Mr. Moroun, please stop the lying

**gnome** · September-21-12, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by Hermod

Is the furor for a new bridge more of a "Let's stick it to Maroun?

This question seemingly is on several minds. Since we know Matty around these parts we have come to hate him simply because he is a miserable guy. Familiarity breeds contempt, as it were.

By extension those who don't know Matty as being a bad neighbor certainly would not care one way or the other; however, that thinking doesn't serve to explain why the Chambers of Commerce in Muskegon, Holland, Kalamazoo, Sault St. Marie, Traverse City, Grand Rapids, Lansing, or Battle Creek all support the NITC.

That doesn't explain why Honda, Toyota or the Big Three support the NITC. Nor does it explain why the Ohio House and Senate, nor does it explain why every living Former Michigan Governor support the Bridge.

Do they all hate Matty? Do the execs at Kellogg's hate Matty. Does the UAW hate Matty? How about Union local 324? Meijers? Herman Miller? Ficano, L. Brooks, Hackel?

That is a pant-load of hate going around.

I never knew that hate for a single man could fuse business, labor, the media, and governmental big shots into a single force.

Boy, the stuff you learn ...

**Detroitdave** · September-21-12, 12:59 PM

Originally Posted by Bham1982

This is why Canada supports the project, and is exactly why Michigan should not support the project.

Be honest, and tell the public that the bridge is for Windsor urban redevelopment purposes, and has nothing to do with trade or cross-border issues. It's about relocating a bridge to a location that makes more sense from Windsor's perspective.

That's it ,Windsor is only looking out for it's people and we shouldn't help out a neighbor that we have been, and are tied to forever.
Also this neighbor is fronting the money to help the folks in southwest Detroit and create thousands of badly need jobs on this side of the bridge , what are they thinking ? oh and the good people are Canada are just going to go along with this without a peep?
That sounds real rational , you can't trust those sneaky Canadians.
They must be on the other side of the bridge thinking "what are those people thinking?, what else can we do for them?, maybe we can throw in fixing and maintaining belle isle for 30 years?, oh and fix the lights and while we are at it add more cops and fix the schools ?
What else do you people want ?

**Danny** · September-21-12, 01:11 PM

What happen to fair and balanced politics? There is no fair and balance politics in America, only endless thirst for power and corruption.

**Embee** · September-21-12, 06:11 PM

Bham 1982, you think this is only about Windsor?? I assure you the Canadian government would not be interested in spending a billion dollars simply to improve the urban development of a moderately sized city.

The delays facing trucks are affecting trade especially the auto industry, with their just-in-time delivery. If the crossing doesn't go here then investment will just flow elsewhere leaving Michigan to suffer in its own poor decisions - and dragging southwestern Ontario down with it.

**Pickford-Bentler** · September-22-12, 07:50 AM

Originally Posted by Embee

Bham 1982, you think this is only about Windsor?? I assure you the Canadian government would not be interested in spending a billion dollars simply to improve the urban development of a moderately sized city.

The delays facing trucks are affecting trade especially the auto industry, with their just-in-time delivery. If the crossing doesn't go here then investment will just flow elsewhere leaving Michigan to suffer in its own poor decisions - and dragging southwestern Ontario down with it.

The Ambassador Bridge was built at a time when rail was king and the interstate highway system not conceived. One look at Google maps shows that it is an inefficient crossing with repsect to the road network that services North America.

The Ford Edge is manufactured in Ontario off of 401 and gets the 3.5 liter or 3.7 liter duratec engines from Lima, Ohio - a point off of I-75.

If I was a running a just in time truck loop delivering engines to the Edge plant, I would see an economic benefit of crossing at the location of the new bridge to shorten the total route and avoid traversing 17 stop lights.

It takes a lot of energy to bring the mass of a truck up to speed. Doing that 17 times significantly adds to fuel cost.

As someone already brilliantly pointed out. There has to be a reason other than jealousy of Maroun being a titan at bringing useful products to people that Honda, Ford, GM and Chrysler support the new bridge.

**Gannon** · September-23-12, 11:14 PM

It seems the professional people hired by the Freep to analyze the bridge proposition...the REAL one about actually building a bridge to our neighbors to the south, not the FALSE one hoisted onto our ballots by an extraorinarily rich liar and his gang of liars...have concluded that NO taxpayer monies will be spent on the project.

http://www.freep.com/article/20120923/BUSINESS06/309230167/Experts-say-new-international-bridge-won-t-cost-Michigan-taxpayers?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

I propose that anyone who has to hear their lies be rewarded with $1,000 of Matty's money for each instance, from now on.

