Wal-Mart wants to open store in Southfield [Voted Down by Sfld Council]

**Hypestyles** · January-14-13, 02:53 PM

Looks like this isn't quite a done deal yet. Seems like there will be considerable community pushback in Southfield, certainly for the chosen site. I wonder why Wal-Mart, to date, has not explored any urban Detroit locations.

Taking into account the various abandoned former industrial and retail sites, there would seemingly be a lot more land parcels to explore, especially if the intent is to build one of those huge supercenters—supposedly, the potential site in Southfield would have to be scaled down in comparison.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/20...house-of-goods

**laphoque** · January-14-13, 04:13 PM

They should buy the Hotel Charlevoix and put a store on the ground floor and give free rent to indentured servants they can get from abroad. Of course, they'll have to buy everything on credit. Hahahahah [[Not that Americans don't still buy a lot on credit even if non-student loan debt has decreased).

**MidTownMs** · January-14-13, 05:42 PM

I do not understand why people keep asking why major retailers won't open stores in Detroit. The Answer: They do not want to open stores in Detroit. There were major retail and grocery stores all over Detroit. It should be no mystery to anyone why they have all left and have not returned. They have not returned for the same reason that there are no malls, Sears, Kmart, Wal-Mart, Sam's Club, Costco, Penney's, Meijer's, Kroger, or Target, etc., etc, etc in Detroit. I think every person here already knows what the reason is. If you don't know you must have been living under a rock. The same reason why there are no major retail in Detroit is the same reason Wal-Mart is more than likely not exploring Detroit locations. I don't need to go into the reason because at least one-half of the posts here have already discussed this topic to death. Why do you think people are jumping up and down and acting like the opening of a Buffalo Wild Wings is tantamount to the second coming?

**iheartthed** · January-14-13, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by MidTownMs

There is a reason whey there are no malls, Sears, Kmart, Wal-Mart, Sam's Club, Costco, Penney's, Meijer's, Kroger, or Target, etc., etc, etc and I think every person here already knows what the reason is.

Because they'll still get Detroiters money without having to open a store in Detroit.

**gazhekwe** · January-14-13, 06:09 PM

Twelve Mile and Southfield is already very congested. Some traffic planning would be required.

**313WX** · January-14-13, 06:13 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Because they'll still get Detroiters money without having to open a store in Detroit.

It's a win-win for these retailers from a business perspective.

They're able to reap the benefits of Detroit's dollars without incurring the risk of investing in Detroit.

If Detroiters want retailers to open in the city, stop robbing the retailers blind and demand that the city increase fire/police protection [[both of which will never happen in my lifetime the way things are going).

Tax breaks will only keep them for so long until Meijer and Whole Foods realize hundreds of dollars worth of merchandise is marching out of the door so often while the police won't even show up to catch the thieves.

**iheartthed** · January-14-13, 06:18 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

It's a win-win for these retailers from a business perspective.

They're able to reap the benefits of Detroit's dollars without incurring the risk of investing in Detroit.

If Detroiters want retailers to open in the city, stop robbing the retailers blind and demand that the city increase fire/police protection [[both of which will never happen in my lifetime the way things are going).

Tax breaks will only keep them for so long until Meijer and Whole Foods realize hundreds of dollars worth of merchandise is marching out of the door so often while the police won't even show up to catch the thieves.

I think you're a bit misguided. Home Depot has somehow made it work in Detroit for like a decade now, and it was at one point the most profitable location in Michigan.

The simple reason that retailers don't locate in Detroit is because they don't need to in order to get Detroit's money. There is not a single Meijer, Kroger, Wal Mart, Target or Macy's in the city of Detroit. But I dare you to find a Detroit resident who hasn't shopped at one of those stores in the past month.

**313WX** · January-14-13, 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I think you're a bit misguided. Home Depot has somehow made it work in Detroit for like a decade now, and it was at one point the most profitable location in Michigan.

THAT Home Depot is a bit unique where...

1. It is the only home improvement store in at least a several-mile radius [[Home Depot closed the Northland store after opening the 7 Mile/Meyers location).

2. It's near several relatively wealthy neighborhoods.

3. It sells goods that don't shrink as fast. Good luck walking a toilet or plywood out the door without getting caught [[and why would someone want to snatch those items up and steal them?).

On the flip-side, take Eastland's Target which boasted the highest shrinkage rate of all stores in the country. The folks in Minneapolis have debated over to over again about closing that store.

**iheartthed** · January-14-13, 06:28 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

THAT Home Depot is a bit unique where...

1. It is the only home improvement store in at least a several-mile radius [[Home Depot closed the Northland store after opening the 7 Mile/Meyers location).

2. It's near several relatively wealthy neighborhoods.

3. It sells goods that don't shrink as fast. Good luck walking a toilet or plywood out the door without getting caught [[and why would someone want to snatch those items up and steal them?).

On the flip-side, take Eastland's Target which boasted the highest shrinkage rate of all stores in the country. The folks in Minneapolis have debated over to over again about closing that store.

Eastland is not in Detroit.

**313WX** · January-14-13, 06:41 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Eastland is not in Detroit.

Oh please. Who do you think the stores in Eastland cater to? People in Grosse Pointe?

Even sticking with the "Eastland is not in Detroit" line, how do you explain the 7 Mile/Gratiot Kroger or Bel-Air Centre [[which BTW also had a Target that closed for whatever reason)?

And even if you ignore the shrinkage problem and poor police response time, don't forget the ridiculous insurance rates these businesses must incur because the insurance companies see how piss poor the DPD/DFD are right now.

**iheartthed** · January-14-13, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Oh please. Who do you think the stores in Eastland cater to? People in Grosse Pointe?

