A challenge for the 'Detroiters get what they deserve for electing those people' crow

[jt1]

First I will admit that leadership in the city is sorely lacking - I'm sure we can all agree to that. I do however question how people revise 'their' candidates based upon history. I also believe that one of the biggest issues we face is dealing with the number of people that are on the ballot. By creating council by districts we could make the process of selecting the best candidate[[s) much more reasonable.

While I spend too much time researching as many candidates as possible it is an overwhelming task. I am lucky enough to have maple spare time to research but many in the city do not.

So with that in mind, if you don't live in the city and have ever used 'they get what they deserve' type comments as it relates to leadership I offer a challenge.

With the list of 160+ City council candidates I ask you to list who you would vote for if you lived in the city. Possibly even a top 3.

[ZRX Doug]

There's a crow that's saying these things about us?
Damn birds!

[dexterferry]

and a p.s. to your point, jt1, I think lately detroit voters have actually shown the suburban "Detroiters get what they deserve" attitude to be such a sign of ignorance. detroiters elected a mild-mannered suburbanite mayor. polling showed hardly any support for conyers' reelection bid. even kwame just squeaked by in his last election, and would have lost if it hadn't been for the last-minute "hendrix is the suburban candidate" media blitz funded completely by suburban oligarchs.

it makes it easier for suburbanites to write off the city by saying "Detroiters get what they deserve" and point to the handful of vocal [[and usually deeply-invested) parties who speak up in support of the corrupt politicians claiming that this extremely vocal minority speaks for the majority. when suburbanites hear the race card being played they make the ridiculous assumption that all detroit voters buy into it.

I voted for Monica Conyers. At the time, I didn't know much about her other than her relationship with a man whose contribution to civil rights and public service I deeply respected. Obviously, that was a mistake, but I'm a white raised-in-the-suburbs detroiter by choice and not the sort of person people like "Buy American" and others point to when placing blame for the level of corruption in Detroit government. And I certainly would know better than to vote for her now, as would most Detroiters I talk to.

the voting system here does, as JT1 suggests, make it a challenge to really concentrate on the best qualified and least-likely-to-be-corrupt candidates. but that's a systemic problem, not one that should be repeatedly blamed on detroit voters.

[jt1]

Now for the people that are voting:

Make sure that you only vote for the best candidates. If that is 9 then great. There is nothing that dictates that you must vote for 9. Is there are only 4-5 candidates that you like then only vote for those candidates.

[jt1]

There's a crow that's saying these things about us?
Damn birds!

I tried to edit but the title didn't want to cooperate. I can't recall if I was talking about a crowd or a crow.

[rjk]

So with that in mind, if you don't live in the city and have ever used 'they get what they deserve' type comments as it relates to leadership I offer a challenge.

With the list of 160+ City council candidates I ask you to list who you would vote for if you lived in the city. Possibly even a top 3.

It's not a voters job to find out who is on the ballot and do some research on them.
It's the candidates job to reach out to the voters with pamphlets, phone calls, going door to door and by other means. How would someone who doesn't live in the city get this information?

I didn't realize there was going to be a test on this. If I did I would have paid more attention to the candidates and had one of my friends who live in the city show me all the campaign literature they received.

Here are some good rules to follow:

Rule #1. Don't vote for someone whose claim to fame is singing "Jimmy Mack."
If someones notoriety involves an occupation that doesn't involve a lot of thinking they probably shouldn't be on the city council.

Rule #2. If someone previously served in public office and was investigated by the Justice Department and the House Ethics Committee she [[BRC) needs to be one and done. Not voted on city council.

Rule #3. Be careful about voting for someone who is related to a well known politician, especially if you don't know much about them.

A lot of people don't have the spare time to research the candidates?
Not surprising when "a lot" of people don't even have the spare time to vote.

[jt1]

It's not a voters job to find out who is on the ballot and do some research on them.
It's the candidates job to reach out to the voters with pamphlets, phone calls, going door to door and by other means. How would someone who doesn't live in the city get this information? .

Well, seeing that I have received flyers from a total of two candidates what would you recommend the voters of Detroit do if candidates are not 'reaching out'? Since you have a simple solution for everything should we abstain from voting if nobody reaches out? Based upon your last statement that is not the case. How do you propose I, as a voter resolve that?

I didn't realize there was going to be a test on this. If I did I would have paid more attention to the candidates and had one of my friends who live in the city show me all the campaign literature they received. .

Exactly. You claim voters should vote for the candidates that get their message out. None are getting their message out. If I follow your advice should I vote for those that are reaching out [[none) or ignore all of those that have not reached out [[all). Either way, I can't win in your snarky opinion.