Retrospective to, say, five years ago.

Only catch, the money has to be used on community development, neighborhood improvement, and care for those in the greatest need in the Metro area.

Stop yer lying, Matty. Shut your son up...he's got the most to lose on this all, but you've already provided him enough money to live well forever on. And we never want to hear from your well-armed bulldog Dan Stamper ever again. Put your money into cleaning up that pesky park you wanted to own, so you could build your empire above it. We always knew that was the weak link to your plans anyways, so now that they are dust...stop wasting money on politicians and help clean up the park and neighborhood you so willingly conspired to destroy!

Cheers,
John

**Bham1982** · September-24-12, 07:43 AM

The article is bull.

Last I checked, Michigan taxpayers pay federal taxes. Canada is paying 100% of the Michigan matching funds, and 0% of the initial federal grant.

So, even if you believe the state's very creative accounting [[like not counting any of the site acquisition costs, and not counting any of the effects on existing liabilities for Ambassador and Blue Water), you still have 50% of the cost borne by the feds, of which Canada won't contribute a penny.

**Meddle** · September-24-12, 07:46 AM

^ And which Maroun are you?

**dmike76** · September-24-12, 08:03 AM

There has to be some cost with federal taxes to hire border guards, etc. But Maroun is still a lying scumbag. He throws out BS like 'what about our teachers, firefighters, etc'? THIS ISN'T GOING TO AFFECT THEM. Maroun deliberatly built his ramps against the plans drawn up in his agreement with the state, costing the taxpayers millions in court costs because the state had to block his shady activities. No one mentions that. He kept semi-trucks running through the neighborhoods by the bridge, endangering everyone there with pollution and traffic. And once you get past all of that, I think he is trying to preserve a monopoly on bridge profits, which to me is illegal.

**Meddle** · September-24-12, 08:09 AM

We need to start lobbying for the Feds to seize the Ambassador and get Fatty out of the picture completely.

**Gannon** · September-24-12, 08:19 AM

Or, do like the author of Quick Escapes-Detroit [[26 weekend getaways from the Motor City) did and just ignore his bridge completely.

In the section on going to Windsor, which I rushed to in order to see how she dealt with the Homeland Insecurity issues...I noticed she called the Ambassador Bridge the Bluewater...and THIS the 'third' Edition.

But seriously, since Matty's influence extends well into the trucking industry...I've already figured out how he'll make good on his warning that the costs of the new bridge will expand exponentially...he's going to go full-bore into manipulating any company that helps deliver supplies to the jobsite on both sides of the border. He's probably sent Stamper to remedial spymaster schooling already.

Just somethin' to look out for...

Cheers

**Wesley Mouch** · September-24-12, 11:47 AM

I'm in favor of Maroun lying. Clear lies will undermine his position, as the truth becomes apparent.

Transparency is nearly always good for everyone. Those who want to stifle political campaigns are wrong. Its better to allow free speech -- even when funded by the Koch Brothers. But essential to create transparency in who is funding ads, and transparency in all government operations so we can best judge the truth.

Have I said 'transparency' enough?

And is it oh, so clear that a second crossing not controlled by the same person is essential for the long-term health of Windsor/Detroit as a transportation and automotive hub? I even think the idea of charging a toll is a mistake. Trade and free movement across our border with Canada is such a benefit to us, that we shouldn't mind spending a few billion. It'll come back to us if we do.

So stop the tolling. And just pay for the bridge.

**313WX** · September-24-12, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by ndavies

Our grand children will not be paying for the bridge. It will be built with bonds that will be repaid through the bridge tolls. Just like the Blue Water bridge and the Makinac Bridge. The Blue Water bridge was financed by the US side since the Canadians at the time didn't have the money. The new bridge will be financed by the Canadians since this time the US doesn't want to cough up the money.

What happens if the bridge tolls are below expectations? Who's going to be repaying those bonds then?

I'm certainly not defending Matty Maroun, but I'm also sick of Snyder circumventing legal processes and procedures. I do want the bridge and I don't mind my taxpayer dollars being spent on it, but I do at least want a say in it all.

