The Packards racist signs on the skywalk over Grand Blvd.

**Django** · February-06-13, 11:50 PM

Surprised no one started a thread on this. One of our own here took it down.

http://www.freep.com/article/2013020...tion-camp-sign

**KJ5** · February-06-13, 11:58 PM

Thanks, Mauser!

**Gannon** · February-07-13, 12:02 AM

Curious quote.

"As an artist, you should know better," Goldman said. "I see no value to seeing this as a message, ... That's a poor image to use."

I know a bunch of artists, and have casually watched the popular international scene for my entire lifetime.

I cannot recall a firm instance where any of them knew any better. Most of the edgy artists incite emotional response in ORDER to foment this sort of dialogue...and occasional action.

In this case, we had a mini-riot of one...at least someone was outraged enough to tear some shit up...amidst the wagging tongues and dancing fingertips.

I wonder how that would've been perceived if, say, a fundamentalist Christian had destroyed some of Maplethorpe's more controversial pieces...or pisses.

I'm just sayin'.

If artists know better, then they do it to us on purpose.

**mwilbert** · February-07-13, 12:03 AM

It is really hard for me to get upset about this. It was a stupid prank, but was someone actually targeting this at the large number of Jewish folks driving down E. Grand Blvd? Oops. It wouldn't seem to have a high degree of salience for anyone else. An unusually ineffective hate crime. And it is very unclear what it means--it is obviously a reference to Auschwitz, but what that reference is supposed to be telling me, I have no idea.

However, I'm glad someone took it down.

**Gannon** · February-07-13, 12:05 AM

LOL @ 'unusually ineffective'...brilliant!

It did get that 'reporter' for the Freep upset enough to show her bias, though, so there's that. If that is what the Freep has devolved into, I don't need to consider them a news source any longer.

**detroitsgwenivere** · February-07-13, 12:25 AM

Originally Posted by mwilbert

However, I'm glad someone took it down.

I feel the same way. When i saw this sign, my first thought wasn't, "Wow, someone has a serious beef with Jews..." I thought the sign had more to do with the state of our city or about Right to Work.

I get why the sign is offensive and should come down. I just don't think the idea that the signhanger was trying to communicate was as cut and dry as the Jewish Defamation League would like us to believe. Upon hearing the statement the group released, I realized that they may be somewhat [[or totally) ignorant to the current state of politics in this region.

**Jimaz** · February-07-13, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by detroitsgwenivere

... I thought the sign had more to do with the state of our city or about Right to Work....

Good point. "Right to work" = "Work shall set you free"

Well done, detroitsgwenivere.

Sincerely. <<== an understatement.

**princealbert** · February-07-13, 12:49 AM

I my opinion, the artist's intent was to equate the Holocaust with the demise of the manufacturing sector and subsequent destruction of inner city America. Both are man-made tragedies of the first order. That was my first thought, not some kind of hatred toward Jews or anything racist. On the other hand I'm sure the artist knew there would be some kind of negative reaction eventually. Getting a reaction is the point of unsanctioned public art, right? Mission accomplished.

**princealbert** · February-07-13, 12:58 AM

Originally Posted by Jimaz

Good point. "Right to work" = "Work shall set you free"

Well done, detroitsgwenivere.

Sincerely. <<== an understatement.

"Freedom to Work" is the new catch-phrase.

**Gannon** · February-07-13, 07:13 AM

So, that makes the descendants of those originally duped and insulted by this term the LEAST tolerant, let alone unsympathetic or even pathetically unempathetic. That seems to be the end of that lonely road of unforgiveness, and perhaps why most every mystical tradition seeks to have their adherents learn to release all that negative stuff. Especially that which lingers beyond a generation or two.

Because, at the very least, it might get one on the wrong side of something not fully considered. Easy to do while wearing blinders.

Sure wish the artist[[s) would chime in somehow with at least a hint of why they went to all the trouble, unless they are embarrassed they mis-measured the window openings as bad as they did.

There are a few usual suspects in the community who are certainly capable of performing public art of this stature and weight. I'd wonder about those who are being the most quiet about it, heh.

