Did anyone see the first mayoral debate?

**corktownyuppie** · October-20-13, 08:38 PM

What are people's thoughts on the first Mayoral debate? I'd prefer that the conversation revolve more around the substance of the candidate's answers/ideas rather than his ability to "win" the argument or "appear more polished", etc. [[A good debater can make bad ideas look pretty decent.) But certainly someone's debate skills are certainly important component of being able to get people to support your ideas, so some of that is ok too.

CTY

**Crumbled_pavement** · October-21-13, 12:24 PM

If anyone missed the debate, like I did, here are the links to it:
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/video/94...debate-part-1/
http://detroit.cbslocal.com/video/94...debate-part-2/

Courtesy of CBSLOCAL.COM [[CH. 62)

**Chinman** · October-21-13, 12:41 PM

Saw the debate and thought that Benny seemed to have long winded answers that had no substance while Mike answered with short statements. just saying.

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 12:43 PM

Fascinating. Duggan sounds like an Orr lackey, every negative statement towards Orr a carefully calculated appeal to voters [[because no mayoral candidate can realistically win by saying he supports Orr). He's "against" the EM but will submit a plan to the EM in hopes he will endorse it. Hmm...

**downtownguy** · October-21-13, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

He's "against" the EM but will submit a plan to the EM in hopes he will endorse it. Hmm...

Why do you think those are mutually exclusive concepts?

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 12:56 PM

Oh sure, the concepts aren't exclusive, but Duggan's opposition is quite weak. "Well, he's already here, we might as well work with him. Might as well supply him with a plan and beg him to endorse it. Might as well try to quicken the process so that he can get out of here, as per Snyder's stated goal."

Yes, some opposition.

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 01:12 PM

Not that I think Benny is ideal candidate. He sounds like a cop in over his head, but his heart is in the right place.

Both candidates could be implicated in corruption. Of course, I believe that ties back to the idiocy of American voters. They only respond to glitzy campaigns, and want to imagine that the donors behind such campaigns aren't asking for favors.

Doubtful.

**innercitydoc** · October-21-13, 01:44 PM

Did you see the look on MD and the moderators face when Benny said "I've been in this city picking up hookers and prostitutes..." at the end of part 1. That was classic!

**Honky Tonk** · October-21-13, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Oh sure, the concepts aren't exclusive, but Duggan's opposition is quite weak. "Well, he's already here, we might as well work with him. Might as well supply him with a plan and beg him to endorse it. Might as well try to quicken the process so that he can get out of here, as per Snyder's stated goal."

Yes, some opposition.

You should've totally backed Crittendon, then. She would have spent every last nickel left battling the EFM instead of concentrating on getting the City back on it's feet. You gotta have priorities, you know.

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 01:56 PM

Honky Tonk, I thought Orr told us he was going to make immediate improvements in Detroit. Months on and nothing has happened. How is he fixing the city, or getting it back on its feet? The proof will be in in the pudding, when the final agreements are made. Do you trust Orr to get the job done?

**corktownyuppie** · October-21-13, 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Honky Tonk, I thought Orr told us he was going to make immediate improvements in Detroit. Months on and nothing has happened.

WTH are you talking about?

Orr brought in a new DPD Police Chief that is finally restructuring DPD and has the police union backing all the things he's doing.

In the accounting department, putting aside all the stupid sh** coming out of his CFO's mouth, they are finally paying 99% of their bills within 30 days of receipt. You may not care about this, but we were getting to the point where businesses were no longer interested in bidding on city work because of the 6-12 months it took to get paid.

He just secured billions of dollars in new money to restructure the city.

Look, I understand that he hasn't been perfect, or that some people don't want him to be here. But in terms of "Has he done anything yet??" Absolutely.

He's done more in 6 months than any mayor/city council combination has done in 4 years that I know of.

**Honky Tonk** · October-21-13, 02:01 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Honky Tonk, I thought Orr told us he was going to make immediate improvements in Detroit. Months on and nothing has happened. How is he fixing the city, or getting it back on its feet? The proof will be in in the pudding, when the final agreements are made. Do you trust Orr to get the job done?

I'm not sure if or not he'll get the job "done", [[I certainly HOPE so), but I'm really tired of fighting windmills, and business as usual. There's a lot more to this turnaround then flipping a switch. What kind of immediate improvements did you hope to see in a City that has no money, and no chance of "borrowing" any more?