.[/quote]Here are some good rules to follow:

Rule #1. Don't vote for someone whose claim to fame is singing "Jimmy Mack."
If someones notoriety involves an occupation that doesn't involve a lot of thinking they probably shouldn't be on the city council..[/quote]

Agreed.

Rule #2. If someone previously served in public office and was investigated by the Justice Department and the House Ethics Committee she [[BRC) needs to be one and done. Not voted on city council..

Agreed in regards to not voting in the incumbents in this manner. Now there is a chance that one of the 160+ was investigated. How do you propose I reasearch the 160+ to ensure this is not the case?

Rule #3. Be careful about voting for someone who is related to a well known politician, especially if you don't know much about them..

With the recent KK and MC issues this would make sense. I don't know if I agree with completely disqualifying someone because of their relatives. I think that George Bush 1 was a decent President. GWB was a debacle. Recently it appears that relatives are a mess but it is not always the situation and is not fair to discount someone due to their family. If I did I would probably be accused of being a lazy Detroiter that ignores someone based upon name recognition.

A lot of people don't have the spare time to research the candidates?
Not surprising when "a lot" of people don't even have the spare time to vote.

And how does that apply to me and the others that vote in every election?

[Crumbled_pavement]

jt1, here's an idea I've been tossing around in my head. You're right, it'd be hard for one person to research 160 individuals [[most of which just see an opportunity to rob people legally). However, it might be easier if a group of people researched the current candidates. If 10 people volunteered to do the work then each person could research 16 people and then everyone could consolodate their results and publish them via a web site. This could then serve as a guide and allow candidates to address their profile. This site would also include links to all the candidate's individual web sites.

It doesn't matter if you're a city or suburban resident, if you want the best candidates on the city council then why not volunteer to be one of the ten researchers? I can combine all the information and format it on a web site and create a pamplet and boom! Now everyone has a good reference point to start with.

Who is with me to do the research? If I can find at least 9 more people I can create a template of the type of information we need on each candidate.

Volunteers can send me an email at votesmartdetroit@hotmail.com

[Retroit]

As a white suburbanite, let me say for the record that I do NOT think Detroiters are getting what they deserve. I think that one of the biggest problems facing City Council candidates and newly elected members is that being a councilmember in a big city is a very demanding job that most average/typical residents are not up to. Even being a councilmember in a small city is a demanding job. Multiply that by all the pressing problems in a city such as Detroit and it's not to hard to understand why so many councilmembers fail to live up to their expectations.

Districting may help to some extent, but how will accountability be ensured at the district level? Will there be "district meetings" where the councilmember is present and held into account? Will the councilmember have the ability to initiate "executive powers" to improve their district? Or will we end up with pretty much what we have now?

As for picking councilmembers, I watched the interview show on PBS and was unimpressed by the dozen or so that were on [[except for Ken Cockrel, Jr, a shoe-in). Only a couple mentioned any community involvement.

wxyz.com also has a link where candidates' speeches can be watched.

[jt1]

jt1, here's an idea I've been tossing around in my head. You're right, it'd be hard for one person to research 160 individuals [[most of which just see an opportunity to rob people legally). However, it might be easier if a group of people researched the current candidates. If 10 people volunteered to do the work then each person could research 16 people and then everyone could consolodate their results and publish them via a web site. This could then serve as a guide and allow candidates to address their profile. This site would also include links to all the candidate's individual web sites.

It doesn't matter if you're a city or suburban resident, if you want the best candidates on the city council then why not volunteer to be one of the ten researchers? I can combine all the information and format it on a web site and create a pamplet and boom! Now everyone has a good reference point to start with.

Who is with me to do the research? If I can find at least 9 more people I can create a template of the type of information we need on each candidate.

Volunteers can send me an email at votesmartdetroit@hotmail.com

Count me in. My e-mail is jt1_detroit@yahoo.com

[jt1]

As a white suburbanite, let me say for the record that I do NOT think Detroiters are getting what they deserve. I think that one of the biggest problems facing City Council candidates and newly elected members is that being a councilmember in a big city is a very demanding job that most average/typical residents are not up to. Even being a councilmember in a small city is a demanding job. Multiply that by all the pressing problems in a city such as Detroit and it's not to hard to understand why so many councilmembers fail to live up to their expectations.

Districting may help to some extent, but how will accountability be ensured at the district level? Will there be "district meetings" where the councilmember is present and held into account? Will the councilmember have the ability to initiate "executive powers" to improve their district? Or will we end up with pretty much what we have now?

As for picking councilmembers, I watched the interview show on PBS and was unimpressed by the dozen or so that were on [[except for Ken Cockrel, Jr, a shoe-in). Only a couple mentioned any community involvement.

wxyz.com also has a link where candidates' speeches can be watched.

I think the major benefit by district is that it will allow people to choose from a smaller pool of people that 'should' be more accessible and accountable. It will certainly not address corruption but what is important is the accountability.