Cheers!

**Wheels** · February-07-13, 10:11 AM

I guess there are many ways to look at this but I don't see this as racist at all.

Detroit and Packard who expanded heavily for the war effort represented the "Arsenal Of Democracy".

The hard work and dedication in these plants played a big part in the war effort and the pursuit of liberty and freedom.

The irony is the destruction that those weapons caused has all but been repaired wile Detroit lies in ruins.

What happened?

**oladub** · February-07-13, 10:54 AM

In Philadelphia, a black guy dressed up in a KKK outfit and stood on a corner to bring attention to his issue that every six months blacks kill as many other blacks as the KKK has killed in its entire existence. His point was that something has to be done about it.

I can understand the offense caused to Jews and blacks by such shock tactics. There is, as Wheels just mentioned, an irony in the 'Arbeit macht Frei' sign although I was thinking it had to do with the loss of economic freedom resulting from the collapse of Detroit's auto industry. The bleak desolation in the photo below was mirrored in the Detroit parody that political cartoonists and artists types notice.

Even religious people get outraged and shocked by artists. For instance, there was the Danish cartoon of mohammed and an art exhibit showing a Jesus in Piss piece of artwork. Censors are still with us.

The fellow responsible for Philadelphia incident was successful in bringing national attention to his issue that other wise he probably could not have attained even though his method offended some people. I appreciated the irony of the Detroit parody but realize that others have sensitivities that must have been prodded by the reminder of horror.

**Goose** · February-07-13, 11:02 AM

Jewish is a race? this sign was overtly racist? at most it may have been anti-semitic.... controversial yes, but does make you think about the living and social conditions throughout much of the city....

**Honky Tonk** · February-07-13, 11:02 AM

I believe the term is "anti-semitism" when refering to the hatred of Jews, not "racism".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism

**mauser** · February-07-13, 11:12 AM

a death camp sign hung on Albert Kahns building ? NO.

**Danny** · February-07-13, 12:46 PM

There are lots of racist graffiti all over the Ghettohoods of Detroit. You just need to spot one. Since Detroit is 82% Black racist remarks will likely to happen all the way to its city government. Get use to it folks.

**56packman** · February-07-13, 01:41 PM

Packard expanded the plant to the north for the war effort, the "newer" portion of the plant along Concord was built for war production, fighting the forces that carried out the holocaust. Packard produced 55,000 Rolls-Royce Merlin Fighter plane engines, they took a typically British hand-made, hand-fitted kluge and made a precise, interchangeable precision engine that gave excellent service. They built almost as many PT boat engines, which were mostly aluminum. After the war Packard had a decent defense business, building custom-designed marine engines and J-47 Jet engines for the military. In 1953 the US Secretary of the Defense "Engine Charlie" Wilson steered all defense contracts away from all other vendors to his former employer, General Motors. That is the thank-you Packard received for being an asset to the war effort 8 years earlier. The loss of that defense work was horrible to Packard, and it forced them to survive on their car profits only.

**1953** · February-07-13, 03:38 PM

This sign is great satire...people need to calm down. Who could even hate Jews anymore? Is that a thing anymore? There isn't a Jew within 20 miles of that neighborhood.

**Wheels** · February-07-13, 03:51 PM

Do people who defend graffiti as Beautification really have the right to be offended by graffiti they don't like?

**compn** · February-07-13, 04:05 PM

when people make a big deal out of this, you will see copycats follow...
freep reporting about grafitti? really?

i'm wondering why it was done on paper instead of written w/ paint.

**mauser** · February-07-13, 05:18 PM

It wasnt done on paper and the letters were painted.

I think people here greatly underestimate how angry and upset the Anti-Defamation League is about this, as well as the local Jewish community. I also think people here are not giving enough weigh to the RIGHT of the ADL to be enraged by such a disrespectful act. Trivializing the Holocaust is not going to get you anywhere with anybody. If you are not Jewish, you just dont own that stuff, and you dont get the final say as to what is offensive or damaging to those people.

