Big Red 'For Rent' Sign Can Get You Scrapped?

[Zacha341]

Recently in the Curtis, Livernois area a friend noted the next door property had a 'For Rent' sign in the front window. Within a week the owner came to check property to learn that the back door was kicked in -- the furnace and water heater stolen.

I've never understood why any property owner would put 'For Rent' signs in the window of rental property decades ago. For sure who would now... it's a dead giveaway that NO ONE IS HOME! Welcome Scrappers!

And scrapping is happening everywhere. Curtis and Livernois is not a broke down area.

A similar scrapping session happened to another house that had a "For Rent" sign up a window.

The owner of this property removed the sign. Anyone else noticed a problem with "For Rent" for renting their property?

[Richard]

Where I am at we finally got new scrapping laws in place,there was an immediate noticeable impact .

A/C units require a notarized release from the home owner and is verified,no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

No burned copper wire or if so 5c a pound,no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

Automotive catalytic converters must have the title to the car it came off of and match the epa tag,no tag = $1.00 for the converter, no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

Large amounts of copper wire or pipe must have a verifiable source as to where it came from,no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

You must have ID to scrap and a picture of you and your scrap is recorded for future reference.

Vacant houses and buildings are no longer being scrapped over night,A/C units no longer disappear in the night,no fear of returning to your car with a missing cat converter,it works.

I have an acquaintance that recently expanded opening two more ferrous metal scrap yards,even with the tighter restrictions he is doing a brisk business and sees no problem and says it actually makes it easier for him to do business.

The downside is the little scrappers that were doing the right thing before have been effected but as usual it is the ones that screw it up for everybody else.

[Zacha341]

Verification can have an impact. I think any scrapper jerk taking a bronze tombstone or historical marker, and other OBVIOUSLY stolen items, no questions asked should be shut down.

Also I see some store fronts with water heaters, furnaces [[a store front on Hamilton comes to mind) and what not sitting out on their sidewalks for sale. Wires and piping all hanging loose, like it was just scrap/ snatched the day before. Makes you wonder?

Then you know there are honest people out there that sale used equipment legitimately who get hurt in all of this.

[wolverine]

Verification can have an impact. I think any scrapper jerk taking a bronze tombstone or historical marker, and other OBVIOUSLY stolen items, no questions asked should be shut down.

Also I see some store fronts with water heaters, furnaces [[a store front on Hamilton comes to mind) and what not sitting out on their sidewalks for sale. Wires and piping all hanging loose, like it was just scrap/ snatched the day before. Makes you wonder?

Then you know there are honest people out there that sale used equipment legitimately who get hurt in all of this.

It doesn't hurt the legitimate people, it wipes out any sort of illegal competition and also protects their materials from getting stolen from their jobsite. Only people to complain are the scrapyards, but who cares. Someone needs to be the loser for all us to be better off not having our homes stripped.

[Jimaz]

I've never understood why any property owner would put 'For Rent' signs in the window of rental property decades ago. For sure who would now... it's a dead giveaway that NO ONE IS HOME! Welcome Scrappers!

The presence of a junkyard dog might help in some cases.

[Richard]

The presence of a junkyard dog might help in some cases.

3/4 plywood with 3" nails sticking up,placed under windows and hidden under a light bed of mulch or leaves works well.

[sumas]

I remember being angry that a home rec room was featured in a home owners feature on a local news channel and the "cool" thing was a Detroit sewer cover made into a coffee table bought from a junkyard in Detroit.

Hello folks, they had to have known it was scrappers at work. Actually I am still angry.

[Scottathew]

This won't change until two things happen:

1) The Detroit Police become responsive
2) The people get a restored confidence in the police and start calling them again

One time I witnessed a building being vandalized in Detroit on my way home. I called 911 to report it, and the 911 operator's tone conveyed frustration with me that my [[248) number was calling to report vandalism that no one gave a rat's butt about.

[Zacha341]

Until the robber, eh-er, I mean 'victims' lawyers sue your pants off applying their thumb screws......

3/4 plywood with 3" nails sticking up,placed under windows and hidden under a light bed of mulch or leaves works well.

[Zacha341]

The presence of a junkyard dog might help in some cases.

And never advertise property un-occupied with a stupid 'for rent' sign!

[Zacha341]

For sure number 2 has become a factor as people take matters into their own hands. Then the police come with the yellow tape if at all.

