Kwame: 28-Year Prison Sentence

**Wesley Mouch** · October-10-13, 11:54 PM

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

With all due respect to Django and others who make similar points, I must make the point that honest analysis of our justice & prison systems is not relevant as to whether Kwame Kilpatrick has received a fair sentence. Privatization of prison services may or may not be a good idea [[I have opinions on that, but will spare them from this thread), but failings in our systems do not merit a longer or shorter sentence for the former mayor. I frankly feel, in light of his extensive and long-running crimes, and his attempts to cover them up, he merits a very long sentence. I would be willing to be somewhat lenient if there was a one-time, unplanned crime. That is absolutely not the situation here. I hope for his sake that the time goes by quickly, and I hope he emerges a changed man. Thus far, he has not demonstrated remorse, except slightly at sentencing.

I do not understand why remorse mitigates the crime. Sure -- if you commit a crime and immediately realize it, confess, and express remorse then I understand some leniency.

But if you only become remorseful because you realized you are going down for the crime -- I'm not impressed.

And to those who worry for his children -- this is the best lesson they will ever get. Be honorable. Do not be like your father. The court should be thanked for saving his children from being raised by a criminal.

Is 28 years too much? The only arguments I hear are those of comparison. Forget that other criminals may get off easy. The only question is whether a man who actively and maliciously broke the public trust on a massive scale and harmed thousands of lives should be incarcerated for 28 years. I'm OK with the length. If you think others get off easy, then change those laws too.

**firstandten** · October-11-13, 12:33 AM

Kwame messed up when he didn't take the plea deal. He might have been able to negotiate the 15 years down to 12 or even 10. I know one of the posters said he thought he might get a mistrial to give him more leverage. I think that people like Kwame, don't respect the feds enough.. that they can out think them. I've seen that in a couple other people who had to do federal time. How could the man believe watching every one else go down around him that he wasn't going to go down as well. Well maybe Kwame's sons will get to enjoy the hidden money some day because Kwame definitely won't.

**Meddle** · October-11-13, 04:01 AM

I think people that can't spell out the word 'people' should have to serve Kwame' breakfast in bed and do his daily pedicures for the next 28 years to help save the taxpayers some money.

**Django** · October-11-13, 04:39 AM

I agree that KK was an arrogant fool who put himself in this position. Its the penal system that I think needs to be looked at and changed. There are 2.2 million prisoners in the U.S. today, mostly non violent offenders.

No way in hell is KK sitting in Club Fed btw. Hes going to spend most of his life in a federal prison possibly getting raped like any other fish. Just my belief but some ppl dont even give it a thought, just lock them up is their primal barbaric instinct without even a modern thought.

Today prison system is quickly becoming modern day slavery. Sorry to threadjack a little but it is true.

**MikeyinBrooklyn** · October-11-13, 05:03 AM

Originally Posted by Django

There are 2.2 million prisoners in the U.S. today, mostly non violent offenders.

Today prison system is quickly becoming modern day slavery. Sorry to threadjack a little but it is true.

Django, assuming your numbers are accurate, should non-violent people not be eligible for prison? Most crimes committed [[thankfully?) are not directly violent.

I would also be curious for you to make of list of similarities between our justice system and slavery. I have to say I cannot imagine any way in which they are similar. I can wrap my brain around jail; I cannot wrap it around slavery. Please list how they are similar.

**MikeyinBrooklyn** · October-11-13, 05:09 AM

Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

I do not understand why remorse mitigates the crime.

I am not a big fan of sentencing rules. I think various crimes should just have standard sentences. But, as our system currently is established, judges have some discretion on sentencing. That being the case, remorse is one of the criteria that is taken into account. If Kwame had been sorry and apologetic from the get go, I think the judge would have been within his rights to be a little lenient. Like I said though, if I were designing the system, I would only allow discretion in sentencing for those that assist further law enforcement [[i.e., testify against others).

**Zacha341** · October-11-13, 05:47 AM

I feel for his sons, but it could all been stopped. This syndicate of corruption was way over the top, the public trust violated, and it would have continued as long as moneys where there to be redistributed. Kilpatrick's second term in office was basically 'damage-control' mode where the cities fiscal audits were not timely and we continued to spiral downward fiscally with continued 'hook ups' for folks in the inner circle. We lost fundings due late audits and the TRUE financial situation of Detroit remained hidden for a later date of reckoning.

