Start of Detroit's downturn

[swan]

Does anyone else connect the beginning the exodus of The City of Detroit and the lawlessness in the city with abolishing S.T.R.E.S.S.

[GOAT]

No. STRESS was a great idea. But like most things attached to Detroit, it rotted from within and became as bad the city it was trying to fix.

I think the problem started with racism. But sadly that is still used as an excuse in this very day; except those in power try to blame "white" people for trying to take it over [[as if anyone wants to??).

When the schools started crumbling in the late 1970s early 1980s that was biggesgt factor in Detroit's undoing and still is today. Not many people want to send their kids to Detroit schools [[once the example for all school systems to emulate); and hardly anyone graduates. So how in the hell can you save a city that wont save itself? The schools are bad so families don't move back in, kids don't graduate and can't be employed; they turn to crime. Crime drives investment away...

[firstandten]

The exodus actually started in the late 50's early 60's. STRESS and the reaction to it were the reflection of a city already going into decline.

[MikeM]

No. Next question.

[poobert]

No. I've never read, seen, or heard anything to remotely suggest that the abolition of one law enforcement program led to an already-steady exodus/decline. What a provincial notion.

[313WX]

This could be a fun thread.

[Dexlin]

This constant obsession with the cause of this - especially after there's been fifty years of academic and not-so-academic research - is just bizzare and grotesque. It's even more galling when you consider that while the city is obviously still shrinking, it's still a city of 700,000 people most of whom strive for a comprehensively livable town. Can you imagine trying to navigate a sidewalk to your destination, but you have your head turned backwards the entire time?

I don't get why people continue to pose such incredibly general questions. Is there nothing else to talk about, anymore? Do people just post sh%t without thinking?

[MidTownMs]

Perhaps this website should be called DetroitNo!!! PS...I'll bet I am not the first person to suggest this.

[Jimaz]

Perhaps this website should be called DetroitNo!!! PS...I'll bet I am not the first person to suggest this.

It already is: http://www.detroitno.com/

That's thinking ahead!

[DetroitPlanner]

Detroit was not the only town to lose population in the 1960's-1990's. It was not the only town to have riots in the 1960's. It also is not the only major city to see much of its retail pulled towards the malls. Detroit was also not the only major City to have a black mayor in the 1970's [[as well as the bias of the majority that goes along with that). Therefore, these cannot be seen as the downfalls.

Much of Detroit's decline in population is simple math. With the maturing of the economy family sizes shrank. Divorce became more prevalant in the 1960's. Advances in medicine meant people are living longer. This all led to smaller sized households. Detroit's housing was fully built out in the 1950's. Meaning that each home had less people living in them. They were also the oldest housing stock meaning they were less desirable to those who were sold on the house in the burbs with the attached garage.

I grew up in Detroit in a neighborhood full of cops and firemen. Many of my friends followed dad and they too are now cops and firemen. Why am I mentioning this? I have been privy to listening to Detroit cops and firemen talk about their jobs for over 40 years. This gives me a very unique perspective.

I would like to suggest that the proliferation of drugs, especially crack cocaine and heroin in the time period of the late 1970's through the 1990's is what caused much of the decline. It however is not the only reason for the decline. Think about this. In the 1980's we had a huge drug problem. Those folks ended up having a bunch of kids who were plain not raised right. Fast forward 20 years and we are now in the early to mid 2000's and that is when all hell broke loose in the neighborhoods. Those kids had grown up and were not taught to be part of a society that obeyed the rules because they were not raised with any rules. I am willing to bet that the majority of problems we have with young people now is due to them being born into a drug culture.

Now certainly this was not the only reason. As manufacturing jobs shrank, competition for the remaining jobs increased. Think about this, the Ford Highland Park plant employed something like 20,000 people. Today they are producing just as many cars, that are a lot more advanced than Model T's or A's by using no more than 2,000 in a plant. Competition for these jobs has also increased as transplant auto plants have opened up with very few of them in Metro Detroit.

What you see is the result of a pulling apart of the social and economic fabric of this city. Certainly you can find this in other places, but no one had as many eggs in the manufacturing basket or had the "Purple Gang" tradition of Detroit.

[serpico]

Detroit was dying well before STRESS came about.. Mayor Roman Gribbs threw a "hail mary" by developing STRESS but it was too late... One could argue that Detroit was dying in 1956. Anyway.. the Packard sign and frontage is gone.. but the water is still on

[MidTownMs]

You can speculate about whether is was the riot of '67, S.T.R.E.S.S., Roman Gribbs, etc. etc. But in my opinion this was the beginning of the down turn of Detroit.

[p69rrh51]

This man's first drive on March 7, 1896 kicked off the start of the decline. After this the auto industry killed off the very diverse almost recession proof economy of the city at the time. Also with the auto industry we got the urban/suburban sprawl that continues to this day.

[Honky Tonk]

Detroit was dying well before STRESS came about.. Mayor Roman Gribbs threw a "hail mary" by developing STRESS but it was too late... One could argue that Detroit was dying in 1956. Anyway.. the Packard sign and frontage is gone.. but the water is still on

Even WORSE, we're all still PAYING for it.

[Hermod]

This man's first drive on March 7, 1896 kicked off the start of the decline. After this the auto industry killed off the very diverse almost recession proof economy of the city at the time. Also with the auto industry we got the urban/suburban sprawl that continues to this day.

