If you were 22-26 yo, would you move to Detroit RIGHT NOW? Why?

48009 · September-11-13, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

"Having fun" is subjective. If someone likes to work in a drab office all week then get wasted on $20 shots on the weekend in Lincoln Park, that's their preference. But some young adults, like the ones moving to Detroit, want to work, live, and play in a city that needs them and where they feel appreciated with creating a new and revived environment. They have fun just like the rest of the young adults across the nation.

Like, bro, do you even go to the city? Have you even met people doing what you are complaining about? Ask them what they are doing and why they are doing it? Probably not, because you "asked" the question here so you can stand your Chicago/Bham pedestal and tell us all how awful and stupid those people are.

$20 shots? Tell us some more fairy tales. Are these childish exaggerations used to highlight that cities with more offerings are more expensive? You mean cities, each of which that lure tens of thousands of college grads to move in every year are more expensive than the country's most terrifying major city? Shocking.

FYI, I'm female, bro.

**ddaydetroit** · September-11-13, 02:00 PM

At that age I wanted to move downtown but I had kids and to me the suburban schools had a lot more to offer and were safer

**dtowncitylover** · September-11-13, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

$20 shots? Tell us some more fairy tales. Are these childish exaggerations used to highlight that cities with more offerings are more expensive? You mean cities, each of which that lure tens of thousands of college grads to move in every year are more expensive than the country's most terrifying major city? Shocking.

FYI, I'm female, bro.

Ok, I don't care what your sex is.

Anyways, yes these cities are more expensive and don't offer, to those who prefer to live in Detroit, anything new. But Detroit does offer something new: revitalization and a comeback that is unprecedented. And that is what is exciting to some.

Yes, Detroit has high crime, poor schools, and shattered neighborhoods, but only means we've hit the bottom and have nowhere to go but up.

But what we have found out about you is that you're a black, female Chicago transplant with some Metro Detroit connection who continues to rip Detroit because we have failed some of our most vulnerable members of society and then bash those who wish to save a city from being wiped off the map. While you still continue to live and work here, without offering any help to make this region a better place and instead offering non-constructive criticism. I mean, did you major in Pessimism Studies?

48009 · September-11-13, 03:55 PM

Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

1. Anyways, yes these cities are more expensive and don't offer, to those who prefer to live in Detroit, anything new.

2. Yes, Detroit has high crime, poor schools, and shattered neighborhoods, but only means we've hit the bottom and have nowhere to go but up.

3. But what we have found out about you is that you're a black, female Chicago transplant with some Metro Detroit connection who continues to rip Detroit because we have failed some of our most vulnerable members of society and then bash those who wish to save a city from being wiped off the map. While you still continue to live and work here, without offering any help to make this region a better place and instead offering non-constructive criticism. I mean, did you major in Pessimism Studies?

1. Breaking news: Everybody that moved to SF, LA, NYC, Chicago, DC, Miami after college immediately questions their decision after learning there is nothing different between them and Detroit. Um, OK.

2. Rock bottom says who? Pretty sure 411 people were murdered last year. Further, who says you have to go "up"? History is full of abandoned ghost towns that never went "up".

3. I have no obligation to help bring back this fallen city and I honestly wonder if the efforts by the few who are trying are futile. As in the city is so far gone you won't be able to bring it back and the competition from other large cities is impossible to topple.

**mwilbert** · September-11-13, 04:25 PM

You can't answer the question of why people might move to Detroit by making a list of reasons people wouldn't move to Detroit. When people give you reasons why people might find Detroit attractive, you continue to give reasons why you and the people you know would not. Or you say most people wouldn't find those reasons compelling.

But for purposes of your question, it doesn't matter if most people don't find them compelling. People vary widely in what they care about, and you only need a very small fraction of people to find Detroit attractive to have plenty of potential people, and there isn't a lot of competition for Detroit's particular niche, so people who find the idea of a place like Detroit appealing are likely to actually check out Detroit, unlike more normal cities which are in closer competition with each other. It is safe to say that San Francisco is attractive to a much larger number of people than Detroit is, but it is practically certain Detroit will actually attract a higher percentage of the people who find Detroit attractive than San Francisco will of the people who find San Francisco attractive.

Are there enough of these people to help jump-start Detroit's revival? I don't know, but it seems pretty obvious there are some of them even though you seem incapable of recognizing their existence or understanding their motives, even when they tell you what those motives are.

**dtowncitylover** · September-11-13, 04:55 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

3. I have no obligation to help bring back this fallen city and I honestly wonder if the efforts by the few who are trying are futile. As in the city is so far gone you won't be able to bring it back and the competition from other large cities is impossible to topple.

No one says you do have an obligation to help the city, but don't tell those who want to they're wasting their time. That's your opinion.

This movement was started by a few, but as Detroit's issues became more prominent, I think everyone, at least those who are from this area, has realized the need for the city to get back on its feet.

