Magic Johnson part of group to redevelop the Fairgrounds

**innercitydoc** · September-01-12, 08:14 AM

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...xt|FRONTPAGE|p

**stasu1213** · September-01-12, 09:00 AM

I am happy for Magic Johnson. I hope that he and his developement don't get tangled in the red tape. I don't see anything else happening on that site when I pass by it but dirt and a couple of earthmovers

**hybridy** · September-01-12, 09:18 AM

This will be the final nail In the coffin for the bel air center

Shollin · September-01-12, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by hybridy

This will be the final nail In the coffin for the bel air center

I think the dirt was already thrown on the Bel Air center when Target left. The corpse is fully decomposed now. Somehow we feel it's a better idea to build essentially Bel Air 2 a couple miles down 8 Mile even though Eastland, Northland and all retail on 8 Mile is basically dead. I can't imagine anyone from Royal Oak or Ferndale even shopping at 8 and Woodward. I give it 5-7 years. I think that's how long Target lasted at Bel Air if I remember correctly.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · September-01-12, 11:29 AM

Magic has seem to have developed into a astute businessman and power broker. Congrats. You can't say that about most former athletes.

**313WX** · September-01-12, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by Shollin

I think the dirt was already thrown on the Bel Air center when Target left. The corpse is fully decomposed now. Somehow we feel it's a better idea to build essentially Bel Air 2 a couple miles down 8 Mile even though Eastland, Northland and all retail on 8 Mile is basically dead. I can't imagine anyone from Royal Oak or Ferndale even shopping at 8 and Woodward. I give it 5-7 years. I think that's how long Target lasted at Bel Air if I remember correctly.

Bel-Air opened in 1986 I believe with Builder's Square, Toys 'R Us, Farmer Jack, Target, AMC Theatre and a hand full of other national/regional chains. It's on the site of the old Bel-Air Drive In [[which was closed and demolished).

So the stores were there for a good 15 years.

The lift of the residency requirement is probably what ultimately killed it off [[also the Kmart on Sherwood and Outer Drive). The retail establishments built on the edge of the city were still heavily dependent on the middle class wages from city workers who lived in the nearby neighborhoods [[Nortown, Regent Park, Mohican-Regent, etc.).

BTW, I see it has slipped under the radar, but the regional chain of arcades, Bounce House, just opened a new location at Bel-Air Centre inside the old Farmer Jack/Bally Total Fitness.

http://www.bouncehouseonline.com/locations.html

**Pam** · September-01-12, 03:46 PM

What are they going to do about the historic structures on the site?

**Hamtragedy** · September-01-12, 05:10 PM

Whatever. He did a bang up job at Grand River and Greenfield.

Shollin · September-01-12, 05:50 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Bel-Air opened in 1986 I believe with Builder's Square, Toys 'R Us, Farmer Jack, Target, AMC Theatre and a hand full of other national/regional chains. It's on the site of the old Bel-Air Drive In [[which was closed and demolished).

So the stores were there for a good 15 years.

The lift of the residency requirement is probably what ultimately killed it off [[also the Kmart on Sherwood and Outer Drive). The retail establishments built on the edge of the city were still heavily dependent on the middle class wages from city workers who lived in the nearby neighborhoods [[Nortown, Regent Park, Mohican-Regent, etc.).

BTW, I see it has slipped under the radar, but the regional chain of arcades, Bounce House, just opened a new location at Bel-Air Centre inside the old Farmer Jack/Bally Total Fitness.

http://www.bouncehouseonline.com/locations.html

I used to live in Mohican-Regent in the late 80's early 90's. That Target was awful. I remember one time kids riding bikes through the store knocked me into the shelves. Everything was locked down and merchandise was scattered throughout the store. The Target at Eastland when it opened was a much nicer store when it opened. I agree the residency killed the neighborhood. I used to rent a duplex and the other half was occupied by a Detroit cop. There was also a city water employee and city inspector that were neighbors.

**Hypestyles** · September-01-12, 09:30 PM

hopefully this development project will be allowed to go through without getting blocked by [fill in the blank]... but we'll see..

GUSHI · September-01-12, 10:34 PM

The merchandise would definitely move off the shelves, I see a lot of theft accruing, they better have security guards.

**Cinderpath** · September-01-12, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by Shollin

II can't imagine anyone from Royal Oak or Ferndale even shopping at 8 and Woodward. .

I can- It'd be very easy and accessible to Ferndale and the Woodward corridor. I look forward to it. Living in Ferndale, the only close large scale supermarket is the awful Kroger in Hazel Park. The question is as you point out, will they keep it decent or let it go to hell.

**downtownguy** · September-02-12, 07:40 AM

I wonder why Bing declined to comment? Isn't this the type of thing politicians love to glom onto and use to show their leadership is bringing things back?

From the article:

Detroit Mayor Dave Bing declined comment.

**Hamtragedy** · September-02-12, 09:29 AM

Probably because this just is a proposal, as I'm sure there are probably several others.

**mwilbert** · September-02-12, 10:41 AM

Originally Posted by Cinderpath

I can- It'd be very easy and accessible to Ferndale and the Woodward corridor. I look forward to it. Living in Ferndale, the only close large scale supermarket is the awful Kroger in Hazel Park. The question is as you point out, will they keep it decent or let it go to hell.

I agree that they will attract people from Ferndale and other nearby suburbs. The question is whether there will be enough business in total to keep a large set of stores profitable. Together with the development that is already theoretically in progress, that is 850,000 sq ft of space. By comparison, I believe Fairlane is about 1,450,000 sq ft. That is a substantial amount of space.

Shollin · September-02-12, 10:51 AM

Originally Posted by mwilbert

I agree that they will attract people from Ferndale and other nearby suburbs. The question is whether there will be enough business in total to keep a large set of stores profitable. Together with the development that is already theoretically in progress, that is 850,000 sq ft of space. By comparison, I believe Fairlane is about 1,450,000 sq ft. That is a substantial amount of space.

People from Eastpointe, St Clair Shores, Grosee Pointe etc don't shop at Eastland because of how bad it has gotten, what makes you think suburbanites are going to Detroit to shop? Hell people don't want to shop at the Walmart at 14 and Van Dyke because of how bad it is. Why would someone from Royal Oak go to 8 Mile when there is a Meijer in Royal Oak on Coolidge, or the one on 13 mile in Madison Heights, or even the one on 12 and Mound which is a short drive down 696?

**mwilbert** · September-02-12, 11:07 AM

I don't think people who live closer to Coolidge and 14 will shop at 8 and Woodward unless they happen to be near there for some reason. Ferndale is another matter.

Shollin · September-02-12, 12:21 PM

Ferndale has about 20k people and supposedly these yuppies who live in Ferndale despise big box stores and parking lots.

**Cinderpath** · September-02-12, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Shollin

Ferndale has about 20k people and supposedly these yuppies who live in Ferndale despise big box stores and parking lots.

Ferndale isn't exactly all Yuppies. The city is quite diverse ethnically, socially, and economically, with all sides of the spectrum. Yes we like local businesses; that doesn't mean we hate Meijors, etc. Sorry even though we live in strange times, the world is not black or white.

**313WX** · September-02-12, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Shollin

People from Eastpointe, St Clair Shores, Grosee Pointe etc don't shop at Eastland because of how bad it has gotten, what makes you think suburbanites are going to Detroit to shop? Hell people don't want to shop at the Walmart at 14 and Van Dyke because of how bad it is. Why would someone from Royal Oak go to 8 Mile when there is a Meijer in Royal Oak on Coolidge, or the one on 13 mile in Madison Heights, or even the one on 12 and Mound which is a short drive down 696?

It's true.

While at the Walgreens on Harper and 8 Mile in St. Clair Shores, while I was in line I overheard a lady say to another person that she would rather go all the way out to the shops on Hall Road [[I believe she lived in the Vicinity of the Walgreens store) because of how "trashy" the Target at Eastland and the Wal-Mart in Roseville are.

**313WX** · September-02-12, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by downtownguy

I wonder why Bing declined to comment? Isn't this the type of thing politicians love to glom onto and use to show their leadership is bringing things back?

From the article:

That's an old-fashion trick someone uses to keep their feet out of a sticky [[ambiguous) situation. In fact, it's what they teach first year law students to do and that's what lawyers tell their clients to do during pending lawsuits.

Bing doesn't want to state an opinion either way because no one knows exactly how things will play out and he doesn't want to go on record standing on either side of the fence.

**Richard** · September-02-12, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by downtownguy

I wonder why Bing declined to comment? Isn't this the type of thing politicians love to glom onto and use to show their leadership is bringing things back?

From the article:

The state is handling all of the details/leases so the city has no involvement or revenue or say?

He will not probably say much because of Mr Gilbert involvement?

Does this not actually compete with this one? they seem to have the same goals right next to each other.

The Detroit Economic Development Corp. has approved an $850,000 loan to the developers of the Shops at Gateway Park project.
The proposed 330,000-square-foot shopping development, at 8 Mile Road and Woodward Avenue near the Michigan State Fairgrounds, has been in the works for years.
Gateway Park was first pitched in 2004 by a group of longtime Detroiters including developer Bernie Schrott, Dykema Gossett PLLC attorney Elliot Hall, former Wayne County Commissioner Ricardo Soloman and Marvin Beatty, a former owner of Greektown Casino.

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...r-fairgrounds#

Is Hantz still getting the 40 acres for their "farming",correct me if I am wrong but does the state not own the property?

**mwilbert** · September-02-12, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by Cinderpath

Ferndale isn't exactly all Yuppies. The city is quite diverse ethnically, socially, and economically, with all sides of the spectrum. Yes we like local businesses; that doesn't mean we hate Meijors, etc. Sorry even though we live in strange times, the world is not black or white.

Most of my relatives live in Ferndale [[one of my nephews bought a house there last week, so that's four more...). They shop in all kinds of places, but I can assure you that includes Meijer's. at least sometimes, and I'm sure Meijer's did some kind of market research before deciding to locate a store there. Maybe they are wrong, but presumably they think there is enough demand from someplace to support a store.

**detroitsgwenivere** · September-02-12, 08:11 PM

Originally Posted by Cinderpath

I look forward to it. Living in Ferndale, the only close large scale supermarket is the awful Kroger in Hazel Park.

Why, exactly, do you feel the Kroger in HP is so awful? I'm just wondering.

**313WX** · September-02-12, 08:26 PM

Originally Posted by mwilbert

Most of my relatives live in Ferndale [[one of my nephews bought a house there last week, so that's four more...). They shop in all kinds of places, but I can assure you that includes Meijer's. at least sometimes, and I'm sure Meijer's did some kind of market research before deciding to locate a store there. Maybe they are wrong, but presumably they think there is enough demand from someplace to support a store.

FWIW, I also think the Kroger on 7 Mile and Gratiot [[in addition to the middle class Mohican-Regent /Regent Park neighborhoods) was depending on some business from Harper Woods, Warren and Eastpointe as well.

We saw how well that played out.

I'm not saying that will apply with the shops at 8 Mile and Woodward, but something to keep in mind.