LeDuff: Answers, accountability lacking as more bodies fall in Detroit

**Zacha341** · January-05-13, 09:07 AM

From article:

...Bing dropped the bomb that Detroit had suffered its most murderous year since 1987, the height of the crack epidemic.

He and interim Police Chief Chester Logan sat at the table like a pair of grumpy old men, scowling and chewing on their lips. They could offer no explanation for the spiraling murder rate. No plan to combat it. Nor could they accept the bulk of the blame.

All Bing could do was offer this ladle of Jell-O pudding: "I just don't believe our police department should have the total responsibility for safety in the city."

If not the police, then who has the responsibility? Detroit, with a population estimated at less than 700,000, clocked in with 408 homicides in 2012. New York by contrast has a population of 8.2 million. Gotham recorded 414 homicides in 2012, which included 14 homicides from previous years.

Do the math. Relatively tiny Detroit witnessed more murder than any other city in American except Chicago. On Friday, I learned a Navy petty officer home on leave was shot and killed in the city, and a Marine who served in Iraq is near death after being shot Dec. 29 on the city's west side. To think you can survive the theaters of war, only to be cut down in the killing fields of Detroit.

Chief Logan has promised a departmental reorganization come February, but don't expect much from a guy who said: "If I had a thousand more police officers in the city of Detroit, the way things are now I don't know what kind of impact that would have, so I'm not asking for more police officers."

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/20...all-in-detroit

**canuck** · January-05-13, 09:47 AM

Yeah, no Polyanna there. Bad stuff.

**Zacha341** · January-05-13, 10:51 AM

At least we know what we are working with and what to NOT expect!

**stasu1213** · January-05-13, 10:52 AM

Bing and those who are controlling him want to allow crime to escalate in order to force residents out of certain parts of Detroit driving them into certain run=down suburban areas. Bing, Pugh, and the Police Chief will continue to make stupid careless statements pertaining to the increase in crime in the city.

**Zacha341** · January-05-13, 10:59 AM

^^^^ Umm, that kind of thing will backfire!

Criminals are sorta messy, indiscriminate and not always very jurisdictional. They don't behave in such a precise manner so as to build such 'predicable' outcomes upon.

**313WX** · January-05-13, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

Umm, that kind of thing will backfire!

Criminals are sorta messy, indiscriminate - not always very jurisdictional, and don't behave in such a precise manner so as to build such predicable outcomes upon.

More so, the goal is to institute Bing's Detroit Works Project [[which the more I research it, it sounds like Detroit will be teh testing grounds for the UN's Agenda 21) by using a method called "starving the beast."

You make services so poor in the neighborhoods one deems too far gone to save [[which are most of them) that even the remaining hardcore residents will also get fed up and leave just to escape the suffering. Once those remaining residents leave, you can officially remove those places from the grid and close them off without fearing lawsuits from them.

Now that he has the backing of Snyder and the conservative/anti-Detroit Michigan court system to force his project down the city's throats [[I.E. the Consent Agrement), we're full speed ahead with what would otherwise be a DOA plan.

Of course, there are a couple flaws with this plan. For one, when these residents leave the neighborhoods, they're not moving to Corktown or Midtown [[or even the suburbs). Also, you will lose A LOT of major city perks [[such as private security and tons of adminsitrative staffers) once Detroit's population reach a certain tipping point, which I think we're at or close to meeting.

**canuck** · January-05-13, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Zacha341

^^^^ Umm, that kind of thing will backfire!

Criminals are sorta messy, indiscriminate and not always very jurisdictional. They don't behave in such a precise manner so as to build such 'predicable' outcomes upon.

They do seek out areas where it is easy to prey on people though, and the many neighborhoods of Detroit are like a buffet for criminals in that respect.

**Zacha341** · January-05-13, 11:14 AM

^^^^ Absolutely. As we can see from the uptick in crime.

**stasu1213** · January-05-13, 11:21 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

More so, the goal is to institute Bing's Detroit Works Project [[which the more I research it, it sounds like Detroit will be teh testing grounds for the UN's Agenda 21) by using a method called "starving the beast."

You make services so poor in the neighborhoods one deems too far gone to save [[which are most of them) that even the remaining hardcore residents will also get fed up and leave just to escape the suffering. Once those remaining residents leave, you can officially remove those places from the grid and close them off without fearing lawsuits from them.

Now that he has the backing of Snyder and the conservative/anti-Detroit Michigan court system to force his project down the city's throats [[I.E. the Consent Agrement), we're full speed ahead with what would otherwise be a DOA plan.

Of course, there are a couple flaws with this plan. For one, when these residents leave the neighborhoods, they're not moving to Corktown or Midtown [[or even the suburbs). Also, you will lose A LOT of major city perks [[such as private security and tons of adminsitrative staffers) once Detroit's population reach a certain tipping point, which I think we're at or close to meeting.

One thing about this plan is that the senior citizens who were forced to move out of the city into a better community will be follwed by the hardcore residents and the problems will start again. Where is Al Sharpton, Rev Jesse Jackson, and others when you need them. Blacks in Detroit are underseige put on them by a black mayor, white governor, and possibly white corporations

**313WX** · January-05-13, 11:23 AM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

One thing about this plan is that the senior citizens who were forced to move out of the city into a better community will be follwed by the hardcore residents and the problems will start again.

True.

And thus you have the great region of SE Michigan in a nutshell.

