408 homicides in 2012

**AUSSIE** · January-07-13, 09:51 PM

Just in case u missed it, just a tad behind NY with a slightly larger population

Los Angeles has nearly six times the population of Detroit, but has fewer cops per capita. Los Angeles spends less money on its police department per cop than Detroit, so money is not the issue. Nor is geography. Los Angeles is 500 square miles while Detroit is 139 square miles.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/20508659/leduff-answers-accountability-lacking-as-more-bodies-fall-in-detroit

Don't know who this Bing fellow is, but he needs to fall on his sword top-urgent

"inactivity is death" B.Mussolini

Cheers

**MidTownMs** · January-07-13, 10:18 PM

Bing is the mayor of Detroit.

**Meddle** · January-07-13, 10:49 PM

All those words and you dropped the 'yo' in front of the 'u'.

Didn't Chicago just make a big deal over 500? What's the population difference there?

**MSUguy** · January-07-13, 11:01 PM

It was 386

http://www.freep.com/article/2013010...early-20-years

**Bad Brains** · January-08-13, 01:16 AM

I'm no Bing fan, but why is he getting so much heat for this? I'm pretty sure the murder rate is going to be high no matter who the mayor is.

**detroitsgwenivere** · January-08-13, 01:22 AM

I'm surprised its not higher, to be honest.

**Bad Brains** · January-08-13, 01:28 AM

Originally Posted by detroitsgwenivere

I'm surprised its not higher, to be honest.

Probably is higher. None of us know what goes on within that bureaucracy. How many numbers are padded? How many murders not even reported? If I had to guess, I'd say there is a good possibility of it being higher.

**firstandten** · January-08-13, 01:56 AM

Originally Posted by Bad Brains

I'm no Bing fan, but why is he getting so much heat for this? I'm pretty sure the murder rate is going to be high no matter who the mayor is.

I think what i and some others would like to see from the mayor is the anger that something like this would happen on his watch and sense of resolve from him that he is going to do something, change something, anything to get the murder rate down. I would like to see him use the best practices approach, find out what other cities are doing and copy them. He has no answers, just keep doing the same things and hope for a different result.

We understand that this high murder rate is not directly his fault. But he needs to show leadership and convince the people that he is going to find the answer and make a priority of getting the murder rate down.

I did hear he was going to move the deck chairs around on the titanic a little bit, so I will wait and hear what he has to say when he does that.

**Meddle** · January-08-13, 08:06 AM

How many missing persons cases are actually homicides?

How many people disappear that aren't even reported missing?

How many people don't have someone to report them missing?

**davewindsor** · January-08-13, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by AUSSIE

Just in case u missed it, just a tad behind NY with a slightly larger population

Los Angeles has nearly six times the population of Detroit, but has fewer cops per capita. Los Angeles spends less money on its police department per cop than Detroit, so money is not the issue. Nor is geography. Los Angeles is 500 square miles while Detroit is 139 square miles.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/20508659/leduff-answers-accountability-lacking-as-more-bodies-fall-in-detroit

Don't know who this Bing fellow is, but he needs to fall on his sword top-urgent

"inactivity is death" B.Mussolini

Cheers

Interesting they should talk about LA and not mention California's Three Strikes and You're Out Law. They estimate a million serious or violent crimes have been prevented every five years because of this law:

http://www.threestrikes.org/

"Three Strikes and You're Out" 15 Year Report shows an average of 1,000,000 serious or violent crimes are prevented every 5 years and 10,000 Californians spared from becoming murder victims since its passage in 1994. One amazing fact is that although California's population has gone up by 14,000,000 residents since its passage crime has not gone up proportionately. A remarkable stastic indeed. We've made a distributable PDF version available. Mike Reynolds has written some remarks to introduce this monumental study.