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by corktownyuppie

Orr brought in a new DPD Police Chief that is finally restructuring DPD and has the police union backing all the things he's doing.

In the accounting department, putting aside all the stupid sh** coming out of his CFO's mouth, they are finally paying 99% of their bills within 30 days of receipt. You may not care about this, but we were getting to the point where businesses were no longer interested in bidding on city work because of the 6-12 months it took to get paid.

Another DPD restructuring! I bet it'll really work this time!

And yes, it's important that he's getting the bills paid on time again, but it kind of says it all this his #1 priority is ensuring that the big players are getting their money ASAP.

Orr told us we'd see streetlights turned back in Detroit. That the traffic lights would all work again. That parks would get mowed. Etc. But somehow that's taking longer. But hey, 99% of the bills are now paid within 30 days!!!

**Marlon_JB2** · October-21-13, 03:25 PM

Well the streetlight across from my garage is now working.

**sumas** · October-21-13, 07:38 PM

We attended an event at Sinbads to watch the Sunday viewing of the debate.

Both men were articulate but Benny just blows hot air. They were civil, which I appreciated. Sorry, not really, I support Duggan, so I am biased.

As far as substance I think Duggan presented in short time frames given a debate a real plan. Don't agree with all of it

Duggan won by a land slide with the write in vote. Hilarious, that Detroiters said, yes we can spell, but the new Duggan T shirts spell it wrong. Wonder who paid off, who for that snafu.

**coracle** · October-21-13, 08:31 PM

I thought Napoleon was a blowhard that likes to listen to himself.

**corktownyuppie** · October-21-13, 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Another DPD restructuring! I bet it'll really work this time!

And yes, it's important that he's getting the bills paid on time again, but it kind of says it all this his #1 priority is ensuring that the big players are getting their money ASAP.

Orr told us we'd see streetlights turned back in Detroit. That the traffic lights would all work again. That parks would get mowed. Etc. But somehow that's taking longer. But hey, 99% of the bills are now paid within 30 days!!!
[/COLOR]

Well, I would say that the "paying bills within 30 days" is a prerequisite before "everything else". If no one thinks you're going to pay your bills, then I'd say everything else comes to a screeching halt.

I do agree that he needs more manpower in an executive handling the city operation so he can deal with the finances. But anyone who thinks results will be instant is delusional. Detroit is so broken that you will likely need 18-24 months of total revamping of operations before you really see that much difference at the ground.

So rather than sitting at the ground and wondering when things are going to change, look at the inner workings and figure out if he is -- or if he isn't -- making the right changes to bring that about.

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 10:09 PM

Well, Corktown, your boy Orr promised immediate results in 60 days in regards to lighting and blight on September 9th. Don't believe me? Read it for yourself.

Well, it's already October 21 and things aren't looking so hot.

So perhaps you're right. Maybe he IS delusional. Or he's playing us for chumps.

Bottom line is Orr has been the one promising quick results this whole time [[I can recall similar comments to the ones in the above article dating back to when he was first appointed), and yet all he's really done is make sure the fat cats still get paid.

People like Orr and Snyder count on the short attention spans of the public. They tell us what we want to hear when questioned and then do something else when we're busy at work or in bed sleeping.

I know you want to believe that Orr is the magic elixir Detroit has so desperately pined for, but you're jumping the gun. Let's wait and see how this all shakes out. He hasn't proved anything and has demonstrated some questionable motives, to be sure.

**nain rouge** · October-21-13, 10:16 PM

Bottom line is we have a a $1/4 million emergency manager installed by an anti-labor, pro-corporate governor running a city however he sees fit. You see that as sunshine and daisy chains. I see it as a cause for a mild alarm.

Of course Detroit sucked before. But I don't necessarily see these guys as the ones to make it better.

**corktownyuppie** · October-21-13, 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Well, Corktown, your boy Orr promised immediate results in 60 days in regards to lighting and blight on September 9th. Don't believe me? Read it for yourself.

Well, it's already October 21 and things aren't looking so hot.

I still don't understand what you're talking about. I read the article.

After five months on the job, Orr says efforts to restore streetlights and reduce the number of abandoned structures will become more visible within 60 days.