KK should have taken a plea deal early on, but that would have required a mindset and personality of someone else. And that stack of lawyers he went thru... what a mess.

**Zacha341** · October-11-13, 05:55 AM

I fully agree with your comments.

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

I feel for his family, too. I even feel for Mr. Kilpatrick. Although fully deserved, I feel bad he ruined his life. There is justice here, but no pleasure. I hope, when all is said and done, he makes peace with himself and God; he will surely never have peace with City of Detroit.

At the end of the day, this nightmare of corruption I hope establishes transparency in government operations and vigilance by the citizenry.

**mikeg19** · October-11-13, 06:14 AM

I felt like he would see 20 years. This essentially puts him away for the rest of the productive years in his life. I'm sure he will appeal, and I won't be surprised if this sentence is lowered. But if it's not, that's one hell of a message to send to everyone else.

I feel for his kids and wife. I never had to grow up in a single parent home, and have felt fortunate for that. Kwame was a fast rising, smart, educated, charismatic, well liked politician. There's no doubt he would have moved on to bigger and better things with a successful run as the mayor. Whether or not he was involved in these types of shady things previous to becoming mayor, we don't know, but presumably a smart person would think yes. What a waste of talent, but in the end, he's finally getting what he deserves.

**Honky Tonk** · October-11-13, 06:51 AM

[QUOTE=Zacha341;405882]KK should have taken a plea deal early onQUOTE]

If I were offered a chance to make restitution for 11% of what I was charged with taking, [[$9 mil bribe to hush text messages), knowing full well I was taking cookies, by the handful, from the jar, I would have sheepishly thanked my accusers, paid the restitution, and moved on. Mr. Kilpatrick became so brazen, jaded, and full of himself, that he honestly felt he was entitled, and no one was the wiser. That's when the ball of yarn started unravelling. I feel sorry for his boys, and take no joy in his sentencing. I met him @ "The Taste Fest" when he was first campaigning, and was so impressed with this "pistol", that I voted for him. I'm very disappointed in the outcome.

**jolla** · October-11-13, 10:05 AM

Good riddance to bad rubbish.

**Wesley Mouch** · October-11-13, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

I am not a big fan of sentencing rules. I think various crimes should just have standard sentences. But, as our system currently is established, judges have some discretion on sentencing. That being the case, remorse is one of the criteria that is taken into account. If Kwame had been sorry and apologetic from the get go, I think the judge would have been within his rights to be a little lenient. Like I said though, if I were designing the system, I would only allow discretion in sentencing for those that assist further law enforcement [[i.e., testify against others).

I've no problem as you describe it. I think I'm just tired of this idea that all can be forgiven if you just say you're sorry. It takes more. Being sorry is only the first step. Be truly sorry -- and then express it for a few years in real service to others. Talk's cheap. Just saying something nice when a gun's to your head proves nothing about your 'personal reformation'.

**jackie5275** · October-11-13, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by George Cassidy

Throw him to the lions while the people cheer and forget their problems for a while.

Do you mean many of their problems that his actions created?

**firstandten** · October-11-13, 02:41 PM

[QUOTE=Honky Tonk;405889]

Originally Posted by Zacha341

KK should have taken a plea deal early onQUOTE]

If I were offered a chance to make restitution for 11% of what I was charged with taking, [[$9 mil bribe to hush text messages), knowing full well I was taking cookies, by the handful, from the jar, I would have sheepishly thanked my accusers, paid the restitution, and moved on. Mr. Kilpatrick became so brazen, jaded, and full of himself, that he honestly felt he was entitled, and no one was the wiser. That's when the ball of yarn started unravelling. I feel sorry for his boys, and take no joy in his sentencing. I met him @ "The Taste Fest" when he was first campaigning, and was so impressed with this "pistol", that I voted for him. I'm very disappointed in the outcome.

Look I'm not going to be hard on you, myself and the electorate that voted for Kwame at least the first time. In hindsight of course saying we shouldn't voted for him is easy but I still maintain voting for him over Gill Hill was the right thing to do. The electorate in the second election either made a mistake or the election was stolen. Looking back Freeman should have been elected. Who knows maybe he was and there was election fraud.

**Zacha341** · October-11-13, 02:58 PM

^^^ Just for the record. My referenced above post ends at the bold type ended by "QUOTE]"

**SWMAP** · October-11-13, 02:58 PM

Wesley wrote: I think I'm just tired of this idea that all can be forgiven if you just say you're sorry. It takes more. Being sorry is only the first step. Be truly sorry -- and then express it for a few years in real service to others. Talk's cheap." German theologian and pastor, Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who was executed for participating in a plot against Hitler, articulated the exact same idea in his book on The Cost of Discipleship. Bonhoeffer wrote:
“Cheap grace is the grace we bestow on ourselves. Cheap grace is the preaching of forgiveness without requiring repentance, baptism without church discipline, Communion without confession.... Cheap grace is grace without discipleship, grace without the cross…”
KK was depending on cheap grace, on “praise breaks” announced on Twitter and sentimental little assurances [[Only God can make a message from a mess) to get him out of all this. He rejected a plea deal because he would have to admit to all the world that he cheated and lied and stole.
Now he is paying the price. Maybe he will someday truly internalize something else Bonhoeffer said: “When Christ calls a man, he bids him come and die.”

**fanniemae** · October-11-13, 03:09 PM

Kwame's mental image of himself would not allow him to quit lying and denying. He could not change his natural habits. 28 years is very long. I don't think he will make it out. There will be plenty of law school type students that will examine this case. There will be some ambulance chasing type lawyers looking into this mess too, trying to get their name out there.

**Meddle** · October-11-13, 03:12 PM

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

At the end of the day, this nightmare of corruption I hope establishes transparency in government operations and vigilance by the citizenry.

Nope. Won't change a thing.

**Meddle** · October-11-13, 03:14 PM

Bobby gets 21 years by the way.

**fanniemae** · October-11-13, 03:16 PM

I predict Bobby won't survive either. Prison fight would be my guess. These 2 thugs will try and start their own companies in the big house.

**agirlintheD** · October-11-13, 05:30 PM

Barbara McQuade indicated on Mitch Albom that you may earn up to "54" days off for good behavior and that, if that is the case, he could possibly be released in "23ish" years.

**ccal** · October-11-13, 07:58 PM

These two will survive in prison baring any medical problems. Whatever compound these two land at they will be embraced by their criminal brothern that are from Detroit already there and held up as saviors. As far as rape goes, it won't happen because federal prison isn't harsh as people tend to believe. They will more than likely both get jobs in UNICOR and Kwame might even supplement his income by doing law work for those who are appealing their convictions. Bobby most likely will start a sports book, for him it wouldn't be about the money, just something else to do. There are advocacy groups who are trying to get federal prison time back down to 65% so who knows, they might be out in 15 years or so and it would be retroactive so who knows.......

**Hypestyles** · October-11-13, 08:01 PM

I hope that the younger Mr. Kilpatrick and Mr. Ferguson don't become adopted as "political prisoners" by various activist types. I found Sam Riddle's comments on Fox 2's let it rip especially embarrassing and idiotic.

On another level, I wonder when the next federal indictment will be announced. I guess the pension corruption case is still ongoing?

**Hermod** · October-11-13, 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by MikeyinBrooklyn

I am not a big fan of sentencing rules. I think various crimes should just have standard sentences. But, as our system currently is established, judges have some discretion on sentencing. That being the case, remorse is one of the criteria that is taken into account. If Kwame had been sorry and apologetic from the get go, I think the judge would have been within his rights to be a little lenient. Like I said though, if I were designing the system, I would only allow discretion in sentencing for those that assist further law enforcement [[i.e., testify against others).

Well, Mikey, if a felon does not "wriggle and turn" and fight the conviction, but says to the judge "I am guilty and throw myself at the mercy of the court", he does not force the state into a long trial and use up state resources. This should certainly be a factor in sentencing. Kwame didn't do this, but tried every subterfuge possible to avoid being found guilty. Throw the book at him.

**ccal** · October-11-13, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by fanniemae

I predict Bobby won't survive either. Prison fight would be my guess. These 2 thugs will try and start their own companies in the big house.

Nah, the only prison fights where someone might even die in federal prisons happen between mexican/spanish/latin factions. Its very rare for black gangs/groups in federal prison to be involved in riots and huge fights, if they do its usually region against region [[midwest vs eastcoast vs downsouth vs DC vs westcoast)