Tree Farm planting on Detroit's eastside

**boater4life** · May-17-14, 12:54 PM

Let's hope this is a positive start.

http://www.freep.com/article/2014051...-Farms-Detroit

**renf** · May-17-14, 07:22 PM

I was over near the intersection of Goethe and Belevidere this morning. There were
very many people planting trees. The local streets were lined with many cars.

This afternoon, I drove by Clark Park. There were very many people working on the
cleaning of that pleasant park. It sure looked like volunteer day in the Motor City.

**Cliffy** · May-17-14, 10:00 PM

Isn't this guy basically just sitting on land and calling it a tree farm and hoping that one day people might actually want to live there so he can develop it. You have to be a dope to volunteer for this clown.

**BillyBBrew** · May-17-14, 10:17 PM

Just curious Cliffy, What are you doing to curb/eliminate blight in Detroit? Are you paying taxes on otherwise vacant land? Even if you aren't doing that, are you a resident paying city/property/utility taxes to the city? I don't always agree with John Hantz, but he lives in the city, has invested in the city [[for many years), continues to invest and tries to be part of the solution, not the problem. Hantz tried to do a much more involved farming project that involved crops and orchards and all kinds of things, but he was blocked from doing it and the "tree farm" was the compromise. Perhaps he is waiting to cash in, so what? Are you buying the land and building houses or factories? In the meantime, we have clean, mowed lots that are attended to and some sort of taxes are being paid on them, whereas they weren't before. Not perfect, but I'm sure not complaining.

Originally Posted by Cliffy

Isn't this guy basically just sitting on land and calling it a tree farm and hoping that one day people might actually want to live there so he can develop it. You have to be a dope to volunteer for this clown.

**corktownyuppie** · May-17-14, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by Cliffy

Isn't this guy basically just sitting on land and calling it a tree farm and hoping that one day people might actually want to live there so he can develop it. You have to be a dope to volunteer for this clown.

Funny you mention that. Out here on my side of town, you've got the area just north of I-75 from Cass through Woodward where the new hockey arena and adjoining development will be built.

But you've got a handful [[or more) landowners in the area that are holding on to decrepit, blighted buildings that are unsafe inside and out. They're ugly to look at, attract unsavory characters, and all but eliminate "walkability" between downtown/brush park and midtown.

They've been holding onto those properties for a decade or more. And, frankly, if someone was willing to tear them all down and plant trees, I think we all would have been better off.

I tire of hearing of "land grabs". You know what the 2nd most worthless thing in Detroit is? Vacant land. What's the most worthless? Blighted homes which require demolition to become vacant land.

You'll notice in all the bankruptcy proceedings, no one is running around yelling, "Detroit, you're the largest land owner in the city! Why don't you sell off some of that land and pay pensioners with proceeds?"

Why? Because vacant land -- especially in Detroit -- is essentially worthless until someone develops it.

Hell, I wouldn't have a problem with giving away every piece of blighted property for $1 to any developer who agrees to demolish the property or rehabilitate it within 6 months.

The fact that the neighbors in the area are excited is a good sign. And, yes, I hope he makes money. If he makes money, then it will send a signal to other investors that it's safe to invest their money, and we can repeat the process and brighten up another neighborhood.

I get the natural revulsion toward people [[i.e. Moroun) who make money by taking away opportunity from others. But there are businesses that make money and add opportunity for others. This is one of them. A neighborhood looks a little brighter, the streets are a little safer, and someone fronted all the demolition costs to get it done on their own dime.

Win, win, win.

For the rest of you that have been reading a little too much of the World Socialist News [[http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2014.../hant-j22.html), I encourage you to enjoy your stay in imaginary-ville and am happy to welcome you back into the real world whenever you're ready to join us again.

**Vic01** · May-18-14, 05:08 AM

Here's a couple of news stories -

http://www.freep.com/article/2014051...Detroit-blight

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...-future-forest

**Honky Tonk** · May-18-14, 05:25 AM

Originally Posted by BillyBBrew

Just curious Cliffy, What are you doing to curb/eliminate blight in Detroit? Are you paying taxes on otherwise vacant land? Even if you aren't doing that, are you a resident paying city/property/utility taxes to the city? I don't always agree with John Hantz, but he lives in the city, has invested in the city [[for many years), continues to invest and tries to be part of the solution, not the problem. Hantz tried to do a much more involved farming project that involved crops and orchards and all kinds of things, but he was blocked from doing it and the "tree farm" was the compromise. Perhaps he is waiting to cash in, so what? Are you buying the land and building houses or factories? In the meantime, we have clean, mowed lots that are attended to and some sort of taxes are being paid on them, whereas they weren't before. Not perfect, but I'm sure not complaining.