Economically, resources tend to be expended in the area with the highest potential return. That can be seen with the Native American population in Michigan. After 1815, there were no military expeditions against the indigenous population in Michigan. What "happened" to them is John Jacobs Astor. Astor's company was paying so much for fur pelts that the they quit their normal occupations as hunter-gatherers and small scale farmers and devoted all of their efforts to trapping. The profits they made from selling pelts to Astor were able to purchase themselves a "higher" lifestyle of buying food and manufactured items.

When the fur-bearing animals were "trapped out" they didn't want to go back to their former lifestyle and instead wanted to migrate to an area with more trapping opportunities. They willingly entered into treaties selling their land [[which was now worthless to them) for whatever they could get and they left the land peaceably.

In the same vein, how many boys eschewed college and other pursuits to go into the assembly plants for starting wages which dwarfed what they could make teaching school or as an engineer's starting pay?

[Zacha341]

Ah my favorite! I love how it locks up at a seconds notice [[yet people still try to do 90 mph on it) or the occasional no-warning orange barrel roll-out right lane closure, but that ain't limited to just ninety-fo'!

You can speculate about whether is was the riot of '67, S.T.R.E.S.S., Roman Gribbs, etc. etc. But in my opinion this was the beginning of the down turn of Detroit.

[Meddle]

The exodus actually started in the late 50's early 60's.

True, but the acceleration began with Coleman. If any one person could be associated with the demise of the city as it once was, it would be him. He alone caused more people to hate the city and created more animosity than anyone else I can remember.

[rex]

Coleman made remaining white $ feel awfully unwelcome. Black middle class exodus played its part but really. Start of Detroit's decline was the $ exodus in general. Westside was more stable than the eastside. My guess is many middle class former westside residents are now in Southfield and spread across the suburbs. Lower middle class eastside residents became able to afford homes in a diminished value westside. Its a step up but unfortunately old homes aren't always cheap to maintain

[313WX]

You can speculate about whether is was the riot of '67, S.T.R.E.S.S., Roman Gribbs, etc. etc. But in my opinion this was the beginning of the down turn of Detroit.

I disagree.

If anything, I would say moving the capital to Lansing, moving U of M to Ann Arbor and Michigan's Home Rule Cities Act sealed Detroit's fate.

Those things were done PURPOSELY to choke off Detroit's growth, even before the days of Coleman Young.

Long story short, it was silly idea that every nook and cranny in this state had to be a major city like Detroit that led us to where we are now.

[Drexciya68]

True, but the acceleration began with Coleman. If any one person could be associated with the demise of the city as it once was, it would be him. He alone caused more people to hate the city and created more animosity than anyone else I can remember.

I agree 100%. Not to mention all the crookedness, corruption and criminal activity he brought with him to the Mayor's office and throughout top city positions. He hired in a bunch of crooks many of which went to prison. They also happened to be coleman's closest friends and his family members.

[Drexciya68]

Coleman made remaining white $ feel awfully unwelcome. Black middle class exodus played its part but really. Start of Detroit's decline was the $ exodus in general. Westside was more stable than the eastside. My guess is many middle class former westside residents are now in Southfield and spread across the suburbs. Lower middle class eastside residents became able to afford homes in a diminished value westside. Its a step up but unfortunately old homes aren't always cheap to maintain

You got that right, rex. We moved from the east side to Southfield in 1980 and many former Detroiters were already there. At least on the east side I saw the biggest decline [[in my lifetime) from the late 1970s to the end of the 1980s. It was a war zone and cay's family and friends were part of all that [[drug) bullshit. A close friend of mine was dating coleman's niece in the 1980s. What the public knows is just the tip of the iceberg concerning coleman's lowly deeds.
coleman dragged the city down and created much more racial hated, mistrust and animosity for about 20 years. He was a main factor in the [[Black, white, Jewish, Middle Easterners, Poles, etc) flight from the city during his dictatorship in Detroit. We all saw him getting softer on crime and start blaming and making excuses instead of taking care of OUR city.

[Meddle]

I stayed as long as I could, but moved as far west as I could; to a border street. Stayed there until the late 90s when I was able to sell the house for far more than it was worth. Move out of state was more timing, economics and personal reasons than 'flight'. But I'd say I got out at about the best time possible. Another five years and who knows.

We really only had one troublesome neighbor on our block and they were more of an annoyance than real trouble, but I could feel the neighboring streets to the east and north changing.

[softailrider]

True, but the acceleration began with Coleman. If any one person could be associated with the demise of the city as it once was, it would be him. He alone caused more people to hate the city and created more animosity than anyone else I can remember.

I agree with all of the above. At the beginning of CAY's first term the city was a totally livable, viable place, by the end of his tenure the city looked pretty much as it does now. Don't tell me that isn't true, I saw it all happen right in front of my eyes.

[firstandten]

True, but the acceleration began with Coleman. If any one person could be associated with the demise of the city as it once was, it would be him. He alone caused more people to hate the city and created more animosity than anyone else I can remember.

The acceleration really began after the 67 riots, by the time Coleman made it to office the tipping point had been reached.

[Novine]

Detroit's population peaked in the 1950s and white flight was well underway before CAY took office. The city had its share of crooked white politicians. The idea that Detroit's decline was a result of CAY taking office requires ignoring the facts of what was really happening in Detroit then, not just what people believe happened.