Detroit buses to get fixed with federal dollars

**Vic01** · December-11-13, 06:23 AM

[[WXYZ) - DDOT bus passengers like Edward Prowell are happy to hear more than $40 million in federal grant money is now going to be spent to fix buses. "I use the bus 6 days a week...going to work. Sometimes the busses don't come and sometimes they do" he says. "Somebody is late for work, or can't make it and their boss don't want to hear that."
We found some out-of-service motor coaches sitting in a garage off of Warren.
It's not a shock to other passengers.
"The brakes are horrible. You can hear them. Horrible. You can hear it right now." Passenger Aunyez Leonard tells us. "The seats need to be fixed, the heat they don't have it on."
"There's been a disinvestment in our assets over the last two decades," says Gary Brown, the Chief Financial Officer for Detroit.
Now, money can fix tires, engines, windows, security and a lot more. It's all essential when 40 percent of citizens use DDOT daily.
"Things are starting to turn around now for the best, and we need a shot in the arm and this will help the city a whole lot" says Edward.

Read more: http://www.wxyz.com/dpp/news/detroit...#ixzz2nAG0kGt1

**Danny** · December-11-13, 10:26 AM

YEAH RIGHT! If I see new D-DOT busses pack with transit police and cameras I will believe it. Giver about 10 years and we will have this new items on all D-DOT busses.

**downtownguy** · December-11-13, 01:29 PM

Is that correct?

It's all essential when 40 percent of citizens use DDOT daily. - Gary Brown, Detroit CFO.

I have no doubt many people in the city don't have cars. But 40 percent of all citizens ride the DDOT daily? Then again, I never believed anything Brown had to say when he was on City Council.

**cramerro** · December-11-13, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by downtownguy

Is that correct?

I have no doubt many people in the city don't have cars. But 40 percent of all citizens ride the DDOT daily? Then again, I never believed anything Brown had to say when he was on City Council.

Their ridership is supposedly somewhere in the vicinity of 100,000 daily. Even giving the benefit of the doubt that those are unique riders [[which they aren't, they're trips each way counted once, so that's 50,000 round trips daily), they'd need three times that much to get to 40% of 700,000. Possible ways 40% is true??? [[1) Brown knows the real population, which is now only 250,000, [[2) they're intentionally mis-counting or under-reporting their ridership [[which would cost them and the region formula funds) by 2/3, [[3) "Citizens" means something other than everyone. I say 86.5% of DetroitYES posters didn't believe him in the first place.

**professorscott** · December-11-13, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by cramerro

I say 86.5% of DetroitYES posters didn't believe him in the first place.

Well, as you know, 76.2% of all statistics are just made up.

**stasu1213** · December-11-13, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by downtownguy;414133

Is that correct?

I have no doubt many people in the city don't have cars. But 40 percent of all citizens ride the DDOT daily? Then again, I never believed anything Brown had to say when he was on City Council.

I say that it is about 50 percent of citizens ride DDot

**trstar** · December-11-13, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

I say that it is about 50 percent of citizens ride DDot

I know that 98% of you are pull numbers out of your arse.

**Chicago48** · December-12-13, 07:14 AM

Originally Posted by trstar

I know that 98% of you are pull numbers out of your arse.

$40 Million to FIX busses? That's enough to buy new busses.

**Honky Tonk** · December-12-13, 08:35 AM

Originally Posted by professorscott

Well, as you know, 76.2% of all statistics are just made up.

I've read that in 33% of all posts.

**sumas** · December-12-13, 09:41 AM

I've thought about this so I counted up our residents on our block [[spacious residential) 28 people, 6 cars. 2 use the bus daily, the rest frequently. You do the math.

The next block up is high density and occupied. If it was summer I'd do a nose count, but I expect that the stats are quite similar

**401don** · December-12-13, 10:07 AM

According to Wiki Detroit's 109,000 daily riders puts it 26th in the country, well behind such thriving urban centers as Fort Lauderdale.

