What does the future hold for East English Village?

**YounginDetroit** · February-10-14, 03:18 PM

I've been considering the East English Village area to buy a home is and I just have a few question.1)What does the future hold for the neighborhood, like retail on the main roads.2) How is the Morningside area, it seems much cheaper and was wondering why.3) What does the future outlook convey? Will the prices go up as in the 7 mile/Livernois area did?.Anything you can add would be greatly appreciated.

**Ben** · February-10-14, 03:49 PM

YounginDetroit,
1) I think that the neighborhood's residential parts have a great future and have stabilized since the housing crisis. The commercial strip on Mack isn't really doing that well but that is not really that big of a deal.
2) Morningside used to be a lot like EEV. I lived my first 14 years there, my grandparents lived there and when they died my parents moved into their house. When my parents died in 1992 I moved in. I lived there from 1992-1995 and a lot changed in that time. I now live in GPW. It really is sad to see how abandoned parts of Morningside are now.

**GP For Life** · February-10-14, 04:33 PM

The area bounded by Chandler/Moross/Mack/E.Warren/Canyon looks like it's on the upswing. That is to say, it didn't look that bad in the housing crisis, but it certainly got hit. Now it is clearly on the uptick. I would look there, but in a few recent drives through the area, I didn't see any "For Sale" signs.

The commercial area of Mack seems to be doing a lot better than others, as well.

**TKshreve** · February-10-14, 04:49 PM

I have a friend who lives in EEV, as do his parents. They have resided there for well over 35 years. We had a lengthy discussion on this very subject, and he would tell you that EEV is in the worst shape it has been since he was born ~35 years ago.

I really tried to play the devils advocate with him, because EEV is considered by many to be one of Detroit's jewels amongst all of its neighborhoods. He did not budge on his stance, and admitted that their was a small, but very obvious change in the residents over the years. The sort of people that make neighborly types not want to hang out after dark.

Having said that, there are still intact blocks with residents. The housing stock still looks very good, and I imagine you could find a really good deal. I would take a close look at potential neighbors living adjacent to your target house, as that can suggest a lot about what the future holds should you find a real winner.

Re: Morningside, well that ship sailed years ago. The housing looks like swiss cheese on some of the poorest stretches, but I'm sure their are still a few steals in there as well.

**poobert** · February-10-14, 04:52 PM

EEV is bordered by Mack, Cadieux, East Outer Drive/Whittier, and Harper.

I live in EEV. This thread comes up every few months. I'll give you my honest assessment as a resident:

EEV is on the upswing. Things got a little hairy during the foreclosure crisis but vacancies have gone down steadily while home prices have increased steadily for the past couple years. Overall, it is still one of the best places to live in Detroit, and even in the Metro area, for a working to middle class person.

Of course, DPS still sucks. A lot of kids go to St. Clare of Montefalco right at Mack and East Outer Drive. Crime is very low by city standards.

That said, residential is nice, but you're still heavily dependent on Grosse Pointe or Mack Avenue for commercial. There are a few nice spots within walking distance of EEV though, like Cadieux Cafe and Blue Pointe Restaurant. Anyway, the commercial areas of Detroit generally suck and so does East Warren Avenue and Harper.

I'd recommend it, anyway. It ain't Birmingham but it's pretty nice.

If you want to know why Morningside is cheaper, drive down Harvard [[EEV). You will find almost entirely well-kept homes, with maybe one or two vacancies per block. Then drive down Buckingham [[Morningside). You will find the exact opposite - blocks of almost entirely ramshackle homes, with maybe one or two occupied houses per block. That's why.

Audubon is still a nice looking street [[Morningside) but they don't have the strong community organization the EEV does.

www.eastenglishvillage.org

**jt1** · February-10-14, 05:03 PM

I'll summarize how this thread will go:

Resident of EEV; It is a nice community, it has it's challenges but we are a tight knit community that looks out for each other.

Non-resident suburbanite: I wouldn't move there. It is dangerous and going downhill. Only live there if you want to get shot

Resident: That is not accurate. Feel free to come to our community meetings and get a feel for the community.

Non-resident suburbanite: I would but it stinks and I'm afraid of the area

Bham: Census figures show it sucks and will continue to suck. If you add any real experience I will just point out you are wrong and I'm right.

Resident: You can think what you want but my family and friends enjoy it here.

Suburbanite: That's because you have likely never been anywhere and don't know better. My friend's cousin's sister's mother was carjacked there in 1982 so I would never go back and nobody should live there.

Poobert: I live here and like it and would invite anyone down to see the neighborhood and people.

Suburbanite: Avoid it at all costs, even though you asked about EEV, here is a list of suburbs you should consider.

Bham: Half of those suburbs suck and the census data can be found to prove it.

Repeat this about 4-5 times and then the thread dies.

Personally, I like EEV and the people I know that live there love it and are very vested in their community.

**sumas** · February-10-14, 05:21 PM

I lived in EEV from 1963 to 1975, my folks home. When my dad died and my mother started to ail, we moved in and took care of her from 2002 til she died 2011. Charming neighborhood! Great community support. We still live in Detroit and our son bought her home from the estate. He has no complaints. Good solid community.

**pgn421** · February-10-14, 07:09 PM

Lived on Bishop off of Mack for 43 years. It was a great mix of people. Houses are well built. We never had a problem

**poobert** · February-10-14, 10:26 PM

Originally Posted by jt1

I'll summarize how this thread will go:

Resident of EEV; It is a nice community, it has it's challenges but we are a tight knit community that looks out for each other.

Non-resident suburbanite: I wouldn't move there. It is dangerous and going downhill. Only live there if you want to get shot

Resident: That is not accurate. Feel free to come to our community meetings and get a feel for the community.

Non-resident suburbanite: I would but it stinks and I'm afraid of the area

Bham: Census figures show it sucks and will continue to suck. If you add any real experience I will just point out you are wrong and I'm right.

Resident: You can think what you want but my family and friends enjoy it here.

Suburbanite: That's because you have likely never been anywhere and don't know better. My friend's cousin's sister's mother was carjacked there in 1982 so I would never go back and nobody should live there.

Poobert: I live here and like it and would invite anyone down to see the neighborhood and people.

Suburbanite: Avoid it at all costs, even though you asked about EEV, here is a list of suburbs you should consider.

Bham: Half of those suburbs suck and the census data can be found to prove it.

Repeat this about 4-5 times and then the thread dies.

Personally, I like EEV and the people I know that live there love it and are very vested in their community.

You should get the Medal of Honor and this thread should be closed. I promise not to interfere anymore since all has been said so succinctly.. OP, talk to a Realtor, and after reading this post, incinerate your computer and never come back to DYes again. Perhaps I will see you as a neighbor someday.

**Danny** · February-10-14, 10:31 PM

What's the future of East English Village?

1. It's going to be 90% black by 2020.

2. There's going to be a wall of demarcation separating THE FIVE RICHVILLES from Detroit hoods by closing off most of its neighborhood streets and main roads.

3. It will quite ghetto-like with some vacant homes meant for looting and squatting. I have seen some of them living those homes while I was walking down that area.

**softailrider** · February-10-14, 11:35 PM

A few months ago there were two fires in vacant VPS'ed houses over the course of a weekend. The VPS stuff was torn off and both those places were torched. I was surprised, that type of crap usually doesn't happen over there.

**sumas** · February-11-14, 03:58 AM

Originally Posted by Danny

What's the future of East English Village?

1. It's going to be 90% black by 2020.

2. There's going to be a wall of demarcation separating THE FIVE RICHVILLES from Detroit hoods by closing off most of its neighborhood streets and main roads.

3. It will quite ghetto-like with some vacant homes meant for looting and squatting. I have seen some of them living those homes while I was walking down that area.

