Detroit News poll: Crime drives Detroiters out; 40% expect to leave in 5 years

**Zacha341** · October-09-12, 10:52 PM

Communal living helps me to stay in the city for just that reason. If you are alone it's getting harder to live in a single dwelling property in Detroit. In my setting there are people about most of time and neighbors in another section of the property; pit bulls in the yard, pheasants, an occasional stray cat, rabbits too!

Don't do Detroit alone... too many robberies, with some scenarios of the thieves [[that new neighborhood 'watch') WATCHING you trudge off to work to then break-in or worse a home invasion when you are in your home 'alone'...

Originally Posted by SWMAP

Add to all the other fears is the constant fear of most women that they will be raped during a break-in or a car-jacking. That fear is always with you and adds exponentially to the general unease...

**ThosWolfe** · October-09-12, 11:20 PM

Originally Posted by Detroit_uke

I'll be leaving next year - after 33 years in this house - just going to leave the key in the lock and walk far far away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Still trying to convince my parents to do the same. 47 years in a house now almost 100 years old, worth zero located in Detroit. They can instantly save $ on car and home insurance, and live safer.And can afford another house, even though this one is 'paid for'. More than 10 break-ins last 5 years. Last straw should have been the invasion break in recently. Thieves ransacked every room but where folks were sleeping. Police response: "We can take the information over phone for your insurance claim" Sure enough, couple weeks later the house was broken into again. After all, thieves surely knew police would do nothing. Luckily no one was home this time.
Let the 'urban pioneers' buy cheap, and brag every morning they wake up unharmed. But as soon as stuff starts happening, they're also gone. Several DY posters seemed to disappear...

**SWMAP** · October-09-12, 11:51 PM

Corktown is mystified that someone whose home on the East Side of the legal municipality of Detroit has deteriorated to a walk-away value wouldn't consider taking a further risk to move to yet another tenuous Detroit neighborhood far away? I am mystified that anyone would think that might happen. I think the reasonable tactic after cutting your losses and mourning the death of your secure home and neighborhood would be to go to somewhere that same scenario is unlikely to unfold a second time.

**Gistok** · October-10-12, 12:22 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

Corktown is mystified that someone whose home on the East Side of the legal municipality of Detroit has deteriorated to a walk-away value wouldn't consider taking a further risk to move to yet another tenuous Detroit neighborhood far away? I am mystified that anyone would think that might happen. I think the reasonable tactic after cutting your losses and mourning the death of your secure home and neighborhood would be to go to somewhere that same scenario is unlikely to unfold a second time.

I agree, but not only that... with all my friends and family on the east side/burbs, moving to the west side would be an inconvenient option.

**Gistok** · October-10-12, 12:27 AM

Originally Posted by ThosWolfe

Several DY posters seemed to disappear...

That's usually not due to crime.... [[shooting ones self in the foot emoticon)

**Bham1982** · October-10-12, 07:32 AM

Originally Posted by corktownyuppie

I get why you want to leave EEV. What I don't get is why the candidates for potential new homes does not include Rosedale Park, Indian Village, SW Detroit, Etc.

SW Detroit is the hood and not really better than the typical Detroit neighborhood. I think people assume that, because there's still some retail, the neighborhood is somehow safer and more livable.

It's just because there are immigrant Mexicans, who happen to be entreprenurial and often have to work off the books, in Detroit proper [[because of lack of enforcement). The residential blocks are dangerous, even if the demographics are different.

**corktownyuppie** · October-10-12, 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

Corktown is mystified that someone whose home on the East Side of the legal municipality of Detroit has deteriorated to a walk-away value wouldn't consider taking a further risk to move to yet another tenuous Detroit neighborhood far away?

Point taken. But I guess that's where I disagree. There are neighborhoods in Detroit that aren't tenuous, and where I think the risks are minimal. Now, far away is subjective. I guess I'd consider moving to downtown or midtown a much shorter drive than Hall Rd and Hayes.

In fact, maybe a key to keeping everyone in the city is to pick those 5-7 neighborhoods where things will be stabilized and have everyone move there before they go off to New Baltimore.

