there would be no need for a train to ever go downtown.

[bailey]

Take Gilbert, Ilitch and downtown developers out of the equation and there would be no need for a train to ever go downtown.

..or the M-1 itself. in spite of all that's wrong with it, they're the only group pushing rail in any form.

[Honky Tonk]

Take Gilbert, Ilitch and downtown developers out of the equation and there would be no need for a train to ever go downtown.

There is no train "going Downtown". It's a 3.3 mile, back and forth delivery service, feeding Ilitchtown and Gilbertville. It's going to do nothing for the rest of Detroiters, it's not the start of Detroit's mass transit system, it's not going to be "mass" or "rapid" transit by any stretch of the imagination.

[Danny]

So this is how mass transit dies, with a thunderous applause. What a way to fleece our dollars to something we don't want.

[Detroitnerd]

Take Gilbert, Ilitch and downtown developers out of the equation and there would be no need for a train to ever go downtown.

Bullshit. Having decent infrastructure would attract REAL developers, not whiney billionaires who need a tax abatement or hundreds of millions of dollars in subsidies to do their jobs ...

[stasu1213]

I had predicted this would happen. Now now everyone doesn't have to rush to kiss my a$& at once. Money issues huh. I had said I heard that Gilbert was having money issues. But what the hell I was being delusional

E

[MikeyinBrooklyn]

There is no train "going Downtown". It's a 3.3 mile, back and forth delivery service, feeding Ilitchtown and Gilbertville. It's going to do nothing for the rest of Detroiters, it's not the start of Detroit's mass transit system, it's not going to be "mass" or "rapid" transit by any stretch of the imagination.

Do you honestly think that the Fox, Comerica Park or the new arena would really lack for visitors if the rail line wasn't built? The first two pack 'em in already. I suspect the arena would do just fine, too. Dan Gilbert seems to be doing rather well for himself, too, without light rail. Did it ever dawn on you Honky Tonk that perhaps they want to share their visitors/employees with the rest of downtown? Yoda was right. Hate does, in fact, lead to the dark side.

[Honky Tonk]

You're so right. That area is packed. There are other needs this City has that require my money and everyone's attention besides the comedy team of Mike & Dan. You're right, both are doing well for themselves. I totally support a viable transportation system not this. Their visitors and employees can use the original People Remover. A 2 block walk will clear their heads after a hard day @ the office.

[stasu1213]

Why not the Governor just go ahead with the Woodward street construction without designing it for the train. I am tired of wearing downthe tires and suspension on my car from driving up Woodward from Adam to Grand Blvd. I am also tired of the bullshit detroiters are put through with the continual planning and canceling of the light rail

[dtowncitylover]

http://m-1rail.com/statement-media-r...-rail-funding/

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL