Mound Road Indian Mounds

[RickBeall]

I have read that Mound road got its name from Indian Mounds that existed by it. Where are the Indian Mounds? Does anyone have pictures? Or feel free to point me to an existing thread.

[townonenorth]

http://atdetroit.net/forum/messages/...tml?1193100110

[jcole]

Here's a write up from the News in 1997; nothing about Mound Road, but other mounds in the Detroit area
http://apps.detnews.com/apps/history/index.php?id=167

[townonenorth]

You may read this from the 1973 book by Walter RomigMichigan Place Names: The History of the Founding and the Naming of More
Mound road was a leftover from Prairie Mound, the village, then called Norris. Prairie Mound was an Indian burial ground.

http://books.google.com/books?id=Y-F...20Road&f=false

Mt Elliot was also named Prairie Mound Road, up to 1887.
http://books.google.com/books?id=LJI...page&q&f=false

[nain rouge]

Funnily enough, I was at the Warren Historical Society Museum [[yes, it exists!) today, and one of the signs on the displays covered this exact topic. According to the Warren Historical Society:

"Hickory Corners [Warren] became a way station or carriage stop for anyone travelling north from Detroit. At the time [perhaps 1830s or '40s], the area was scarcely more than dense forest of virgin timber traversed by an old Indian trail. Running north and south [[now part of Mound Road), this Indian trail was once call 'Prairie Mound' Road for the dirt hills which resembled Indan burial mounds. Over the years, parts of it have been known as the 'State' Road, the 'Plank' Road, and recently as Mound and Sherwood."

[stasu1213]

I do believe that Asians and Africans were here before Columbus. The mounds were probably pyramids built by the same people who built the pyramids in Mexico. The Aztec, Olmec, and the Dobyns had african features. There probably was the inter-cohabating of the asians from the north and african from the south which produced the "copper people" know as the native american. Charles C Mann has an interesting book titled "1491". The book tells about the indigenous people who were here way before Columbus. I am sure that Michigan was not exempt from habitation of these indigenous people who had brought their culture and ideas to this state and country

[Bong-Man]