And yes, most regions offer the same amenities with their own twist. True, Detroit doesn't offer transit, good public safety, good public education, but I think after the bankruptcy and restructuring that will change. But the region offers the same cultural attractions, educational institutions, eating options, housing options, among others. I don't need to go to Chicago to see fine art or eat at a pricey restaurant.

I mean the thought of abandoning Detroit like an old Colorado mining town is asinine to me and not going to happen. So we can let it be, a schitty town that can't function, or turn into a vibrant, liveable city.

40 years ago we did not think China was going to be the competitive place it is today. But where did our industrial base go?

**michimoby** · September-11-13, 05:08 PM

In principle, 48009, I'm in alignment with your frustrations.

The concern I have is with the way you're conveying it. I quickly discovered, in a previous thread not many months back, that spending time criticizing Detroit and its pitfalls is not conducive for evoking change. I sense that your intent here is to instill a sense of reflection in Detroiters with the hope that, yes, the region will learn and grow from the successes of other cities.

But, there's a chasm there, and it has to do with the instilled self-defense present in anyone that makes the decision to live, work, and play in the region. Hell, even those that don't live locally, but are from Detroit, stand up for the city...more so that a lot of the Pittsburgh transplants, and they're borderline batshit.

For the time being, Detroit is content on finding its own routes for change -- now, that means it may come much more slowly and in an unorthodox way. Do I wish that it would come faster, with some genuine reflection on the successes of other cities? Sure. But you're dealing with the equivalent of an adult that was emotionally abused over the past four decades by big brothers in other cities, so the propensity to openly adopt suggestions from "outsiders" or those with global experience is not as high as a place like Chicago. It is what it is, and I frankly can't blame them.

-----

On a side note, to the poster suggesting that NYC and Chicago have no opportunity for revitalization -- complete horsepucky. I have dozens of examples why that's completely erroneous, and why I've found just as much opportunity for city improvement -- if not more -- in Brooklyn as I did in Detroit.

**Justin SOD** · September-11-13, 05:50 PM

I am a "20 something" that lives in Detroit and actually spent the first 18 years of my life in Birmingham as well as a few after that in Royal Oak. I've been fortunate enough to do quite a bit of traveling and experience many of the greatest cities throughout the continent. I recently had the opportunity to essentially move anywhere in the US, but I still chose to stay/live in Detroit primarily due to my love for the city.

I feel like I could explain my reasons to you, but based on your responses it seems like it would be futile. I find the statements in your posts regarding Detroit to be quite common in Birmingham and the immediate surrounding area.

**Gistok** · September-11-13, 06:10 PM

A belated welcome to the forum Justin SOD... there are as many reasons for living here as there are for any city in the world... my favorite city is Paris... but I think the people here are a bit nicer!

**dtowncitylover** · September-11-13, 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by michimoby

On a side note, to the poster suggesting that NYC and Chicago have no opportunity for revitalization -- complete horsepucky. I have dozens of examples why that's completely erroneous, and why I've found just as much opportunity for city improvement -- if not more -- in Brooklyn as I did in Detroit.

Indeed, this is true. But the neighborhoods that need revitalization are not the poster child for the entire city, like most of the neighborhoods of Detroit are for the city in the national mindset. One thinks Manhattan when they imagine NYC, not Grand Concourse and 174th or thinks of the Mag Mile, not 59th and Halsted.

48009 · September-11-13, 06:51 PM

Originally Posted by Justin SOD

I am a "20 something" that lives in Detroit and actually spent the first 18 years of my life in Birmingham as well as a few after that in Royal Oak. I've been fortunate enough to do quite a bit of traveling and experience many of the greatest cities throughout the continent. I recently had the opportunity to essentially move anywhere in the US, but I still chose to stay/live in Detroit primarily due to my love for the city.

I feel like I could explain my reasons to you, but based on your responses it seems like it would be futile. I find the statements in your posts regarding Detroit to be quite common in Birmingham and the immediate surrounding area.

Although getting people like you to move into the city is important, it's far easier than luring people from outside of the state here. Majority of people never leave the region they grew up in and tend to stay close to their parents. I imagine you're the target group for Gilbert and co's campaign, i.e., in-state 20-somethings who aren't comfortable or maybe can't afford to move out of state. Also there is a correlation between the mobility of a person and education. So when Michigan tax payers educated kids they actually give them the access to flee. And few from Detroit can finish college, so those low earners are pretty stationary.

**dtowncitylover** · September-11-13, 06:55 PM

Originally Posted by michimoby

On a side note, to the poster suggesting that NYC and Chicago have no opportunity for revitalization -- complete horsepucky. I have dozens of examples why that's completely erroneous, and why I've found just as much opportunity for city improvement -- if not more -- in Brooklyn as I did in Detroit.

Indeed, this is true. But the neighborhoods that need revitalization are not the poster child for the entire city, like most of the neighborhoods of Detroit are for the city in the national mindset. One thinks Manhattan when they imagine NYC, not Grand Concourse and 174th or thinks of the Mag Mile, not 59th and Halsted.