+5, I'm not complaining either, and I welcome the blight removal and the Hantz's Tree Farm. I look @ it this way, if he spends X amount of his time and dollars yearly, to keep it from looking like a dumping ground and for refuse and dead bodies, he's more then paid for his initial purchase, and deserves to reap the benefits, if and when the time comes.

**Honky Tonk** · May-18-14, 05:29 AM

Originally Posted by corktownyuppie

Funny you mention that. Out here on my side of town, you've got the area just north of I-75 from Cass through Woodward where the new hockey arena and adjoining development will be built.

But you've got a handful [[or more) landowners in the area that are holding on to decrepit, blighted buildings that are unsafe inside and out. They're ugly to look at, attract unsavory characters, and all but eliminate "walkability" between downtown/brush park and midtown.

They've been holding onto those properties for a decade or more. And, frankly, if someone was willing to tear them all down and plant trees, I think we all would have been better off.

I tire of hearing of "land grabs". You know what the 2nd most worthless thing in Detroit is? Vacant land. What's the most worthless? Blighted homes which require demolition to become vacant land.

You'll notice in all the bankruptcy proceedings, no one is running around yelling, "Detroit, you're the largest land owner in the city! Why don't you sell off some of that land and pay pensioners with proceeds?"

Why? Because vacant land -- especially in Detroit -- is essentially worthless until someone develops it.

Hell, I wouldn't have a problem with giving away every piece of blighted property for $1 to any developer who agrees to demolish the property or rehabilitate it within 6 months.

The fact that the neighbors in the area are excited is a good sign. And, yes, I hope he makes money. If he makes money, then it will send a signal to other investors that it's safe to invest their money, and we can repeat the process and brighten up another neighborhood.

I get the natural revulsion toward people [[i.e. Moroun) who make money by taking away opportunity from others. But there are businesses that make money and add opportunity for others. This is one of them. A neighborhood looks a little brighter, the streets are a little safer, and someone fronted all the demolition costs to get it done on their own dime.

Win, win, win.

For the rest of you that have been reading a little too much of the World Socialist News [[http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2014.../hant-j22.html), I encourage you to enjoy your stay in imaginary-ville and am happy to welcome you back into the real world whenever you're ready to join us again.

Excellent post. No one brings up the fact that about 20 years ago, the City was selling land for $1 and homes for $500. No one was screaming then.

**Zacha341** · May-18-14, 06:18 AM

If that is what he is doing, he has 'it like that' in as much as the land is purchased, was unused previously -- in come the trees. Pretty clever if his motive is as you state.

Originally Posted by Cliffy

Isn't this guy basically just sitting on land and calling it a tree farm and hoping that one day people might actually want to live there so he can develop it. You have to be a dope to volunteer for this clown.

**antongast** · May-18-14, 11:33 AM

Okay, fine, everybody loves Hantz and his project is great and people with concerns about it are delusional commies. I get all that. Par for the course on this board, really. But even if you love Hantz and love his project, why on earth would you work for him for free? If nobody showed up to volunteer, he might have actually had to create some jobs like he said he was going to. Then you could show up and do the same thing and actually get compensated for it. Or conversely, if you want to do some volunteer work, why not volunteer for a reputable nonprofit that actually needs your help instead of a rich businessman who just doesn't feel like paying his employees? I mean, hey, your time is yours and by all means use it how you want. I just don't get it.

GUSHI · May-18-14, 12:01 PM

He did create jobs, demolishing homes, buildings, cleaning the area up----alot of haters on the thread.

**antongast** · May-18-14, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by GUSHI

alot of haters on the thread.

Not really.

**Gannon** · May-18-14, 12:19 PM

Who could've imagined that the modern capitalist plantation would have volunteer slaves?!

It is ridiculously funny to me that anyone would volunteer to be the raw labor for anyone else's million-dollar scheme. For free.

Sorry, no hating. Just keepin' it real.

GUSHI · May-18-14, 03:34 PM

The people volunteering to improve the neighborhood, which the tree farm does. I like the idea, and I'm sure most of the neighborhood does also. let me see burned down house and old tires or trees, I pick trees.

**unclefrank** · May-18-14, 03:44 PM

Did they get fed lunch?