Danny boy. I will never understand you. Ghetto simply means an aggregate of like minded people. EEV is already mostly black, I graduated Finney in 1971, it was mostly black. It is a fine community in EEV. The wall you talk about already exists. So don't really know your point.

**ct_alum** · February-11-14, 06:34 AM

I know that i am going to get hammered, but EEV is on the way down. We have lived on Bishop since 2001. Area was fine then, not so much now. We have had squatters and renters that are sysytematically breaking into the houses in the neighborhood and are standing in front of their houses openly slinging dope in the dead of winter. DPD has done nothing, despite being given the exasct addresses of the problem houses - One can only wonder what it will be like during the summer. I would move, but my house is currently worth <1/2 of what we paid for it in 2001.

One of the reasons we bought in EEV is that the houses are much better than what we could have got in the suburbs for the same amount of money [[back then), i.e., brick with Pewabic tiles in the foyer, and etc. No school-age children, so the schools were not a considerstion.

If you are determined, please walk/drive the blocks where you are considering and look for who is out and about, how many houses are for rent and how many are vacant. You can get a good value as far as the housing stock is concerned, but the "neighbors" may make it untenable.

Before the slings and arrows start flying, people should know that we bought a house further up Bishop a few years ago that had been vacant for 3+ years, totally rehabbed it and sold it to a older couple, basically breaking even. We are currently working on another house near Morningside which will definitely be another break even/losing proposition, so our commitment to the area in specific and COD in general should not be questioned - It is becoming a matter of personal safety; one shouldn't have to keep a 9mm in their pocket when cutting the grass/shoveling snow in order to feel secure.

For the most part, the neighbors who have been there a long time are great and look out for each other, but the issue is that they shouldn't have to.

**bailey** · February-11-14, 07:44 AM

Originally Posted by sumas

I lived in EEV from 1963 to 1975, my folks home. When my dad died and my mother started to ail, we moved in and took care of her from 2002 til she died 2011. Charming neighborhood! Great community support. We still live in Detroit and our son bought her home from the estate. He has no complaints. Good solid community.

...but how does one live with all the road closures and stifling racism emanating from the GPs?

**Honky Tonk** · February-11-14, 07:49 AM

Originally Posted by YounginDetroit

I've been considering the East English Village area to buy a home is and I just have a few question.1)What does the future hold for the neighborhood, like retail on the main roads.2) How is the Morningside area, it seems much cheaper and was wondering why.3) What does the future outlook convey? Will the prices go up as in the 7 mile/Livernois area did?.Anything you can add would be greatly appreciated.

Anytime you buy property in Detroit, it's a crapshoot, no matter what people tell you, or how rosy of a picture they paint. There are a lot of good people still living in Detroit, but it's the ass-hats that ruin it for everyone. I don't know where you're from or what you're used to, but be aware, no matter what part of the City you buy in, there's going to be a certain amount of Detroit B/S you're going to have to deal with. I don't know what your time frame for purchase is, but my advice would be to wait until the weather really breaks, and make multiple trips into and through the neighborhoods you have in mind, and @ different times. In other words, drive around on Friday & Saturday nights. Drive around mid-week, after working hours, mid-day. Stop into neighborhood party stores & gas stations, have lunch @ neighborhood restaurants. Try to get a realistic, honest, feel for the neighborhood you're considering. That'll tell you if it'll work for you.

**sumas** · February-11-14, 08:55 AM

Originally Posted by bailey

...but how does one live with all the road closures and stifling racism emanating from the GPs?

Bailey, kiss my ass.