**kryptonite** · October-10-12, 07:46 AM

Corktownyuppie, if a person decides to leave Detroit why would they move to a different neighborhood? The taxes in that neighborhood would also be very high, the schools would still be Detroit schools, city services would still be poor, crime is a issue in almost every Detroit neighborhood, retail is poor in almost all neighborhoods, auto/homeowners insurance is going to still be very high, on and on.

Personally, I have moved to different Detroit neighborhoods in the past. I am sure many people do the same thing, but large numbers of people eventually just say "'F**k it, I want a good quality of life" and leave for the suburbs or very often another state. Like MidtownMS said we "get tired of being tired".

**michimoby** · October-10-12, 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by corktownyuppie

Point taken. But I guess that's where I disagree. There are neighborhoods in Detroit that aren't tenuous, and where I think the risks are minimal. Now, far away is subjective. I guess I'd consider moving to downtown or midtown a much shorter drive than Hall Rd and Hayes.

In fact, maybe a key to keeping everyone in the city is to pick those 5-7 neighborhoods where things will be stabilized and have everyone move there before they go off to New Baltimore.

...but if you call it "right-sizing", the pitchforks will come out.

**corktownyuppie** · October-10-12, 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by kryptonite

Corktownyuppie, if a person decides to leave Detroit why would they move to a different neighborhood? The taxes in that neighborhood would also be very high, the schools would still be Detroit schools, city services would still be poor, crime is a issue in almost every Detroit neighborhood, retail is poor in almost all neighborhoods, auto/homeowners insurance is going to still be very high, on and on.

Personally, I have moved to different Detroit neighborhoods in the past. I am sure many people do the same thing, but large numbers of people eventually just say "'F**k it, I want a good quality of life" and leave for the suburbs or very often another state. Like MidtownMS said we "get tired of being tired".

I don't blame you for your anger. And, frankly, maybe it would be best for Detroit to lose 40% of its residents. It will force bankruptcy and restructuring more quickly. It would allow the city to shutter neighborhoods outright, and work on right-sizing the city population as well as its footprint.

It will also force the city and state to regionalize more and more, which is the end result of all of this anyway. City/County joint operations are going to become the norm rather than the exception. And perhaps the county simply takes over entire operations.

So...I'm not disagreeing with any of you all. I'm just looking at it from an opportunistic and longer-term perspective. There are going to be neighborhoods in Detroit that will survive the next 5-10 year "municipal revolution". Those core neighborhoods will be cheap, cheap, cheap for anyone looking at getting in early. And those core neighborhoods are very safe now.

I get why people are infuriated, and I won't blame people for leaving. I'm just offering a different perspective. There really are thousands of people who live in the city for whom crime is a back burner concern and not a day-to-day living experience.

**corktownyuppie** · October-10-12, 08:10 AM

Who knows, New Center area might end up in what is eventually known as "Detroit Township" with city services being completely operated out of the Wayne County office.

**iheartthed** · October-10-12, 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by SWMAP

I think the reasonable tactic after cutting your losses and mourning the death of your secure home and neighborhood would be to go to somewhere that same scenario is unlikely to unfold a second time.

Yeah, maybe somewhere like Seattle.

Nobody has yet to explain where these 100,000 - 150,000 residences have come from that to house the 300,000 residents leaving Detroit over the next 5 years. Why were they built in a region that has been shrinking since 1980? And if the steps aren't taken now to put the breaks on this excessive development, then once it completely consumes Detroit, what's gonna stop it from moving on to these suburbs that everyone is rushing to live in?

**kryptonite** · October-10-12, 08:32 AM

Theory is always better than reality. The enormous exodus of people out of Detroit in the last 60-ish years is due to poor quality of life.

Obviously though there is major change going on downtown and in Midtown and a few other neighborhoods. Detroit is becoming something of a tourist destination noted for art, music, architecture, sports, casinos, theaters, etc. Our riverfront is improving continually, hotels are reopening, etc.