So when Target closes its Eastland store people from Detroit will suddenly stop shopping at Target? I don't get your point.

**313WX** · January-14-13, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

So when Target closes its Eastland store people from Detroit will suddenly stop shopping at Target? I don't get your point.

I also don't understand why you seem to think just because it's in Harper Woods, it's automatically immune from Detroiters who can simply cross Kelly Road and also rob the place blind, especially given that it's directly across from what is now deemed the poorest zip code in the state/city, and arguably the country.

**D_Town** · January-14-13, 06:57 PM

Last I heard that they were looking at buying the lost where that abandoned hotel is on 9 mile.

**Wheels** · January-14-13, 06:57 PM

Detroit has a Kmart on Telegraph and 8mile. What they don't have is security!

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/19...rth-of-jewelry

**MidTownMs** · January-14-13, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

I also don't understand why you seem to think just because it's in Harper Woods, it's automatically immune from Detroiters who can simply cross Kelly Road and also rob the place blind, especially given that it's directly across from what is now deemed the poorest zip code in the state/city, and arguably the country.

Would that Zip Code happen to be 48205?

**313WX** · January-14-13, 07:27 PM

Originally Posted by MidTownMs

Would that Zip Code happen to be 48205?

You would be correct.

**Vic_doucette** · January-14-13, 08:09 PM

Originally Posted by gazhekwe

Twelve Mile and Southfield is already very congested. Some traffic planning would be required.

I was one of several dozen people who spoke to the city planning commission against the redevelopment of that corner into a WalMart, and that was my biggest complaint. 12 Mile/Southfield is one of the most congested intersections in Oakland County. During morning and afternoon rush hour, it can take several cycles of the traffic lights to get through, especially on 12 Mile. Adding a retail development of that size to the corner would be a nightmare. WalMart offered to pay for computerized traffic lights to be installed as a part of the development, but I don't think that's going to solve the traffic problem.

Then, there's the light pollution, noise pollution and other issues associated with a development that big. It would be bad for the residential neighborhoods immediately adjacent to the property.

WalMart also said that it would be paying about $300,000 in annual taxes on the property, compared to the zero-tax status the property now has. But City Council member Joan Seymour pointed out that the city would only get about $100,000 of that, which would be just sufficient to hire exactly one new police officer. I suspect that the added traffic and crime that a development like this would surely bring is more than one cop would be reasonably expected to handle.

There's a church in Detroit that had been negotiating with the Archdiocese of Detroit to buy the property and use the existing church building there [[the former St. Bede's) as a new home to the congregation; the building has been unused since 2007 and is becoming an eyesore. According to the people from the Detroit church, negotiations were proceeding until the offer got yanked off the table when WalMart stepped in.

There had also been a discussion of a charter school taking over the property. One of the lamebrains on the city planning commission said, preposterously that even a charter school would cause noise and traffic problems in the area, so why would it be so bad for a WalMart to be there?

Despite the very vocal opposition to the proposed development [[the meeting started at around 6:30 p.m., IIRC, and they were still going strong when I left at midnight), the commission voted 5-1 to recommend to City Council that the proposal be approved.

I don't choose to shop at WalMart myself, but I don't have a problem if others choose to shop there. I don't have a problem with them locating in Southfield, either, but I think that particular intersection is the wrong place for the development. I think there are other parts of the city, especially in or near Northland, where such a development would be a better fit.

**gazhekwe** · January-14-13, 08:19 PM

Agh, the Planning Commission. Is Roy Bell still on that? He was the only one who had any sense when we were working with them over some new houses being added to a wetland behind us. At least we will get some traction with City Council, I hope.

**Vic_doucette** · January-14-13, 08:31 PM

Bell was the lone dissenter.

http://www.candgnews.com/news/planni...ion-southfield

**gazhekwe** · January-14-13, 08:49 PM

Good for Roy.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · January-14-13, 08:52 PM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I think you're a bit misguided. Home Depot has somehow made it work in Detroit for like a decade now, and it was at one point the most profitable location in Michigan.

The simple reason that retailers don't locate in Detroit is because they don't need to in order to get Detroit's money. There is not a single Meijer, Kroger, Wal Mart, Target or Macy's in the city of Detroit. But I dare you to find a Detroit resident who hasn't shopped at one of those stores in the past month.

That's about to change with Meijer's opening stores at 8 Mile and Woodward and 6 Mile and Grand River, on the old Redford High School site.

**KJ5** · January-14-13, 09:16 PM

There is not a single Meijer, Kroger, Wal Mart, Target or Macy's in the city of Detroit. But I dare you to find a Detroit resident who hasn't shopped at one of those stores in the past month.[/QUOTE]
I'm a Detroit resident who hasn't shopped at any of those stores in at least a year. Macy's I've never shopped at, and as for Sprawl-Mart, well, I wouldn't set foot in there if they opened one right down the street from me.

**DetroitPlanner** · January-14-13, 09:25 PM

Originally Posted by MidTownMs

Why do you think people are jumping up and down and acting like the opening of a Buffalo Wild Wings is tantamount to the second coming?

Wow! You must have been there opening night like I was. I sat at the bar and drank myself silly. Then is saw Jesus and he asked me if I tried the fire hot wings! Did he ask you that too?

Crime is your real answer. The criminals know they can go into the stores, take what they want and by the time the cops come they are long gone. I feel sorry for not only the small business owners but to those who live in the City but not real close to a suburb that has these things.

Shollin · January-14-13, 09:28 PM

I used to work loss prevention at Kmart a long time ago. It isn't police response time that deters theft. Even in the suburbs if the criminals are out the door, they're as good as gone.