Shollin · January-05-13, 11:31 AM

Lets blame the mayor instead of, you know, the criminals who are committing the crimes. It's easier that way. The criminals are just victims of the socioeconomic conditions brought on by the mayor and city council anyways.

**corktownyuppie** · January-05-13, 11:35 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

You make services so poor in the neighborhoods one deems too far gone to save [[which are most of them) that even the remaining hardcore residents will also get fed up and leave just to escape the suffering. Once those remaining residents leave, you can officially remove those places from the grid and close them off without fearing lawsuits from them

Assuming that's true, my only issue is the implication that "someone is making services so poor" by choice. Services are poor because there is no money. And so that begs a dialogue of whether we are spending the money we do have in an effective way.

People have been saying for years that turning the city around is like amputating the leg of diabetic. You are going to have cut off parts of the city in order to save the rest.

**stasu1213** · January-05-13, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by Shollin

Lets blame the mayor instead of, you know, the criminals who are committing the crimes. It's easier that way. The criminals are just victims of the socioeconomic conditions brought on by the mayor and city council anyways.

The criminals would not do what they want to do most of the time if they worry about a police car driving past them at any moment. Cut the services and give lame excuses to why crime happen encourage more criminal behavior. Charles Pugh and Dave Bing don't want to admit to that.

**313WX** · January-05-13, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by corktownyuppie

Assuming that's true, my only issue is the implication that "someone is making services so poor" by choice. Services are poor because there is no money. And so that begs a dialogue of whether we are spending the money we do have in an effective way.

Well, it depends on whether or not there's a better way to resolve the city's finances besides MORE cuts to the already poor services, even if the solutions aren't politically popular.

Shollin · January-05-13, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

The criminals would not do what they want to do most of the time if they worry about a police car driving past them at any moment. Cut the services and give lame excuses to why crime happen encourage more criminal behavior. Charles Pugh and Dave Bing don't want to admit to that.

Yea so when two people have a beef with each other, they'll reconcile their differences with tea and cupcakes because a cop may or may not drive by.

Funny, I remember reading on this forum during the fireworks people complaining when the cops were stationed all over downtown and rounding up people. They complained of it being a police state.

**WaCoTS** · January-05-13, 11:58 AM

i for one do not look to anyone else for my own safety or security, regardless of where i am. so this is kind of a non-issue for me. i know i cant rely on 911, so i dont. the way it is right now, its as if the police dept has already been disbanded. but i am not blaming cops or politicians for the problem, because i know that the blame for crime belongs to human nature itself. the only way you can survive in a city like this is to be very zen, and very self reliant.

what does suck however is when senior citizens have no one looking out for them.

**313WX** · January-05-13, 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by Shollin

Yea so when two people have a beef with each other, they'll reconcile their differences with tea and cupcakes because a cop may or may not drive by.

Funny, I remember reading on this forum during the fireworks people complaining when the cops were stationed all over downtown and rounding up people. They complained of it being a police state.

Two things...

1. That was downtown during a major event.

2. They were arresting and detaining folks who hadn't even committed a crime.

That's different from simply patrolling the streets or walking the beat and making sure the sketchy folks know you're watching them.

**Hypestyles** · January-05-13, 12:45 PM

I can't find a new job and relocate fast enough. New year's eve sounded horrible if you stayed at home; you'd think the city was under siege, and well, I suppose it is.

I don't see a new chief being appointed until the November election.. who's going to want to stay on for 6 - 8 months, if Bing loses the primary or the final election?

**corktownyuppie** · January-05-13, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Well, it depends on whether or not there's a better way to resolve the city's finances besides MORE cuts to the already poor services, even if the solutions aren't politically popular.

You'll get no beef from me here. I've always thought that the solutions are much easier to find than navigating the political minefield of trying to execute them.

**DetroitPlanner** · January-05-13, 04:40 PM

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/nei...-violence/526/

**scottn55** · January-05-13, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by DetroitPlanner

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/nei...-violence/526/

Interesting article... If it actually works as a deterrent to crime I'd rather spend public money on this than things, like jailing nonviolent drug offenders, that don't. At the very least it improves the area's aesthetic.

**canuck** · January-05-13, 07:22 PM

Originally Posted by scottn55

Interesting article... If it actually works as a deterrent to crime I'd rather spend public money on this than things, like jailing nonviolent drug offenders, that don't. At the very least it improves the area's aesthetic.

Agreed. Of course, Detroit needs more policing first and foremost. What is the single deterrant to Detroit's desirability; crime. But Detroitplanner's article illustrates the need for a softening of the cityscape in these terms. I think that our cities have become more punitive in time. There is a lot to demoralize, not only in the barren and blighted spaces but in the uninspired architecture. Anyhow there are good reasons to find other means of curbing crime than the usual coercitive, punitive cycle.

**MommaDrizzly** · January-05-13, 09:59 PM

I've been a bit of a Bing defender - how effective can someone be when hog-tied by the inept, corrupt city council? But his response - his feeling that this is not really his problem - I think is changing things for me.

**stasu1213** · January-05-13, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by MommaDrizzly

I've been a bit of a Bing defender - how effective can someone be when hog-tied by the inept, corrupt city council? But his response - his feeling that this is not really his problem - I think is changing things for me.

I want to defend Bing. It is not his fault that Detroit had deteriorated to the low point that it is in. The fault falls upon the shortsightedness of leaders years ago. I do fault Bing for pretending to be ignorant of the out of control crime in the city. He, in my opinion, is controled by the corporation. Not only him but members or the council especially it's president.