In Warren Township I have found that the oldest recorded cemetery burialswere at the Warren Union Cemetery, followed by the St Clement Cemetery. Butbetween the A Bunert Farmhouse and the C Bunert Farmhouse Just N of Martin Roadand West of Bunert Road, was an Indian mound which was 18 feet tall. It wasmost likely an Indian burial mound but this is uncertain. This mound existedprior to the settlement of their farm in 1849. It had become overgrown withweeds and shrubs so much that it was not particularly recognizable as an Indianmound and was missed on the early surveys. The settlers certainly were not inthe habit of building mounds 18 feet high. The family reported that Indianscame around often in the early days. They would read the sun like a clock andwould disappear when the sun reached a certain angle. Indian artifacts havebeen found in the area. Local legends also give credence to the Indian moundtheory. This area is generally flat and there is no logical geologicalexplanation for a sand mound given the flatness of the surrounding area. Alsoconsidering that there was at least evidence of forty human remains removedfrom this site and that no archeologist was called in to evaluate the site sothat there may have been other evidence that was certainly overlooked. Alsoconsider that at least two dump truck loads of remains were trucked out of thesite before it was discovered that at least one of them contained human bones.The family reported that other families sometimes brought relatives there forburial. I talked with one of the older Weiers and was told that their grandparents told them of a man who carried his dead baby for several miles to haveit buried there as it was the only cemetery he knew about. Around this landmarkearly settlers from several families buried their dead. They probably did notknow or care if it was an Indian mound or not. Whether or not it was willprobably remain unknown as the evidence was destroyed and removed. Earlyfarmers often raided Indian mounds to get pots. There was a road that led fromMartin road directly to this cemetery. I have it on an aerial foto and showingthe mound in the 1960s. I shall call it the Bunert-Indian Cemetery forshortness but it was supposedly registered on the State of Michigan registry asthe Bidell-Green-Weier Cemetery. I saw a 8 mm movie in about 1970 showing threeburial vaults in which bones were being piled to be buried at Clinton Grove. Itis now located on the southern half of the Briarwood school property. I spokewith the undertaker who performed the last removals. I found newspaperarticles. And weirdly also found reports of ghost sightings believe it or not.
By the 1960s it was overgrown with Lilac shrubs that waved in the breeze.The Lilacs were planted by other families to mark the burial places but hadbecome overgrown over the years. The family was forced by economic reasons tosell the property. The school district would have taken the property anyway asthey wanted to build a school there. It was transferred about 1966. Mrs. IdaWeier told the school district that it was a burial ground and wanted allremains to be treated in a Christian manner. Bunert family burials were removedand reinterred at the Clinton Grove Cemetery in Mt Clemens. There were no otherstone markers and all of the wood markers had rotted away and the little stonepebble markers were displaced so it was not particularly recognizable as aburial ground. But she also warned the principal that it was a burial ground.He called her a crazy lady. During construction a skull and other human boneswere discovered. [[Per Tri City Progress 4 14-1967) In May of 1969 childrenplaying in the school playground discovered more human remains. Imagine thelook of shock on the teachers face when they brought the remains into theclassroom. Later the principal went over to Ida Weiers house and wanted toquestion her about the remains. She reminded him that he had branded her acrazy lady for even suggesting that it was a
burial ground. One contractor dug a load of dirt for fill dirt and droppedit off on someone’s property. The homeowner receiving the fill dirt foundsculls and human bones and called the police who contacted the contractor.Imagine asking for fill dirt and getting human remains dropped off in yourdriveway. Wow was he in trouble. It wasn’t very long when that kids were alsoshowing off human remains from the mound. That finally got the officialsattention. The school district wanted everything hushed up so no archeologistswere called in and in fact it was them who hired a funeral director. The schoolcertainly did not anyone to discover that this was anything other than a singlefamily burial plot. But human remains of at least 40 humans were removed fromwhat was left of the mound and the rest of the area was not explored. HistorianWesley Arnold states that he saw movies of this mound being excavated. WilliamDuRoss the funeral director mentioned that Theuts, Greens, Hessels, andSchoenhers were probably buried there. So it was for sure a pioneer cemetery.Whether or not it was also the remains of an Indian burial ground had not beendetermined by scientific investigation and will never be never known as theevidence has been removed and scattered. And even though a few bones wereremoved the balance of the remains of those pioneer families remainunderground. This historian does not believe in ghosts but must report many ofsightings over the years by homeowners adjacent to the Briarwood Schoolproperty. Several families and even children have reported sightings andstrange happenings there. As a historian I am honor bound to tell the truth.Strange. This historian feels that a plaque should be erected at least on theon a bench on the grass next to the paved path that goes around the ball fieldthat would and mark this as at least a pioneer cemetery.http://geocities.com/ourlocalhistory/History/CemeteriesForgotten.html

[Al Publican]

Interesting that any where in Detroit or SE Michigan would be called "Mount" considering the lack of variation in the terrain. Detroit only varies about, what, 60 to 80 feet in elevation from around 580 feet about sea level to its highest area around Grand River and Telegraph? What is the highest point in Detroit and in the tri-county area?

[MrJones]

"Indian Mounds" is a misnomer as they were built centuries before Native Americans crossed over the Bering land bridge. A lot of mystery still exists about who the "Mound Builders" actually were and what became of them.
They built hundreds of mounds along rivers in the south, in TN and AL, GA and up into Ohio and Michigan.
I borrowed a book on the subject from the library written about 1925 by a UM Professor who had counted the mounds in MI. While there were a lot in Wayne and Macomb counties in our area, there was only one found in Oakland County.
Most in Wayne had been dug out by "pot hunters" in the 18th/19th century.

[MrJones]

This from the 1939 Detroit city directory on elevation in the city -

[RickBeall]

From the various readings above, one person said, the Indian mounds were between 7 and 8 mile on mound round. Another said the Indian mound was in the grass in the middle of 8 mile. Someone else said it was around Norris Town. And they also said that the mounds pre-dated the people we think of as American Indians. Does anyone have anything more definitive ... or old maps or something?

If there is a subdivision on top of the site of old mounds which were scraped away, it would be great to be able to point to the site. Ask the owners of the houses if they ever see ... ghosts.

On this foggy night, I think I saw something move out of the corner of my eye ....

[Mikeg]

Does anyone have anything more definitive ... or old maps or something?

This is probably as good as you will find - excerpts from Chapter 9 of "Col. P.W. Norris: Yellowstone's Greatest Superintendent", by Judge Don Binkowski [[C&D of Warren, 1995).