**sumas** · February-11-14, 08:58 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

Anytime you buy property in Detroit, it's a crapshoot, no matter what people tell you, or how rosy of a picture they paint. There are a lot of good people still living in Detroit, but it's the ass-hats that ruin it for everyone. I don't know where you're from or what you're used to, but be aware, no matter what part of the City you buy in, there's going to be a certain amount of Detroit B/S you're going to have to deal with. I don't know what your time frame for purchase is, but my advice would be to wait until the weather really breaks, and make multiple trips into and through the neighborhoods you have in mind, and @ different times. In other words, drive around on Friday & Saturday nights. Drive around mid-week, after working hours, mid-day. Stop into neighborhood party stores & gas stations, have lunch @ neighborhood restaurants. Try to get a realistic, honest, feel for the neighborhood you're considering. That'll tell you if it'll work for you.

HonkeyTonk is right and very level as to what to expect. City life is not for the weak.

**Hermod** · February-11-14, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by sumas

HonkeyTonk is right and very level as to what to expect. City life is not for the weak.

It was not always that way.

**sumas** · February-11-14, 09:27 AM

Originally Posted by Hermod

It was not always that way.

You are right. I remember the city that was, what it became and look forward to what it will be.

**Honky Tonk** · February-11-14, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by sumas

bailey, kiss my ass.

sumas!!!!!!!

**Honky Tonk** · February-11-14, 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by Hermod

It was not always that way.

You are absolutely correct. But, as we say in the 'hood, "it is what it is".......

**EASTSIDE CAT 67-83** · February-11-14, 09:40 AM

I chose a few choice comments from this thread...

"there are still intact blocks with residents."

Sounds like a post WWII bombing run battle damage assessment report

"one shouldn't have to keep a 9mm in their pocket when cutting the grass/shoveling snow in order to feel secure."

Sounds like someone who may feel their life is in danger while doing normal home maintenance activities.

I have close family that recently moved out of their home on Bishop after 40 years, the home was long paid off and they loved the house, but they could no longer stand what was happening out on the sidewalk and beyond. They no longer felt safe in their home. To answer your question about the future of EEV IMHO it is dying a very slow death...will it ever look the way the other side of Alter road looks like, probably not but it sure has some of those same symptoms on many of its streets and the crime stats to boot. The question you have to ask yourself is, are you will to accept the potential risk on your investment and your quality of life, you may get lucky and find a nice pocket but how long will it last. I love Detroit but I'm also a realist.

**Eber Brock Ward** · February-11-14, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by jt1

I'll summarize how this thread will go:

Resident of EEV; It is a nice community, it has it's challenges but we are a tight knit community that looks out for each other.

Non-resident suburbanite: I wouldn't move there. It is dangerous and going downhill. Only live there if you want to get shot

Resident: That is not accurate. Feel free to come to our community meetings and get a feel for the community.

Non-resident suburbanite: I would but it stinks and I'm afraid of the area

Bham: Census figures show it sucks and will continue to suck. If you add any real experience I will just point out you are wrong and I'm right.

Resident: You can think what you want but my family and friends enjoy it here.

Suburbanite: That's because you have likely never been anywhere and don't know better. My friend's cousin's sister's mother was carjacked there in 1982 so I would never go back and nobody should live there.

Poobert: I live here and like it and would invite anyone down to see the neighborhood and people.

Suburbanite: Avoid it at all costs, even though you asked about EEV, here is a list of suburbs you should consider.

Bham: Half of those suburbs suck and the census data can be found to prove it.

Repeat this about 4-5 times and then the thread dies.

Personally, I like EEV and the people I know that live there love it and are very vested in their community.

Lowell should just post this on the home page and shut everything else down, so he can save on the hosting charges!

**Honky Tonk** · February-11-14, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by Eber Brock Ward

Lowell should just post this on the home page and shut everything else down, so he can save on the hosting charges!

Yeah, Thanx. Where would we all go?

**elrick** · February-11-14, 03:19 PM

East English Village is still a great neighborhood where people look after each other. The Village shopping district in Grosse Pointe is within walking distance, and you're close to all the highways.
If you're worried about security, get a dog that barks. At night, be sure to park your car in the backyard, behind a gate.
Public education is tricky, but if you have kids pre-K through 8, St. Clare School is a superb option -- one you might make even if the public schools were more reliable.