This time, it is not about Detroit looking bad. The sign persisting unchallenged without being removed and hitting the international news cycle as-is would be damaging to the reputation of the United States.

Look, the sign maker had their say and did whatever that was supposed to do. Should the sign have stayed forever ? How long is long enough ? Taking it down could never change the fact that it was up and plenty of people saw it and photographed it. They made their statement. My friend and I went up there with hammers, and we made our statement.

People can keep arguing for the sign and the sign maker, but history is on my side.

**Gannon** · February-07-13, 05:57 PM

Quite frankly, I daresay this sheds positive light on our artists, in the fact that at least two are studied enough in history to put this phrase from over a generation ago in the midst of the whole controversial neighborhood today.

I'd like to say to our mystery originator and Mauser a hearty thank you for doing your part to make this dialogue possible.

It is bringing people together who might not otherwise have met, and shedding more light on blight from the flight, which we all know wasn't right.

Cheers!

**Richard** · February-07-13, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by mauser

It wasnt done on paper and the letters were painted.

I think people here greatly underestimate how angry and upset the Anti-Defamation League is about this, as well as the local Jewish community. I also think people here are not giving enough weigh to the RIGHT of the ADL to be enraged by such a disrespectful act. Trivializing the Holocaust is not going to get you anywhere with anybody. If you are not Jewish, you just dont own that stuff, and you dont get the final say as to what is offensive or damaging to those people.

This time, it is not about Detroit looking bad. The sign persisting unchallenged without being removed and hitting the international news cycle as-is would be damaging to the reputation of the United States.

Look, the sign maker had their say and did whatever that was supposed to do. Should the sign have stayed forever ? How long is long enough ? Taking it down could never change the fact that it was up and plenty of people saw it and photographed it. They made their statement. My friend and I went up there with hammers, and we made our statement.

People can keep arguing for the sign and the sign maker, but history is on my side.

You do not need to justify what you did, but on the other hand I am not sure why you keep insisting that Wayne county owns the building when you know the government cannot take possession with out due legal process which is the opposite of the reason you took the sign down.

So on one hand you despise the message and what was behind it and on the other hand you are promoting it by advocating that the government should be allowed to seize private property without due process,you cannot have it both ways.

**mauser** · February-07-13, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by Richard

I am not sure why you keep insisting that Wayne county owns the building .

The County is in the process of foreclosure started last fall as required by law. This is my understanding.

I am not justifying anything - many people are not understanding that the sign needed to come down. I am talking about why I did it so people might understand why the sign was wrong and very hurtful.

**Richard** · February-07-13, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by mauser

The County is in the process of foreclosure started last fall as required by law. This is my understanding.

I am not justifying anything - many people are not understanding that the sign needed to come down. I am talking about why I did it so people might understand why the sign was wrong and very hurtful.

Zab – yeah, the City is probably my last choice for taking action, but it was such an inflammatory issue I would think somebody would do some damage control. If I believed they would take care of it, I wouldnt have done it myself.

Not to mention that Packard belongs to Wayne County, not Detroit or the ecstasy guy. Wayne County has enough money and resources to deal with Packard, but everybody is still playing hot potato with that property to avoid the expense.

Well maybe I am confused but when somebody says the above I take it not in the process aspect but in the current sense.

No hot potato it is clear and simple the government cannot just seize private land and has to follow due process.If they do not then you have what the sign represented.The sign represents a mindset and not a very nice one in the least,it is not the sign or the plant that scares me,it is that mindset.

It is in the city of Detroit the county handles the foreclosures for the city it is not now or ever been owned by Wayne County.

If it was not in the city why is the city still involved in the lawsuit from when they took it before without due process and the same city that does not want it rehabilitated come hell or high water.

Wayne County would love to see it rehabilitated and producing jobs and I am sure they wish they had it in their jurisdiction.

It could be 1 hour before the foreclosure auction and be quit claim deeded for $1 to another corporation and the process would have to start all over again so do not be so hasty to write it off.All it takes is a sale of the property and it does not say how much the property has to sell for.