This won't change until two things happen:

1) The Detroit Police become responsive
2) The people get a restored confidence in the police and start calling them again

One time I witnessed a building being vandalized in Detroit on my way home. I called 911 to report it, and the 911 operator's tone conveyed frustration with me that my [[248) number was calling to report vandalism that no one gave a rat's butt about.

[Honky Tonk]

And never advertise property un-occupied with a stupid 'for rent' sign!

What's the difference? If you put an ad in the paper, they eventually find out where it is? Some probably ask to see it to case the place. It's a tragic time we live in for sure.

[Zacha341]

For sure there are few guarantees. I would not want to be in the real estate business.

However, there are factors to reduce risk. like how you list the ad: give the address - same issue. Give area and then attempt to screen the call before giving additional info may SLOW the scrapping process or avoid it all together. The goal is to get a renter occupying the property fast, before the scrappers come. It's about discretion....

The "For Rent" sign in the window also draws folks just cruising by, the same b&e and other 'crimes of opportunity' cruising crowd. Anything you can do to lessen your chances of being caught up in crime is an advantage.

Two other properties in my friends block where unoccupied with lights on timers, lawns mowed, no "For Rent" signs. Not scrapped.

[DetroitPlanner]

What's the difference? If you put an ad in the paper, they eventually find out where it is? Some probably ask to see it to case the place. It's a tragic time we live in for sure.

With an ad you don't have to put up an address. Plus it assumes the scrappers will actually read. Sadly I suspect most crimes happen by people who do not buy newspapers or surf the internet.

[Zacha341]

^^^^ Yep. The more dedicated, long-term enterprising scrappers who network for such crimes will do the papers and web. The others more so seek the easier option of spotting signs...

[motz]

I remember being angry that a home rec room was featured in a home owners feature on a local news channel and the "cool" thing was a Detroit sewer cover made into a coffee table bought from a junkyard in Detroit.

Hello folks, they had to have known it was scrappers at work. Actually I am still angry.

The coffee table sounds cool, but the method of acquisition sounds bad. I would love one, but I would like it to be legit, not a scrapped manhole cover.

[EastsideAl]

This won't change until two things happen:

1) The Detroit Police become responsive
2) The people get a restored confidence in the police and start calling them again

One time I witnessed a building being vandalized in Detroit on my way home. I called 911 to report it, and the 911 operator's tone conveyed frustration with me that my [[248) number was calling to report vandalism that no one gave a rat's butt about.

I've called for scrappers in plain view actively scrapping a neighborhood building and have been told that, unless it was MY building being scrapped, the police wouldn't respond. When I later complained directly to our district commander, I was told in no uncertain terms that scrapping or the selling of illegally obtained scrap was not a DPD priority, or even something they were particularly interested in policing. And that, until the law was changed making it an offense that someone could actually be reliably arrested and prosecuted for, it would not become a priority.

In the meantime, our city, its infrastructure, building, homes, and history, are quickly disappearing all around us, and being destroyed and/or sold for profit by local fences... er, um... "businesspeople".

[brizee]

Where I am at we finally got new scrapping laws in place,there was an immediate noticeable impact .

A/C units require a notarized release from the home owner and is verified,no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

No burned copper wire or if so 5c a pound,no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

Automotive catalytic converters must have the title to the car it came off of and match the epa tag,no tag = $1.00 for the converter, no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

Large amounts of copper wire or pipe must have a verifiable source as to where it came from,no cash paid,check in the mail to verified address.

You must have ID to scrap and a picture of you and your scrap is recorded for future reference.

Vacant houses and buildings are no longer being scrapped over night,A/C units no longer disappear in the night,no fear of returning to your car with a missing cat converter,it works.

I have an acquaintance that recently expanded opening two more ferrous metal scrap yards,even with the tighter restrictions he is doing a brisk business and sees no problem and says it actually makes it easier for him to do business.

The downside is the little scrappers that were doing the right thing before have been effected but as usual it is the ones that screw it up for everybody else.

I've called for scrappers in plain view actively scrapping a neighborhood building and have been told that, unless it was MY building being scrapped, the police wouldn't respond. When I later complained directly to our district commander, I was told in no uncertain terms that scrapping or the selling of illegally obtained scrap was not a DPD priority, or even something they were particularly interested in policing. And that, until the law was changed making it an offense that someone could actually be reliably arrested and prosecuted for, it would not become a priority.