Chapter 9 - "Prairie Mound", an Early Detroit Suburb

In his first letter from "Prairie Mound", part of Hamtramck Township, Wayne County [[currently Mound Rd. and 7 Mile, Detroit), dated November 18, 1865, Norris lamented, “for I do not need or intend to work like a slave as I do here to get anything done. There was excellent bee weather and I had nearly 200,000 bees"………

Most of the Hamtramck Township laid vacant from time immemorial but there were always settlers in the south end beginning with the French who originally settled Grosse Pointe at the same times as Detroit, 1701. About 1858, the Chicago, Detroit and Canada Grand Trunk Junction Rail Road built south of the proposed [[Norris) village, cutting through Section 9 as it proceeded northeast to Port Huron, across from Sarnia, Canada.

Few accounts of any of the settlers who knew Colonel Norris survived. Like a meteor, he flashed into the township and Detroit in 1865 and only remained active for the next twelve years…..

[[1869 Detroit Directory)

Norris, through his various railroad contacts, also must have discovered that a railroad was contemplated from Detroit north to Bay City. Growth was inevitable in the minds of boomers. And Prairie Mound was not far from the Norris family homestead at Nankin [[Mich.)…..

Col. Norris guaranteed access by rail and by roads to his village before he platted it. Unsuccessful in securing a rail line in Pioneer [[Ohio), he avoided the same error in his Michigan village.

In 1871, he incorporated a plank road company to…. provide access to his proposed village….

On May 12, 1871 the Detroit Free Press announced that "the 'Detroit & Prairie Mound Plank Road Company' from this city to Utica required twenty-two thousand dollars to construct. The following were elected directors: P.W. Norris, John C. Jacob and Mason A. Perkins, of Detroit; Joseph Hardy, of Hamtramck, and Macomb County Clerk, Charles C. Groesbeck.”

[endnote: The plank road connecting the village of Warren with the village of Norris went by the following route. From Mound and Chicago Rd. one proceeded south on today’s Mound Rd. to 11 Mile Rd., going east to Sherwood Rd. Taking Sherwood south to Seven Mile Rd., one proceeded west about ¼ mile to Mt. Elliott Ave. Travelling south on Mt. Elliott about ½ mile, one reached the village of Norris, at today’s Nevada….]


As an experienced railroad man and as a stockholder of ten shares, Norris made certain that he knew of the progress of the Detroit & Bay City Railroad. He assisted it in every way possible and donated land for the right of way…..

The Detroit & Bay City Railroad was constructed and opened in stages. Leasing the existing tracks from the center of Detroit, the new line built northward and opened its first depot at the future Village of Norris in August…..

The story of naming the village Prairie Mound and the erection of the Norris Depot on the Bay Line originated in 1872, so several writers mistakenly used this date as the start of the village [endnote: “Desiring the village, as well as the plank road, should be called ‘Prairie Mound’, Norris placed upon the railroad depot a large sign so calling it; but before recording his village plat, Seymour Brownell,…. induced its managers to call it ‘Norris’. Hence the name.”]

The legend of the Prairie Mound as a burial ground of the Indians was investigated. Michigan was a leader in the study of Indian Mounds. Of the 1,068 mounds and 113 other earth constructions identified as made by Indians in Michigan, Prairie Mound was never among them. [endnote: Like a Madison Avenue advertising firm, Norris romanticized the area: “The famous Prairie Mound, of some four acres, was ever a chosen haunt for the Indians, trappers and herders; the site of countless broils and revels, and probably the torturing of prisoners – certainly a bone tumulus of the unknown dead.” Legends persist through repetition, like “… the chosen hunting grounds of the prehistoric Mound Builders and Indians…” from “Early Site of Hamtramck Was Indian Hunting Ground”, Hamtramck Citizen, Nov. 7, 1947]

To attempt to definitively resolve the question, Dr. Gordon L. Grosscup and Dr. Arnold R. Pilling of the Wayne State University Anthropology Department cooperated with the author.

“No evidence was, however, encountered to establish that in the prehistoric period Indians lived on, or buried their dead in, this sandy knoll.”