Although I don't live in Detroit any longer I am in Detroit regularly and even do some volunteer work where I am seeing many positive changes. I'm hoping that the worst is over for the city and that someday fewer people will be leaving Detroit to find a better quality of life and people on Detroityes will remember the days when so much griping about how sh*tty a place Detroit is to live and find that hard to understand.

**Det_ard** · October-10-12, 08:34 AM

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Yeah, maybe somewhere like Seattle.

Nobody has yet to explain where these 100,000 - 150,000 residences have come from that to house the 300,000 residents leaving Detroit over the next 5 years. Why were they built in a region that has been shrinking since 1980? And if the steps aren't taken now to put the breaks on this excessive development, then once it completely consumes Detroit, what's gonna stop it from moving on to these suburbs that everyone is rushing to live in?

Where the housing will "come from" [[most already exists):

excess supply resulting from net out-migration due to poor SE Michigan economy
vacant shadow inventory of REOs and soon-to-be REOs
infill housing in 1st ring suburbs [[see Royal Oak, dozens of houses being built today at $150+/sqft)
selective build-out of developments stalled by the housing crisis five years ago
selective new developments on the periphery

**iheartthed** · October-10-12, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by Det_ard

Where the housing will "come from" [[most already exists):

excess supply resulting from net out-migration due to poor SE Michigan economy
vacant shadow inventory of REOs and soon-to-be REOs
infill housing in 1st ring suburbs [[see Royal Oak, dozens of houses being built today at $150+/sqft)
selective build-out of developments stalled by the housing crisis five years ago
selective new developments on the periphery

Though I know we don't agree, that's the problem.

**Detroitdave** · October-10-12, 10:58 AM

I was born in Detroit and moved away in 1983. I recently moved back in 2007, with a move overseas in 2009/2010 then back to Detroit.
One reason I moved back is family, older grandmother and mother taking care of her. I just didn't feel right leaving them alone in the city, and wanted to try to connect with the city.
The area where they live , outer dr. Livernois/curtis the homes aren't too bad .
I really do have a soft spot in my heart for Detroit and I am optimistic , but
if I move out of Detroit , I will leave the ENTIRE state . I've been to pretty much every area in and around ,southeastern Michigan . I would just rather just leave the entire state . I could always come back to visit not to live .

**maverick1** · October-10-12, 11:33 AM

I don't buy this poll. This 40% isnt going anywhere. Who is this 40%? When I think of 40% of Detroit's population I don't see 40% that can afford to leave. When I think of the literacy rate, poverty rate, and other statistics of the city I can't see that many people that can leave within 5 years.

**maverick1** · October-10-12, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Detroitdave

I was born in Detroit and moved away in 1983. I recently moved back in 2007, with a move overseas in 2009/2010 then back to Detroit.
One reason I moved back is family, older grandmother and mother taking care of her. I just didn't feel right leaving them alone in the city, and wanted to try to connect with the city.
The area where they live , outer dr. Livernois/curtis the homes aren't too bad .
I really do have a soft spot in my heart for Detroit and I am optimistic , but
if I move out of Detroit , I will leave the ENTIRE state . I've been to pretty much every area in and around ,southeastern Michigan . I would just rather just leave the entire state . I could always come back to visit not to live .

Same here. If I move out of Detroit I'm leaving the state entirely.

**Honky Tonk** · October-10-12, 11:38 AM

"Same here. If I move out of Detroit I'm leaving the state entirely."

I'm onboard too. Unless something major happens to start generating revenue for the State, [[and I don't mean another $4 coffee shop), it isn't looking good. There are parts of the country that are actually blooming, and nice places to live as well.

**maverick1** · October-10-12, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by corktownyuppie

Point taken. But I guess that's where I disagree. There are neighborhoods in Detroit that aren't tenuous, and where I think the risks are minimal. Now, far away is subjective. I guess I'd consider moving to downtown or midtown a much shorter drive than Hall Rd and Hayes.

In fact, maybe a key to keeping everyone in the city is to pick those 5-7 neighborhoods where things will be stabilized and have everyone move there before they go off to New Baltimore.