In the meantime, our city, its infrastructure, building, homes, and history, are quickly disappearing all around us, and being destroyed and/or sold for profit by local fences... er, um... "businesspeople".

And yet we have state reps actively fighting efforts to curb this nonsense.

It basically amounts to treason. And all because the problem affects a city/people that they don't really care for.

That empathy gap is a mother.

[Detroitnerd]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmTpuTSkDWk#t=2m22s

[sumas]

We watched as people scrapped an obliviously abandoned home across the street. I called my neighbor to verify what I thought was about to happen. She looked and said yep they were. Then she told me it was neighbors doing it. She still called police. A no show.

I sit on several clean and safe committees on the east side, the community officers tell us over and over they don't respond to non violent crime. Sometimes one feels helpless, even when you know they won't respond, it still feels like you are doing something.

[EastsideAl]

And yet we have state reps actively fighting efforts to curb this nonsense.

Which goes to show that, like so many other criminal enterprises [[the bankers come directly to mind), the scrap yards have a strong lobby that's not afraid to throw its money around to protect their gravy train of stolen goods.

Who cares who gets hurt, and who would expect anyone to lose sleep over it, when we live in a society and a political culture where wealth itself is the pinnacle virtue - no matter how ill-gained - and poverty is immoral by definition and therefore any evil done to the poor [[particularly the dark-skinned poor) is deserved?

We watched as people scrapped an obliviously abandoned home across the street. I called my neighbor to verify what I thought was about to happen. She looked and said yep they were. Then she told me it was neighbors doing it. She still called police. A no show.

I sit on several clean and safe committees on the east side, the community officers tell us over and over they don't respond to non violent crime. Sometimes one feels helpless, even when you know they won't respond, it still feels like you are doing something.

I keep telling people that there's is a deep dysfunction in our police force [[I say this as someone who has had relatives and very close friends on the DPD). One that goes beyond not enough manpower, to an attitude that amounts to a refusal to respond to citizens' needs and far too often a refusal to enforce the law.

[sumas]

I wish I had an easy answer. I don't!

Scrappers can look at auction lists same as others.

[detroitsgwenivere]

Im glad Rashida & Co. have been pushing this legislation, I support the whole bill, but I don't think it will be the panacea that it's made out to be. Metal will still be worth stealing, and driving the market underground only serves to enrich organized crime. And we all know what comes with that. Also, you can bet that investment banks will do anything to make sure their steady stream of commodities continues unabated.

[downtownguy]

Boy, that state Rep McMillin is a piece of work, isn't he?

Wayne County Assistant Prosecutor Dennis Doherty said he needs stricter laws to prosecute scrappers and scavengers.


“I’m begging that this law be passed,” he said. “Because the only thing we can prosecute now is if we can catch someone in the act of stealing.”


But state Rep. Tom McMillin, R-Rochester Hills, asked police and prosecutors: “How much more policing do you want businesses to do for you?”

[SWMAP]

Rashida Tlaib posted this today:

Dear neighbors and friends,

Check out what happen to me today!

I can’t make this stuff up. I take my two boys to the foot of the Belle Isle bridge where these great fountains are for kids to play in and only spend an hour there before I get back to my car and immediately realize, as I start the car, that scrappers stole my catalytic converter [[again!). Of course, I am furious and find out that I have to replace it with one from the manufacturer or my warranty would be voided [[over $550 just for the part). I am boiling by this time so instead of crying about it, I go straight to the scrap yard I know would have bought it! Joe [[the owner) was in complete shock when he sees me walk in and can see I am about to burst. The first thing I say, “where is my catalytic converter Joe?”

At the same time, I get a call from the Governor’s office that I answer while following him [[I am not making this up). The Governor’s office wants to set up a conference call with Michigan State Police about my scrap metal bills. I proceed to tell her where I am at and let Joe know that “this is amazing timing Joe because the Governor’s folks want to discuss scrap theft, do you wanna talk to them?”

Let’s just say I will have my catalytic converter back in the morning! At the end, Joe mumbles, “out of all the people that would steal from.” This just fuels me to fight even harder for fair and just accountability in Michigan’s scrap metal industry. Enough!

Please go to https://www.facebook.com/StopTheTheft and tell the Legislature why scrap metal theft reform is important to you or email me at rashidatlaib@house.mi.gov

They are not hearing enough from us.

Best, Rashida