**Detroitdave** · September-24-12, 08:29 PM

WOW the title of my thread changed :-) this is a much better title. I was trying to be nice with the fair and balanced title :-)
I appreciate all the great debate, continue on :-)

**Wesley Mouch** · September-24-12, 11:54 PM

Originally Posted by Detroitdave

Also I was listening to NPR and Mr Marouns bridge gets Federal funds also !
What a hippocratic ! for the agents and other funds !

What? Can you splain?

**Pam** · September-25-12, 06:00 AM

Originally Posted by Detroitdave

WOW the title of my thread changed :-) this is a much better title. I was trying to be nice with the fair and balanced title :-)
I appreciate all the great debate, continue on :-)

That's because two threads got merged. New title was from Gannon's thread.

**Gannon** · September-25-12, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by Detroitdave

WOW the title of my thread changed :-) this is a much better title. I was trying to be nice with the fair and balanced title :-)
I appreciate all the great debate, continue on :-)

It kinda freaked me, I'd never seen a thread grow from 3 to 4,400 views in a few hours...and 85 more comments were more than I expected. Glad it was more tame than that.

I really didn't read that other thread because of the term "politics"...I think I'm saturated alread this year!

**Gannon** · September-25-12, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

What? Can you splain?

I'm pretty sure the hippocratic is some oath the doctors all lie about. Well, many of them at least.

I'd bet it is another spellcheck bomb. Another way SmartPhones make you look dumb.

Cheers!

**9606 Prest** · September-25-12, 09:05 AM

Mr. Moron or is it Maroun has been lying and cheating for years, why would he stop now at age 90?

**Jimaz** · September-25-12, 09:39 AM

Originally Posted by Gannon

... I'd bet it is another spellcheck bomb. Another way SmartPhones make you look dumb....

Yesterday the first suggestion offered by my spellchecker for "TheTeaParty" was "Therapy." LOL!

**drjeff** · September-25-12, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

What happens if the bridge tolls are below expectations? Who's going to be repaying those bonds then?

I'm certainly not defending Matty Maroun, but I'm also sick of Snyder circumventing legal processes and procedures. I do want the bridge and I don't mind my taxpayer dollars being spent on it, but I do at least want a say in it all.

Canada is on the hook. It's not a Michigan problem.

**313WX** · September-25-12, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by drjeff

Canada is on the hook. It's not a Michigan problem.

Who do you think Canada's coming for when THEIR bills are due?

**Gannon** · September-25-12, 11:42 AM

If they try to invade, we've got Federal Troops behind us.

**Meddle** · September-25-12, 11:54 AM

we've got Federal Troops behind us

I'm not sure I'd want them behind me. I'd rather have them in front of me so as not to become 'collateral damage'.

**Detroitdave** · September-25-12, 04:25 PM

It was a spell check error sorry :-) I was using my iphone and sometimes its does the spelling for you . It should have read Hypocrite.
Also check out this and check out what matty is already doing up in Niagra , it's in the comment section .
http://michiganradio.org/post/bridgi...o-pays-part-2\
this is from one of the posters on that site
Kurt A Hesse
"Heres a little lesson for those who know NOTHING about international border crossings.. You keep saying Moroun's willing to build a bridge that wont cost you ANYTHING?? Stupidest thing I've ever heard.. He's trying to build one up in the Niagra region too. Already owns all the land on both sides for it .. Pay attention here.. Moroun builds the bridge...900 million.. Then what? CALL IN THE TAXPAYER...!! Time to hook it into the freeway systems ON BOTH SIDES! Canadas offer for our interchanges.550 million.. Another 550 million on the Canadian side.. WALA! Moroun just got Dumb and Dumber to spend 200 MILLION more than he did on the span!! You think thats stupid?? WE AREN'T DONE YET! THOSE WERE JUST THE STATES COSTS!! Now call in the REALLY STUPID FEDS and have em build your inspection plazas.[[after Moroun rapes us over the cost of the land). Those are said to be in the area of another 500 million.. EACH SIDE!! Where we at now?? 1.2 BILLION MORE THAN MOROUN SPENT BUILDING THE BRIDGE!!! He builds his little toll collection booths.. Hires some twits to take your money and WE PAY EVERY OTHER EMPLOYEE YOU SEE AT THAT CROSSING!!! 100 MILLION A YEAR TO SECURE THIS THING FOR HIM!! HOW STUPID DO YOU FEEL NOW???."