What is the origin of Detroit's "coney island" hot dogs?

[theresa]

Does anyone know how coney island hot dogs got started? Who came up for the name [[I assume a reference to NYC Coney Island Park, where they serve hot dogs)? Who first served a dog smothered in chili and onions and called it a "coney island?" And why are so many of Detroit's coney island restaurants run by Greeks who also serve Greek food?

I am working on an "Unconventional Guide to Detroit" and would love to know the origin of this peculiarly Detroit custom of putting together a hot dog. My own coney island favorite is a bowl of coney island chili smothered in chopped onions and shredded cheddar cheese. The best!

[DetroitPlanner]

It is named after a person. Mike "Coney" Island opened the first hot dog stand in Detroit in 1850.

Obviously I made that up. I do not know why they are called Coney Islands nor do I care much about the history of them. To me its somewhat of a mystery that I would want it to remain a mystery.

[brizee]

The way I heard it last summer:

The owner of American Coney Island was an immigrant. He tasted his first dog on Coney Island in New York. He liked it so much when he made his way to the D he just called the dogs coneys.

Not too complicated and it sounds believable to me.

[drjeff]

Interesting question that I've also wondered about. Supposedly a German immigrant first started selling sausages on buns on Coney Island in 1870, although a lot of others have claimed inventing the hot dog. A former employee of his started Nathan's Famous hot dogs in Coney Island in 1916. American Coney Island here in Detroit opened in 1917. But Nathan's did not serve chili dogs. I wonder if the dogs American originally sold were "normal" dogs without chili?

[rb336]

there's a book on the subject from wayne state university press. http://coneydetroit.com

[EastsideAl]

I have always heard that they were named for the still-existing Coney Island amusement park in Cincinnati [[which was itself, obviously, named after the more famous Coney Island in NYC, but that's mostly besides the point).

Cincinnati, of course, has its own well-known culinary tradition of chili made by Greek immigrants. At some point one of the Greek-American vendors at the Cincinnati Coney Island had the bright idea to combine the hot dog - specialty of the original NYC Coney Island and increasingly popular throughout the country - and Cincy's own Greek chili, and, voila!, the "Coney Island" hot dog was born.

Back then, in the late 19th and early 20th centuries, cheap "chili parlor" lunch counters, almost all run by newly arrived Greeks, swept over cities in the Midwest and elsewhere. Period photos of downtown Detroit show several of them.

One of these chili parlors began selling "Coney Island style hot dogs" along with the bowls of chili. That was apparently the American chili parlor on Lafayette. And they caught on, big time. Soon, chili was not the biggest seller, "Coney Islands" were, and restaurants that served them renamed themselves to reflect that popularity.

Now, Detroit is not the only place to have coneys. Other places across the midwest, and, indeed, out to the east, also served Coney Island style hot dogs. Very often with a somewhat different chili from the Detroit version [[witness the differing styles elsewhere in Michigan), but always with the same basic recipe: hot dog, chili, mustard, onions, bun. But Detroit, for whatever reason, is where the coney became king.

At least that's what I heard...

[EastsideAl]

Below is a photograph [[labelled 1915, but based on the visual evidence I believe it's actually 1912) of the north side of Lafayette between Shelby and Griswold, looking east. Amidst several other culinary fads of the time [[most prominently, chop suey), you'll see a sign about mid-block that is partially obscured, but clear says "...ican Chili Con Carne". It's a few doors down from their current location, but could this be one of the ancestors of the Coney Islands?



A closer in view of the sign, and view down to the current location of the coneys [[where the "Tiger's Chop Suey" sign is):

[EastsideAl]

By the early 1960s the block looked like this:

[detroitpride313]

Did u check the Wikipedia pages. Apparently the Coney Island hot dog started in Jackson, Michigan. The link to the page about the actual coney island hot dogs is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coney_island_hot_dog and the link to the page about the coney island restaurants [[including Lafayette and American Coney Island downtown) is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coney_I...8restaurant%29

[drjeff]

Did u check the Wikipedia pages. Apparently the Coney Island hot dog started in Jackson, Michigan. The link to the page about the actual coney island hot dogs is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coney_island_hot_dog and the link to the page about the coney island restaurants [[including Lafayette and American Coney Island downtown) is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coney_I...8restaurant%29

I grew up in Jackson and I call BS on this. It's wikipedia so anyone can add crap. Also- Detroit coneys are better than Jackson coneys.

[pgn421]

Oldest Coney Island is Red Hots Coney Island in Highland Park, on Victor off of Woodward. They even make their own chili.

[GUSHI]

Most coney islands today are owned by Albanians,

[jefferson78]

Nobody will ever make better coneys than they did at the old Hefty's, on Grand River in Redford. I say "old" because there is another Hefty's near there but they suck.
The original owners of Hefty's were Greek, I believe.

[canuck]

And then there are the variations on the Detroit Coney that evolved toward upper New York State and Quebec; they are called Michigan hot dogs or in french; un hot dog michigan, or better still un chien chaud Michigan...

But I would rather try the real stuff as the ones served here are filled with plain old tomato meat sauce, a soggy and sad version I'm sure of the Detroit original.

[theresa]

Thanks so much for all the great info!!!