[endnote: from Dr. Gordon L. Grosscup’s July 2, 1973 letter to the author, “I have never had the occasion to try and track down the mounds in which you are interested, and apparently no one else here has either. At least there is no record in our site files of any archaeological site in the Seven Mile-Mound Road area….” From Dr. Arnold R. Pilling’s July 31, 1973 letter to the author, “On July 27, 1973 I visited this area…. Unfortunately, our finds in this regard were not conclusive. In summary…. No evidence was, however, encountered to establish that in the prehistoric period Indians lived on, or buried their dead in, this sandy knoll.”]

A post office was established at Norris in 1873, predating the village. Because the post office was moved from Dalton’s Corners [current Van Dyke and 8 Mile area] some sources mistakenly state that the village replaced Dalton’s Corners. Norris recorded his village plat on January 24, 1874 with Wayne County. In addition, through an error by historian Carlisle, Col. Seymour Brownell was credited with jointly establishing the village when his only connection was possibly naming the village.

[gazhekwe]

There is some tradition that the Mounds here, as the one remaining at Fort Wayne, were built by the ancient ones. Into historic times, the local people cared for and maintained these sacred grounds. The fact that they were maintained and cared for into historic times is shown by their visible cleared condition. In the late 1980s, the remaining mound at Fort Wayne was fenced in, and in the ensuing period of time, the mound was completely overgrown with brush and trees.

There is a group of Mounds in the Grand Rapids area that was also maintained for a time in historic times. We visited them in the 1970s as part of a restoration effort. Elders contributed their knowledge of how to accomplish this, including that the work had to be done by women with their hands, no power tools. The women were to dress traditionally in skirts to show respect. Plants were to be allowed to live out their season and produce their fruits for food for the animals, birds and insects. This was done, and the tree covered mounds are restored to clearer condition.

Why did our people stop maintaining the mounds? In the 1830s, there began a period of Indian removal. Many of the original people were swept from southern Michigan. Some fled north, some into Canada, and many were sent to Indian Territory, to supposedly equivalent lands. They were no longer here to maintain the sacred grounds.

[RickBeall]

It is very interesting that Mound Road is named after "Indian" mounds that may or may not have existed as a burial ground.

So, I guess I wonder where the sandy knoll was. It is odd and sad how such history is lost.

[Brock7]

There's what looks to be a couple of mounds noted on this map of the Detroit during War of 1812. Could the one near Spring Well be the "Great Mound on the Rouge" mentioned in the article jcole linked to in post #3?

[Mikeg]

There's what looks to be a couple of mounds noted on this map of the Detroit during War of 1812. Could the one near Spring Well be the "Great Mound on the Rouge" mentioned in the article jcole linked to in post #3?...

The mound at Springwells shown on the 1812 map is most assuredly the site of the future Ft. Wayne.

From the Ft. Wayne entry in Wikipedia:

The present star fort was built atop one of the burial mounds, and it is from this site that Springwells Township [[later annexed into the City of Detroit) took its name. The site originally consisted of a high sand mound, with freshwater springs found along the marshy waterfront of the Detroit River.

In other words, the constructed burial mounds at Ft. Wayne were located atop a naturally-occurring, high sand mound.

From this web site,

Prairie mounds are common and distinct geomorphic features.... covering much of the bottomland where constructed mounds are also found. Several early researchers mistook prairie mounds for cultural features [[e.g. Thoburn [1929:218-221] believed them to be the remains of prehistoric earth lodges), and they are still frequently mistaken for constructed mounds..... Prairie mounds..... are naturally occurring features on the landscape found throughout much of North America west of the Mississippi River. Prairie mounds vary considerably in size and shape, but are generally low mounded or conical features, ten to a few tens of meters across, and one to a few meters high. They invariably occur in groups, and are mostly confined to floodplains, stream terraces and low upland slopes...... there is no standard definition of exactly what constitutes a prairie mound. Practically any field with low, topographically distinct peaks formed from unconsolidated material may be considered a prairie mound field.

This present-day topographical map shows a rise in elevation that peaks at 630 feet above sea level on Mound Rd. just north of Seven Mile Rd. [[on the northwest outskirts of what would become Col. P.W. Norris' Prairie Mound/Norris subdivision plat). At the time Norris incorporated his Detroit & Prairie Mound Plank Road Company in 1871, this elevated land feature [[along with the land to the southeast that he intended to subdivide) was located on property owned by Norris.