**cramerro** · December-12-13, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by Chicago48

$40 Million to FIX busses? That's enough to buy new busses.

They have a LOT of buses to fix...

That Great Guy · December-12-13, 05:47 PM

When the new RTA takes over DDOT and SMART they will need these buses to work, so they can pass the 3 or 4 County Car Registration Tax Increase to operate a regional transit system including commuter rail.

Do you agree to this?

**Eber Brock Ward** · December-13-13, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by That Great Guy

When the new RTA takes over DDOT and SMART they will need these buses to work, so they can pass the 3 or 4 County Car Registration Tax Increase to operate a regional transit system including commuter rail.

Do you agree to this?

Unlikely in the near- or mid-term. Under the RTA Act, the RTA cannot take over any legacy costs "including, but not limited to, costs associated with any authority or agency’s litigation, claims, assessments, worker’s compensation awards or charges, swap losses, pensions, health care, or other postemployment benefits of a public transportation provider" without the following happening:

1. Unanimous vote of the RTA Board to put it on the ballot [[good luck getting Oakland/Macomb's board members on board); and then
2. A "yes" vote from a majority in each county in the RTA region. Same issue, but even less likely.

Maybe[[!) with SMART. Maybe. But DDOT, not a snowball's chance in hell under the current RTA Act.

That Great Guy · December-18-13, 06:52 PM

ACT 51 which is the ten percent of the State fuel tax for existing mass transit is a dead issue at this time. And you all will see this with both the Federal and State fuel taxes possibly doubling, unless you get in writing first for safe public community transit service to get some of this money. It won't happen on it's own.

**DetroitPlanner** · December-18-13, 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by That Great Guy

ACT 51 which is the ten percent of the State fuel tax for existing mass transit is a dead issue at this time. And you all will see this with both the Federal and State fuel taxes possibly doubling, unless you get in writing first for safe public community transit service to get some of this money. It won't happen on it's own.

There is no active legislation to increase either fuel taxes. Incidentally Act 51's portion for transit is based on 10 percent of the pre-1997 gasoline tax. So it is 1.5 cents per gallon. If it was actually ten percent then it would be 1.9 cents per gallon going to transit. Since Act 51 is based on set price per gallon, and that has not increased, as fuel economy improves this means less money being generated for transit now than there was 15 years ago. This is one of the chief reasons why there have been so many cutbacks in service. This is also the reason why operating costs are key in determining what level of service we as Michiganders can have.

**stasu1213** · December-18-13, 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitPlanner

There is no active legislation
to increase either fuel taxes. Incidentally Act 51's portion for transit is based on 10 percent of the pre-1997 gasoline tax. So it is 1.5 cents per gallon. If it was actually ten percent then it would be 1.9 cents per gallon going to transit. Since Act 51 is based on set price per gallon, and that has not increased, as fuel economy improves this means less money being generated for transit now than there was 15 years ago. This is one of the chief reasons why there have been so many cutbacks in service. This is also the reason why operating costs are key in determining what level of service we as Michiganders can have.

What type if mass transit do you think would work well in detroit

**DetroitPlanner** · December-19-13, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

What type if mass transit do you think would work well in detroit

Different modes will work best for different routes. It depends upon application, ridership, and connectivity; not geography.

The best would be a subway network though those are very expensive to build and operate. It would make little sense to replace the Joy Rd/Dexter bus with one.

**professorscott** · December-19-13, 09:55 AM

Originally Posted by Chicago48

$40 Million to FIX busses? That's enough to buy new busses.

It wouldn't be smart to use this money to buy new buses, for a technical reason. When you buy buses, there is Federal money available, but not if you already have too many buses [[by a formula). DDOT has a huge number of buses not in service, mostly because they are broken down, but in FTA land those are considered "spares". Detroit has so many spares, there is no Federal money available for new buses.

Best to spend this money to get as many fixed and in service as possible, and reduce the number of [[apparent) spares so then money for new buses is available.