[JoeGrimm]

Photo for "Coney Detroit" by Keith Burgess

Great thread. While writing "Coney Detroit," published in March by Wayne State University Press, part of our research was into the question of who had the first coney. Some of what we learned:
* Neither American nor Lafayette was first -- and they don't claim to be. We pored over old Detroit City Directories and found a lot of lunch counters in the area of Michigan Avenue and Lafayette Boulevard, when Detroit was bursting with autoworkers. There were several other coney islands, now gone, as well as a number of "chop suey" places.
* Greeks were opening coney island restaurants in several states around that time.
* Only in Michigan did the coney island business reach such large proportions
* We do not find any proof that the coney island hot dog was "invented" in Jackson, Mich.
* Red Hot Coney Island on Victor Street in Highland Park is a GREAT and old coney island. One of the best and oldest around.
* We detailed old coney traditions in Port Huron, Kalamazoo and Flint, of course.
* We guesstimate [[very rough) that there are about 500 coney islands in the Detroit area and that about half of them half a direct connection to the Keros family, which started American and Lafayette.
* Lafayette is no longer run by the Keros Family.
* At one time, the Keros Family ran three coney island in a row: American, Lafayette and State.

[Novine]

Joe - Please update the Wikipedia article!

[Chinman]

one of the biggest hotdog restaurants in atlanta, ga has coney dogs on the menu. also in an east coast city also has old greek immigrants with the same hot dog. saw it on the food channel. i think it would be hard to find which city has claim, but one thing from the story is that greek immigrants started the chili thing and added it to hotdogs.
but hey...lets claim it as ours because we have a coney-dog place on almost every corner like there are dunk-n-donuts on every corner on the east coast.

[56packman]

Hefty's on Grand River SUCKED the one time I ate there. They boiled the hot dog. That's what your mother did back in the 60s, and no way to treat any kind of meat, even hot dogs.

[jefferson78]

Hefty's on Grand River SUCKED the one time I ate there. They boiled the hot dog. That's what your mother did back in the 60s, and no way to treat any kind of meat, even hot dogs.

If you ate there within the last 15 years then you did not try the original Hefty''s. It was torn down about then and a totally different Hefty's went in it's place. The new place sucks and is nothing like the old diner with the grizzled old Greek owners cooking the goods.
I can attest that they used to grill their hot dogs as I used to watch them religiously as a kid. Those were the best coney's anywhere and would give anything coming from downtown a run for it's money.

[gazhekwe]

My sister lives in Alaska and she has serious Detroit cravings. Last year I sent her some Faygo Rock and Rye for Christmas. This year I sent a Coney Kit from American. They got there in just two days in good shape and she is hoarding them, since her Texas raised family does not appreciate them. 12 Dearborn Sausage hot dogs, 12 buns, a sweet onion, chili sauce, and a hat. FUN!

http://www.americanconeyisland.com/shipping.htm

Now I want coneys for dinner.

[Kathleen]

one of the biggest hotdog restaurants in atlanta, ga has coney dogs on the menu.

Are you referring to The Varsity? It's an Atlanta tradition!!! I eat there every time I'm in Atlanta...but have never tried their hotdog with chili since I know it can't compete with my Lafayette coneys. So I opt for their slaw dog combo., which is pretty darn yummy!

[Big Dog]

I watched a special on the history of coney island, and it claimed that the first coney hot dog, originated there. It spread fast, like wildfire, across the country. Reason, Coney Island was a large tourist spot.

[EastsideAl]

I watched a special on the history of coney island, and it claimed that the first coney hot dog, originated there. It spread fast, like wildfire, across the country. Reason, Coney Island was a large tourist spot.

From Jeffrey Stanton's history of Coney Island [[the one in Brooklyn, that is...)

Feltman's & the Hot Dog

In 1867 Charles Feltman owned a pie-wagon that delivered his freshly baked pies to the inns and lager-beer saloons that lined Coney Island's beaches. His clients also wanted hot sandwiches to serve to their customers. But his wagon was small and he knew that it would be hard to manage making a variety of sandwiches in a confined space. He thought that perhaps something simple like a hot sausage served on a roll might be the solution. He presented his problem to Donovan, the wheel-wright on East New York and Howard Street in Brooklyn, who had built his pie-wagon. The man saw no problem in building a tin-lined chest to keep the rolls fresh and rigging a small charcoal stove inside to boil sausages.

When the wheel-wright finished the installation they fired up the stove for a test run. Donovan thought that the sausage sandwich was a strange idea but he was willing to try it as Feltman boiled the succulent pork sausage and placed between a roll. The wheel-wright tasted the it and liked it. Thus the hot-dog was born.

In 1871 Feltman subleased a tiny plot of land on one of the big shore lots. He served hot dogs to 3,684 patrons that first season. After a few summer seasons he was successful enough to buy his own shore lot at West 10th Street from Surf Avenue to the beach where he built his Ocean Pavilion. In 1874 he paid $7500 for the restaurant property.


Feltman's in the 1890's.

Nathan Handwerker worked for Feltman's but left in 1916 to start his own hot dog stand. Feltman's is long gone, but Nathan's still exists today in Coney Island and is open 24 a day every day [[although presently temporarily closed due to the effects of Hurricane Sandy).

However, the hot dog would travel a rather circuitous path before it came to Detroit covered in chili, mustard, and onions as a "coney island."

[canuck]

Here's a little taste of Coney Island from my favorite movie of all time; Paper Moon;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsxHZ5TS-Yw