**sumas** · September-11-13, 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

When you're bored out of your mind in Michigan, and see all of your friends having fun in cooler cities than Detroit, you fly to see them. Assuming you have the means. Detroit and Michigan in general is currently considered a death sentence for 20-somethings around the nation. Most of them wouldn't take a pay INCREASE to move here, even with the cheaper cost of living. This is a real issue.

Skipped as promised

**sumas** · September-11-13, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

Um, OK. You're delusional. It's a fact that to people across the nation, Detroit is a professional death sentence. Nobody wants to be here. Most are either stuck here, don't know any better or are too scared to move. Conning 20-somethings that had nothing to do with ruining this town, to live in this warzone and help "bring it back" is the biggest scam going.

skipped as promised

**sumas** · September-11-13, 07:10 PM

skipped as promised

**sumas** · September-11-13, 07:31 PM

Actually I have skipped all your post since stated' Not even quotes used in posts from rational people.I can generally get the gist of whatever vile thing you say from responses.

I have no issues with people who point out negatives. Certainly, they exist. There are people ,rational people with rational reasoning I might add who don't wish to live, work, or play here. That's ok.

Your gleeful trashing ignorant trashing is what is unacceptable to me.

I have friends who don't do city, I rarely do burbs. We meet on the border at various restaurants. We respect each others positions.

48009 · September-11-13, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

I think everyone, at least those who are from this area, has realized the need for the city to get back on its feet.

Why is there a "need" to bring Detroit back? Serious question. The region has done well with prosperous suburbs in favor of a bustling city. Entirely plausible we can't have both.

Depending on your definition, it's been more or less gone for 20-50 years. The city is SO far gone, and has been gone for so long, even with BILLIONS in state and federal aid, that it's hard to argue the economic case in favor of further recovery efforts.

**noise** · September-11-13, 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

I'm a "20-something" graduate student from Chicago living in Birmingham but O.K., slugger.

Which graduate school accepts an illiterate with no ability to craft a clear, accurate argument?

**noise** · September-11-13, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by bailey

Actually, it's a pretty close to fact....

http://michiganeconomy.chicagofedblogs.org/?p=377

Cause & effect is lost on both you and 48009, isn't it?

**noise** · September-11-13, 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

FYI, I'm black.

Hey, that means you fit your earlier stereotype!

**313WX** · September-11-13, 07:57 PM

Originally Posted by 48009

The region has done well with prosperous suburbs in favor of a bustling city.

I guess, if you call a stagnant economy with stagnant population growth [[falling from a top 5 metro to now a top 20 metro) "done well."

**noise** · September-11-13, 08:00 PM

48009's original post implied nobody in this age group is moving to Detroit.

It's been proven that this argument is incorrect.

Have the goalposts moved?

**michimoby** · September-11-13, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by dtowncitylover

Indeed, this is true. But the neighborhoods that need revitalization are not the poster child for the entire city, like most of the neighborhoods of Detroit are for the city in the national mindset. One thinks Manhattan when they imagine NYC, not Grand Concourse and 174th or thinks of the Mag Mile, not 59th and Halsted.

If you're referencing physical appearance of neighborhoods, I agree. And maybe it's the fact that there's some extensive focus on Detroit's "ruin porn" which orients revitalization toward that area.

But the areas of revitalization in NYC/Chicago center heavily around industry [[particularly tech), schools, transit-oriented development...making neighborhoods physically attractive while leaving the schools + public safety agencies to rot is like polishing a turd.

**sumas** · September-11-13, 08:07 PM

I might add that the idiot drunk who hit my car and 6 others on the next block in my NEIGHBORHOOD was from the burbs. Carrying a gun too without a permit He is so SOL.

I've stayed on this thread to hear promoters or thoughtful critiques.

**runnerXT** · September-11-13, 09:26 PM

I'm visiting my girlfriend who lives in Chicago. I'm from Detroit.

48009 posts don't make much sense to me. There really isn't much here in Chicago and it certainly lacks the excitment and uniqueness of Detroit. Yes Chicago has a nice area of two blocks deep only from the lake for about 1/2 a mile along the Northside but aside from that it is Detroit just without Detroit's vibrancy and Chicago is way more depressing. It looks good in pictures but you have to spend a lot of time looking for that right good angle to show it off.

Downtown Chicago shopping is nothing more than a watered down Somerset shopping mall and is a lot lot more unsafe. Dining in downtown Chicago, sure if you like chains which you can find the same thing in Warren.

That nice stretch along the lakefront is tiny and like I said two blocks deep and about half a mile long. It's chain central and full of chain type people. Nothing unique especially compared to vibrant Midtown, Corktown and on.

Chicago sells itself because it is America's third largest city but once people arrive here from usually rural America, the wannabe city people, they quickly realize that Detroit is a more affordable and serious option especially if they are 'creative'