**DetroiterOnTheWestCoast** · May-18-14, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by Cliffy

Isn't this guy basically just sitting on land and calling it a tree farm and hoping that one day people might actually want to live there so he can develop it. You have to be a dope to volunteer for this clown.

From the Free Press article linked by Vic01:

A resident of the district, Ray Anderson, who has lived on Holcomb for 56 years, echoed Hantz’s enthusiasm.
“Oh man, it means everything,” Anderson said. “Compared to the way it was and the way it is now since John and his group have come in, it’s just fantastic. Gives you new hope for a better future for the city.”

I'm sure Cliffy is having just as big of a positive impact in the area.

**ABetterDetroit** · May-18-14, 08:31 PM

Never bought in that urban farming was a serious economic stimulator for the D.
One thing is for sure though, if you are hoping for a real estate investment to pay off planting trees is a pretty dumb idea. Putting any more money on what is purely a speculative market makes zero sense. That fact of which is clearly evident around town.

**Cliffy** · May-18-14, 08:44 PM

Look. I don't care if he plants a tree farm but the idiots who lined up to plant trees for him are dumb. Channel 7 made a huge deal about this volunteer effort like it was some great cause. It was nothing but free labor for Hantz. Instead of hiring workers, he got a bunch of idiots who dedicated their saturday to planting trees on land that will eventually be developed and will make Hantz rich. I guess its not different than the fools who clean up the train station for free. I need a couple of those people over my house on the weekend.

**Cliffy** · May-18-14, 08:47 PM

Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

Never bought in that urban farming was a serious economic stimulator for the D.
One thing is for sure though, if you are hoping for a real estate investment to pay off planting trees is a pretty dumb idea. Putting any more money on what is purely a speculative market makes zero sense. That fact of which is clearly evident around town.

The only reason he got all this land was because of his "tree farm" because if he was honest, the city council would not have awarded him anything. I can't believe people don't remember all the stories about this a couple years ago.

GUSHI · May-18-14, 09:11 PM

It was vacant and run down,now its clean, I personally don't care if he make millions because of it 25 years from now,

**ABetterDetroit** · May-18-14, 09:14 PM

LMAO! You and me both brother, planting trees is not my idea of a fun weekend. Hantz is already rich tho, and your right, he could have hired more folks to plant the trees but then the media wouldn't have made their big story about the crew who spent the summer planting trees.

**Hypestyles** · May-18-14, 09:45 PM

what are the areas that could be cleared out to reveal creeks?

**Vic01** · May-18-14, 11:02 PM

Originally Posted by Gannon

Who could've imagined that the modern capitalist plantation would have volunteer slaves?!

It is ridiculously funny to me that anyone would volunteer to be the raw labor for anyone else's million-dollar scheme. For free.

Sorry, no hating. Just keepin' it real.

The News article link that I put up said that people showed up ready to work and found "pre-dug holes and tiny wisps of trees"... 1000 to 1200 volunteers for 15,000 little twigs placed in holes already there, kick a bit of dirt back in... hardly "slave" labor, barely "labor" at all. More likely just a good excuse to be outdoors for a hour or two with some good people who'd like to see more green trees amidst the concrete...

**Honky Tonk** · May-19-14, 06:51 AM

I finally drove around Hantz's Farm area yesterday. First off, the area is no prize. I can't see him "making billions of dollars once the land becomes valuble", in this lifetime. Even waterfront property in Detroit apparently isn't THAT valuble. Second, that is one hell of a clean-up job they did. The area now looks great, even the locals don't have an issue with it. There is a basketball court in the middle of it that got refurbed, there were kids shooting hoops and had pick-up games going. Gannon, go down to Recycle Here, and get yourself one of those dictionaries from the book recycle box. They're free, it won't even cost you $11. You'll be able to look up the meaning of big words like "voluteer" and "slavery". It'll help you when you post.

**oladub** · May-19-14, 08:55 AM

Originally Posted by Cliffy

Look. I don't care if he plants a tree farm but the idiots who lined up to plant trees for him are dumb. Channel 7 made a huge deal about this volunteer effort like it was some great cause. It was nothing but free labor for Hantz. Instead of hiring workers, he got a bunch of idiots who dedicated their saturday to planting trees on land that will eventually be developed and will make Hantz rich. I guess its not different than the fools who clean up the train station for free. I need a couple of those people over my house on the weekend.

Give an example of how those people planting trees could have been better spending their time; watching tv, shopping, or what? What were you doing during the same time frame that was so much less idiotic?