Right now anyone can vote for 9 people so someone can have limited support and get a relatively small percent of the vote but win. It is easier to fool [[or count on fools) a small percent across the entire city than a more concentrated number in a smaller district. Additionally, someone may win by being the 9th choice on a small percent of people's ballots. I certainly don't want someone who is the 9th best to most people representing the city.

Thanks for the heads up on the WXYZ site.

[Crumbled_pavement]

Count me in. My e-mail is jt1_detroit@yahoo.com

I added you as a contact. I set up a placeholder web site with a very general template for information to gather on candidates. Feel free to offer suggestions. Note, at the moment, I could care less about formating. That is the easy part of this project. I'm more concerned about content and ease of use.

Web site address is http://votesmartdetroit.uuuq.com/.

Vote Smart Detroit Researchers:
jt1, Crumbled_pavement

Anybody else want to volunteer? I need at least 8 more people.

[MsChievous]

Crumbled, et. al.,

I am a candidate for the Detroit Charter Commission but I am also a voter. As I've gone around the city talking to residents about my candidacy, many have asked some of the questions posed here and I have made them this promise: as I collect the literature from the many candidates running for various offices, I save their web sites. About once a week, I update my list and send it to those who have provided me with their email address. I will send you the list to the email you've posted here. I hope it helps and you'll keep it going.

Cara
Blount4Charter@yahoo.com

Also, there are some candidate videos at www.mivote.org. It's unscripted but you can at least hear some of the candidates and their platforms [[if they have one!).

[MsChievous]

I have a few more but they're on another computer [[with a bum monitor!).



City Council
www.electgarybrown.com/ [[Gary Brown)
www.karindawashington.com/ [[Karinda Washington)
www.spiveyfordetroit.com [[Andre Spivey)
www.bennettfordetroit.com [[John Bennett)
www.deliciacoleman09.com [[Delicia Taylor Coleman)
www.foyforcitycouncil.com [[Shelley Foy)
www.saunteeljenkins.com [[Saunteel Jenkins)
www.fredhall2009.com [[Fred Elliott Hall)
www.voteroberson.com/ [[Dalton Roberson, Jr)
www.kennethdonaldson4citycouncil.com [[Kenneth Donaldson)
www.lawandaharrison4detroit.com [[Lawanda Harrison)
www.cgriffinjr4detroitcitycouncil.com [[Clinton Griffin)
www.beverly4detroit.com [[Beverly Kindle Walker)
www.giveemhale.com [[Derek Hale)
www.jonas4council.com
www.actionjackson4detroit.com
www.friendsforfoster.com [[Dale Foster)
www.gainesfordetroit.com [[Tamika Gaines)
www.crawford4council.com/ [[Mikal Crawford)
www.yolandajack.com [[Yolanda Jack)
www.lerrlynfordetroitcitycouncil.com
www.whybell.com
www.raphaelbjohnson4citycouncil.com [[Raphael Johnson)


Mayor

www.motownmayor.com
www.allman4mayor.com

City Clerk


School Board
www.deborahedavis.com

Charter Commission
www.Blount4Charter.com [[Cara Blount)

www.dbrownfordetroit.com Darryl Brown)
Chiquita McKenzie Bennett
John R. Eddings
Ken Coleman
Ken Harris
Elena Herrada

[stromberg2]

Add Andy Linn's name for Charter Commision.

Stromberg2

[ThaFuzz]

http://www.vote4growth.com/ - Matthew Naimi [[City Council)

[MsChievous]

It's not finished, that was just a start. I've met Andy and Matt, both are good candidates [[Andy for charter and Matt for council). I will be doing a separate email just listing the charter candidates and many of them have offered to provide bios. I hope to have that together in the next few days.

With the campaign in full force, I admit that I don't get to the DYes web site as often as I used to. If you'd like me to email you when I get the full list of 44 charter candidates together, drop me an email at blount4charter at yahoo dot com

Cara

[mjs]

It's not a voters job to find out who is on the ballot and do some research on them.
It's the candidates job to reach out to the voters with pamphlets, phone calls, going door to door and by other means.

I couldn't disagree more. The candidates with the most money will be able to reach out to the most people. Since candidates get their money from special interest, the candidates most likely to reach out are the ones most indebted to special interest. All other things being equal, I vote for the candidate that has raised the least money.

Read a newspaper, do a web search, get an opinion from the League of Women's voters. It affects your life more than a hockey game or episode of American Idol. When people think its too much effort to paint their house, wash their dishes, and mow their lawn, they live in a shit hole. When people think its too much effort to read a newspaper, research a candidate, or stop in on a an occassional meeting, the end up with a shitty government. Its the nature of existance that anything in life worth having requires effort.