Can these 5-7 neighborhoods handle more people? Detroit is in serious need of multi-unit rentals and I think it's safe to say most of these neigborhoods are made up of single family homes. Most of the residents are renters and can't afford a home. Even as cheap as they are here.

**Wesley Mouch** · October-10-12, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by maverick1

I don't buy this poll. This 40% isnt going anywhere. Who is this 40%? When I think of 40% of Detroit's population I don't see 40% that can afford to leave. When I think of the literacy rate, poverty rate, and other statistics of the city I can't see that many people that can leave within 5 years.

Thanks for saying that. Polls are just polls. Poll a group of single men about whether they'll be sleeping with a Ann Hathaway in the next five years, and you'll get the same result.

**rex** · October-10-12, 12:28 PM

eh. There were a few things that happened so I moved. A couple break ins. A armed home invasion. Got assaulted at the party store for a 6 pack of beer by a bunch of kids. Someone dumped a bunch of dogs in the alley behind my house. Ukno. My rent was 300 a month for a nice 3 bedroom house around 94 & whittier opposite EEV. Neighborhood looked ok. My neighbors were all good people and after the break in the landlord added a lot of security to the house but still. Going out at night was ill advised. I didn't feel comfortable having visitors. I didn't want them getting lost or breaking down. Didn't want to feel responsible for that. I lasted there for years but well. Now I can sit on my porch into the night and not really worry much about anything happening

**313WX** · October-10-12, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitdave

I was born in Detroit and moved away in 1983. I recently moved back in 2007, with a move overseas in 2009/2010 then back to Detroit.
One reason I moved back is family, older grandmother and mother taking care of her. I just didn't feel right leaving them alone in the city, and wanted to try to connect with the city.
The area where they live , outer dr. Livernois/curtis the homes aren't too bad .
I really do have a soft spot in my heart for Detroit and I am optimistic , but
if I move out of Detroit , I will leave the ENTIRE state . I've been to pretty much every area in and around ,southeastern Michigan . I would just rather just leave the entire state . I could always come back to visit not to live .

Originally Posted by maverick1

Same here. If I move out of Detroit I'm leaving the state entirely.

Originally Posted by Honky Tonk

"Same here. If I move out of Detroit I'm leaving the state entirely."

I'm onboard too. Unless something major happens to start generating revenue for the State, [[and I don't mean another $4 coffee shop), it isn't looking good. There are parts of the country that are actually blooming, and nice places to live as well.

I'm also on board with you guys.

Beyond Detroit's rich culture and history, there's really nothing else for me in the state of Michigan. I'm a big city person and I can't imagine not living in a big city. Detroit's future will NOT be that of a big city.

And even if I were to move elsewhere in the state, the same toxic mindset strangle-holding this region and state exists well outside Detroit's legal borders [[see the Michigan GOP ad).

**Crumbled_pavement** · October-10-12, 12:56 PM

Piggy backing off of the 'Detroit News poll: Crime drives Detroiters out; 40% expect to leave in 5 years' thread, I see a lot of people indicate that if they left the Detroit area they would leave the state completely.

Where would you go and why?

I'm guessing most of you would leave for a place that has a lower cost of living, better economy, better weather - and obviously lower crime. Where would those places be? And what could Detroit and Michigan learn from these areas?

What are some areas you would foresake Michigan for and what could Michigan do to compete with those areas?

http://www.detroityes.com/mb/showthr...ave-in-5-years

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...#ixzz28nbOEjPI

**brizee** · October-10-12, 01:07 PM

New York
Chicago
Philly
Maybe Boston
Maybe DC/Baltimmore/Virginia

They could learn to act like a real goddamn city and not the worlds most ghetto suburb.

Get some leadership[[statewide) that is honest and doesn't talk out of the side of their mouths. Stop playing this stupid ass racial/income/city-suburb games.

The only way I stay in this state is if it's Detroit.

I wouldn't stay in most of these suburbs if you paid me.

This town/state is just full of ugly provincial hypocritical hardhearted people.