Col. P.W. Norris had spent the previous summer of 1870 exploring the Montana Territory, including portions of what would soon become Yellowstone National Park. From his travels, Norris would have seen numerous prairie mounds in the west and thus it would not be surprising for him to call the sandy knoll on his property "Prairie Mound". He then proceeded to use that name for his plank road [[and intended to do the same for his future subdivision plat, except for the intervention by Mr. Brownell).

Col. Norris' intent as a land developer and sales agent was to trade on that name and embellish it with the unsubstantiated claim that his "Prairie Mound" was a constructed burial mound. However, according to author Binkowski, there is no evidence that it ever contained any constructed burial mound[[s).

Therefore, I have to conclude that Mound Rd. is named after the natural land feature that once existed near its intersection with present-day Seven Mile Rd. and which was named "Prairie Mound" by Colonel Philetus Walter Norris.

[Honky Tonk]

Google maps shows Mound Rd. curving, then ending @ or merging with, Mt. Elliot, which is a far cry from Ft. Wayne. Did Mound Rd., @ one time, actually curve around to Ft. Wayne?

[jcole]

Google maps shows Mound Rd. curving, then ending @ or merging with, Mt. Elliot, which is a far cry from Ft. Wayne. Did Mound Rd., @ one time, actually curve around to Ft. Wayne?

The mound that is under FT Wayne and the mound that was Prairie Mound are not the same feature. Why would Mound Rd have to be near Ft Wayne?

[EZZ]

Norriss' house is still standing:

http://www.angelfire.com/de2/detroitpix/Director08_17_02.html

[townonenorth]

There is some tradition that the Mounds here, as the one remaining at Fort Wayne, were built by the ancient ones. Into historic times, the local people cared for and maintained these sacred grounds. The fact that they were maintained and cared for into historic times is shown by their visible cleared condition. In the late 1980s, the remaining mound at Fort Wayne was fenced in, and in the ensuing period of time, the mound was completely overgrown with brush and trees.

There is a group of Mounds in the Grand Rapids area that was also maintained for a time in historic times. We visited them in the 1970s as part of a restoration effort. Elders contributed their knowledge of how to accomplish this, including that the work had to be done by women with their hands, no power tools. The women were to dress traditionally in skirts to show respect. Plants were to be allowed to live out their season and produce their fruits for food for the animals, birds and insects. This was done, and the tree covered mounds are restored to clearer condition.

Why did our people stop maintaining the mounds? In the 1830s, there began a period of Indian removal. Many of the original people were swept from southern Michigan. Some fled north, some into Canada, and many were sent to Indian Territory, to supposedly equivalent lands. They were no longer here to maintain the sacred grounds.

Pity that someone isn't around willing to maintain that. You'd think that there would be some interest, but I guess that kind of stuff doesn't attract hipsters or other potentially interested souls. Who fenced it in, and why isn't it maintained?

[Pickford-Bentler]

The mounds are probably kames. A kame is a hill formed by the deposit of glacial sediment locked in a large block of melting glacial ice. The kame will usually be comprised of unsorted sand, pebbles, cobbles and a few boulders. Oakland County is definitely a kame and kettle topography, when view from the air. I was taught in geomorphology that the City of Detroit is the relict of a lake bottom that formed between the receeding ice sheet and a morraine that existed to the south. Any kames in this generally flat topography probably were deposited as large blocks of the main ice sheet floated in the lake and melted.

Could these mounds have been used for burial?

Sure, an already higher and drier topography is a fine place to rest the dead.


I have also read that Pontiac Trail and Ann Arbor Trail are located on eskers. An esker is a debris laden stream or river that flows within a glacier.

Keep in mind that the ice sheet located over Detroit was one mile in thickness. Not small potatoes.

The Geology of the Michigan Basin is facinating.

[gazhekwe]

We were maintaining until Fort Wayne fenced it off and we were refused access to it. It was opened recently and I am not sure what is happening with it right now. Someone who posts here was heading up an effort to open and maintain it. One of our elders that was working on it recently walked on.

[RickBeall]

The ice sheet over Detroit was 1 mile thick. Fascinating reading everyone. And fascinating that you maintain the remaining mound at Ft Wayne, if you could gazhekwe.

[gazhekwe]

It was not me maintaining it. People in the Detroit Indian community, especially our elder leader who recently walked on. The volunteers who work on the grounds and buildings at Fort Wayne organized the effort to open the fence and put in a gate so the mound could be maintained. I do not know the progress at this point. There is a desire to maintain it, that is for sure.