From The Detroit News: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...#ixzz2iQ7YoMwp/

Detroit Lighting Authority - Pilot project began on September 20, 2013.
http://www.freep.com/article/20130919/NEWS01/309190177/

Blight Emergency Order dated August 29, 2013 drastically reduces red tape to eliminate blight, a process which previously required 36 steps and 2 years to complete.
http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...xt|FRONTPAGE|p

Things are looking ridiculously hot. And certainly hotter than any other administration has been able to accomplish in a long, long, long time.

These problems are so huge that even with these giant steps which remove miles and miles of financial and legal hurdles, blight and lighting will STILL take 2-3 years to work through. But credit Orr for eliminating the red tape.

I'm not rooting for Orr. I'm not rooting against Orr. I'm rooting for all the BS in City Hall that makes it impossible to make progress on this stuff.

36 steps and 2 years of legal work to clear title to demolish a blighted house??

No wonder we weren't getting anywhere.

**corktownyuppie** · October-21-13, 11:14 PM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Bottom line is we have a a $1/4 million emergency manager installed by an anti-labor, pro-corporate governor running a city however he sees fit. You see that as sunshine and daisy chains. I see it as a cause for a mild alarm.

I don't think you get it. I don't care if he is pro-labor, anti-labor, Black Panther, or whatever. I don't care if he fires everyone in city hall or if he doubles their pay.

All I care about is if he is removing the perpetual obstacles to progress. He's doing that...so far.

**Richard** · October-22-13, 12:16 AM

18 months from when the new mayor and city council takes seat [[Jan 2014)they can vote to remove the EM from his seat,which should give the incoming plenty of time to have a more stable city government.

Which is why everything that will have long term results be looked at closely and not be based on past history or instant gratification.Cities operate with long term planning.

Well, okay,not always,but that is the whole point of it all,which is to change the way it was done in the past.

There are lots of improvements on the table and like CTY said it takes time to plow through the mess.

Two years for demolition research is not uncommon,one needs to cya when it comes to taking ones property.Do not cross the Ts and dot the Is and it can be very expensive litigation for the city.

**sumas** · October-22-13, 02:41 AM

My block is very long, we have 3 street lights, all of which work. Not nearly enough lights for the length. Actually felt a little bad when city workers came and replaced old bulbs for new given so many lights do not work at all in the rest of the city.

**Honky Tonk** · October-22-13, 06:56 AM

Originally Posted by nain rouge

Another DPD restructuring! I bet it'll really work this time!

And yes, it's important that he's getting the bills paid on time again, but it kind of says it all this his #1 priority is ensuring that the big players are getting their money ASAP.

Orr told us we'd see streetlights turned back in Detroit. That the traffic lights would all work again. That parks would get mowed. Etc. But somehow that's taking longer. But hey, 99% of the bills are now paid within 30 days!!!
[/COLOR]

How many times can you get away with bringing the car back home on Empty before Dad says "NO!"? Fiscal responsibility is the key to getting anything done in this City.

**nain rouge** · October-22-13, 11:58 AM

If Detroit is bankrupt, it's bankrupt. If we're paying bills on time then we're not bankrupt. Right? I'm just confused by Orr's priorities. First, it's we have no money and must go through bankruptcy proceedings as fast possible. Then, it's look at all this money I freed up so we can pay everything on time! If anything, he's hurting the city's case in regards to short-term debts, and putting the onus on reducing long-term debts, like pensions. So, no, I'm not quite as excited about that as you are. I too have my bone to pick with pensions, but I think Orr is going about this the wrong way.

For example, someone earlier mentioned that contractors had grown weary about bidding on contracts before Orr stepped in, but isn't it basically an accepted fact that the contractors were the ones primarily milking Detroit for all its worth, in cahoots with the politicians? I say, if you really want to fix this mess, screw the contractors and go straight to bankruptcy court. If there's still a profit to be made after bankruptcy, the contractors will be back. I guarantee it. In the meantime, funds could be redirected to underfunded city services.

In fact, I thought Orr claimed he was going to do just that. But the last few times I drove around Detroit, traffic lights were out all over the place and most of the east side was in the dark! But I'm glad to know whoever is bidding on tethers or whatever is getting paid on time. I know, I know - you'll say I'll see those changes in 18-36 months, but I fail to see what's so hard about fixing a traffic light if the money is there, and Orr seems to agree judging by his comments in the press.