**Honky Tonk** · January-08-13, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Interesting they should talk about LA and not mention California's Three Strikes and You're Out Law. They estimate a million serious or violent crimes have been prevented every five years because of this law:

http://www.threestrikes.org/

"Three Strikes and You're Out" 15 Year Report shows an average of 1,000,000 serious or violent crimes are prevented every 5 years and 10,000 Californians spared from becoming murder victims since its passage in 1994. One amazing fact is that although California's population has gone up by 14,000,000 residents since its passage crime has not gone up proportionately. A remarkable stastic indeed. We've made a distributable PDF version available. Mike Reynolds has written some remarks to introduce this monumental study.

BS. What we need are more "Social Programs". If we throw even more free money @ crime, it'll eventually go away. Eventually.

**rjlj** · January-08-13, 10:04 AM

Inefficiency and waste. I heard that to process payroll for Detroit Police and Fire, that there are something like 65 employees.

Originally Posted by AUSSIE

Just in case u missed it, just a tad behind NY with a slightly larger population

Los Angeles has nearly six times the population of Detroit, but has fewer cops per capita. Los Angeles spends less money on its police department per cop than Detroit, so money is not the issue. Nor is geography. Los Angeles is 500 square miles while Detroit is 139 square miles.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/20508659/leduff-answers-accountability-lacking-as-more-bodies-fall-in-detroit

Don't know who this Bing fellow is, but he needs to fall on his sword top-urgent

"inactivity is death" B.Mussolini

Cheers

**davewindsor** · January-08-13, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

BS. What we need are more "Social Programs". If we throw even more free money @ crime, it'll eventually go away. Eventually.

Social programs for murderers to reduce the homicide rate? Do you have research to back it up that it works or are you just pulling stuff out of your butt.

**Honky Tonk** · January-08-13, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Social programs for murderers to reduce the homicide rate? Do you have research to back it up that it works or are you just pulling stuff out of your butt.

Pulling stuff out of my sarcastic butt. I was tarred and feathered for suggesting a tougher stance on crime. I'll keep quiet.

**Hermod** · January-08-13, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Social programs for murderers to reduce the homicide rate? Do you have research to back it up that it works or are you just pulling stuff out of your butt.

Post-partum abortions for killers/potential killers

**Crumbled_pavement** · January-08-13, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

BS. What we need are more "Social Programs".

What I can't understand for the life of me is why we can't have both [[more social programs that have been demonstrated to work and a tougher stance on crime)? Why is everything a 'this or that' instead of a 'this and that'?

**MidTownMs** · January-08-13, 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by detroitsgwenivere

I'm surprised its not higher, to be honest.

It probably is that's just the number of people murdered that they know about.

**MSUguy** · January-09-13, 02:56 PM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Interesting they should talk about LA and not mention California's Three Strikes and You're Out Law. They estimate a million serious or violent crimes have been prevented every five years because of this law:

http://www.threestrikes.org/

"Three Strikes and You're Out" 15 Year Report shows an average of 1,000,000 serious or violent crimes are prevented every 5 years and 10,000 Californians spared from becoming murder victims since its passage in 1994. One amazing fact is that although California's population has gone up by 14,000,000 residents since its passage crime has not gone up proportionately. A remarkable stastic indeed. We've made a distributable PDF version available. Mike Reynolds has written some remarks to introduce this monumental study.

Yes it was so effective that those same voter overwhelmingly undid parts of it TWICE because was wasting 100+ million dollars per year locking up non violent offenders. Thankfully most in CA didn't like this Mike Reynolds tool.

As to the OP how many of those cops are actually patrolling in LA vs Detroit

**Bad Brains** · January-10-13, 12:00 AM

Originally Posted by firstandten

I think what i and some others would like to see from the mayor is the anger that something like this would happen on his watch and sense of resolve from him that he is going to do something, change something, anything to get the murder rate down. I would like to see him use the best practices approach, find out what other cities are doing and copy them. He has no answers, just keep doing the same things and hope for a different result.

We understand that this high murder rate is not directly his fault. But he needs to show leadership and convince the people that he is going to find the answer and make a priority of getting the murder rate down.

I did hear he was going to move the deck chairs around on the titanic a little bit, so I will wait and hear what he has to say when he does that.

I kind of agree and disagree with you.

On one hand, I would like to see anger too. On the other hand, I'm sure he knows the murder rate is going to be high every year, so it's no surprise and would therefore be fake anger.

To his defense, what exactly can he do to get the murder rate down [[other than taint the actual numbers)? There isn't another major city with the type of problems Detroit has AT THIS LEVEL, so he has nothing to copy.

One extreme solution [[in my opinion) would be stop drug raids on dope houses, as that just opens up territories for new turf wars for the next wave of possible business entrepreneurs. Less turf wars would in theory equal less deaths. Then he gets criticized for being soft of drugs, so either way he's screwed.

I don't have the numbers to back anything up of course, but I wouldn't be surprised if when they do drug house sweeps, violent crime immediately spikes.

**davewindsor** · January-10-13, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by MSUguy

Yes it was so effective that those same voter overwhelmingly undid parts of it TWICE because was wasting 100+ million dollars per year locking up non violent offenders. Thankfully most in CA didn't like this Mike Reynolds tool.

As to the OP how many of those cops are actually patrolling in LA vs Detroit

Yes, the law was softened a couple months ago, but the OPs comparison to LA was based on the original law for the past 15 years. Those new statistics are not going to be out for another couple years. LA is gonna pay for it with higher crime rates.

How can Detroit police patrol like LA when sentencing laws are so different and career criminals are rampant in Detroit from a revolving door justice system and taking up so much of the DPD's time? How can a Detroit officer patrol like LA when they have to arrest the same revolving door criminal and spend the rest of their shift writing up a report? There are so many things an officer has to do to process someone they arrest that you're comparing apples to oranges when comparing Detroit policing to LA policing with a similar level of cops per capita.

The problem isn't with the Detroit Police. I see no evidence of that. I think they do a good job. The problem is with the weak laws themselves that overburden police resources. You're not gonna see any significant decreases in the crime rates in Detroit without changing the laws in Michigan. I guess you're fine with the status quo.

**wolverine** · January-10-13, 12:34 AM

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

BS. What we need are more "Social Programs". If we throw even more free money @ crime, it'll eventually go away. Eventually.

I don't believe that's the best solution. It's part of it. We should be investing in more social programs, but it's unlikely to make a big enough dent.

The biggest solution is jobs. More people on stable incomes that will raise more kids in stable households.

The biggest problem here in Chicago is there's a ton of homeless kids. The social programs provide them homes and meals, but these kids are still roaming the streets looking for something to do. They get involved with the wrong people and the trouble starts.

As for current criminals serving sentences, I don't like the idea of inmates having free room and board in prison. They should be required to do work if physically able. Prisoners involved in work camps for example are less likely to recidivate when they are released. Many states release these reports. But these programs do require quite a bit of resources so it isn't necessarily the magical solution.

I really haven't been following Bing as closely since I no longer live in Michigan, but my general perception of his character is he's a nice guy but a very weak mayor.

You need a strong and honest personality and got to be a bully. Ram through the policies you want even if it offends a ton of people. Actually the more people you piss off as mayor, the better mayor you are. I realize that doesn't sound right, but most often big changes that are for the best are never all that popular. Something's got to give.

**Brian1979** · January-11-13, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Meddle

All those words and you dropped the 'yo' in front of the 'u'.

Didn't Chicago just make a big deal over 500? What's the population difference there?

Going by the 2010 census it's 1,981,821 which is a bigger difference than what Detroit's peak population was.

**stasu1213** · January-11-13, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by Bad Brains

I'm no Bing fan, but why is he getting so much heat for this? I'm pretty sure the murder rate is going to be high no matter who the mayor is.

I disagree. Bing is the one who cut public safety to the minimum having police officers to work 14 hours a day 4 to 5 days a week. Bing is the one who gives the appearance that has not a clue on how to lower the crime rate in Detroit. Criminals across the nation had probably taken a one way ticketed trip to Detroit when they had heard Bing go on local airwaves saying that vertual police stations are going to open througout the city. Bing have not initiate any ideas on bringing revenue to this city. Even the Kwamster had brought the Red Bull race, Quicken Loans, and promised more road paving jobs for Detroiters so they want have to stay sitting on the porch