Snyder Wants 60% Car Registration Fee Hike

**Zacha341** · January-22-12, 05:31 PM

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news...ke-20120120-ms

**stasu1213** · January-22-12, 06:24 PM

This is amazing. First, the Governor cancelled the rail project up Woodward so people are force to rely on an automobile. Second, he want to raise the price of the registration fee to make it expensive for residents of Michigan to own a car. Does he realize that he is making this state a less tolerable most expensive state to live in?

**riviera** · January-22-12, 06:51 PM

Is this to prop up the states huge budget surplus this year?

if only auto insurance rates weren't so high aswell.

**davewindsor** · January-22-12, 07:32 PM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

This is amazing. First, the Governor cancelled the rail project up Woodward so people are force to rely on an automobile. Second, he want to raise the price of the registration fee to make it expensive for residents of Michigan to own a car. Does he realize that he is making this state a less tolerable most expensive state to live in?

Would you rather pay highway tolls like New York State? Or how about a 30% increase in gas prices from higher gas taxes like I'm paying right across the river in Windsor? Roads aren't cheap and the money has to come from somewhere.

**313WX** · January-22-12, 07:35 PM

For the people of Michigan who dislike this, the words "Buyer's Remorse" [[or in this case, Voter's Remorse) come to mind.

You knew what you were getting yourselves into when voting this man into office and quite frankly you get what you deserve, Maybe someone, somewhere, can play a very small violin for you.

**313WX** · January-22-12, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

Would you rather pay highway tolls like New York State? Or how about a 30% increase in gas prices from higher gas taxes like I'm paying right across the river in Windsor? Roads aren't cheap and the money has to come from somewhere.

We could always build fewer roads, and give people the option to choose other modes of transportation besides the automobile.

For example, how about we start with a heavy passenger rai line from Ann Arbor to DTW to Detroit...

...Oh wait, oops, never mind.

Oh oh oh, but how about this, we can try building a light passenger rail along Woodward from downtown to 8 Mile. Not only would it give the option of residents who live along Woodward outside of downtown to get to/from the CBD faster, it would also increase the walkability of downtown/midtown...!!!

Oh wait, oops, that ain't happening either...

Oh well...

**Jimaz** · January-22-12, 07:45 PM

There's not much detail in that Fox story.

Is this plan partly to resolve the unfairness of electric vehicle owners not having to pay gasoline taxes [[which I think go toward road repairs for all)? If so, will gasoline taxes be reduced also?

**brizee** · January-22-12, 08:00 PM

So....not a peep about this bus rapid transit nonsense that he spat out when he aborted light rail in the third trimester?

**davewindsor** · January-22-12, 08:07 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

We could always build fewer roads, and give people the option to choose other modes of transportation besides the automobile.

For example, how about we start with a heavy passenger rai line from Ann Arbor to DTW to Detroit...

...Oh wait, oops, never mind.

Oh oh oh, but how about this, we can try building a light passenger rail along Woodward from downtown to 8 Mile. Not only would it give the option of residents who live along Woodward outside of downtown to get to/from the CBD faster, it would also increase the walkability of downtown/midtown...!!!

Oh wait, oops, that ain't happening either...

Oh well...

How about Michigan raises their sales tax from 6% to Ontario's rate of 13% to pay for it? I've never heard of a passenger rail line that turned a profit and didn't need a government subsidy.

And if you think that's bad, I've had Europeans tell me Canada's taxes are cheap. How about paying over double for a gallon of gas in Germany? I've been to Germany before and seen people spend a thousand bucks filling up a grocery cart. I had a guy from Sweden tell me that paying the equivalent of16 bucks US for a bottle of beer in a bar is normal. So, you think your taxes are unfair???

**DetroitPlanner** · January-22-12, 08:12 PM

the state has natoriously underfunded transportation for years, probably since Milliken was Governor. We pay some of the lowest gas taxes and registration fees [[what funds the majority of the road transit and rail projects) of just about any State and our roads and transit systems show this. The registration fee is just one of many bills going through to fix this. Included with this series of bills is tying the gas tax to the cost of fuel [[rather than the gallon) because the use goes down when the price goes up. When the price of gas goes up, so does the need to fund transit, yet there is less money to fund transit! Another part of this is to look at legislation that would allow counties and regions to form RTAs, and local options for improving the funding of transportation).

**wolverine** · January-22-12, 08:13 PM

I heard Michigans vehicle registrations fees were dirt cheap so why should anyone complain. Pick your battles right?

**313WX** · January-22-12, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

How about Michigan raises their sales tax from 6% to Ontario's rate of 13% to pay for it? I've never heard of a passenger rail line that turned a profit and didn't need a government subsidy.

And if you think that's bad, I've had Europeans tell me Canada's taxes are cheap. How about paying over double for a gallon of gas in Germany? I've been to Germany before and seen people spend a thousand bucks filling up a grocery cart. I had a guy from Sweden tell me that paying the equivalent of16 bucks US for a bottle of beer in a bar is normal. So, you think your taxes are unfair???

1. Infrastructure investment is not supposed to make a profit. A body of government is not a business or individual.

2. Ontario's Sales Tax is 8%. The other 5% is imposed by the Canadian Federal Government. Of course, this is in addition to the PROGRESSIVE income tax Canada and Ontario has.

3. Ontario also has a progressive income tax. I agree Michigan would be better off with a progressive income tax system.

4. I don't mind paying taxes. It's how my tax dollars are spent that's the problem, and how they're leveraged amongst the populace.

5. As for Germany/Sweden, it's a trade off. You have significantly more job protection [[higher wages, more vacation days, less illegal immigration, union-friendly legislation, etc.) and nearly free education and health care. Make your choice.

**antongast** · January-22-12, 08:47 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

4. I don't mind paying taxes. It's how my tax dollars are spent on that's the problem, and how they're leveraged amongst the populace.

Came here to say this.

**Flintoid** · January-22-12, 09:58 PM

We under fund our roads by $1.4 billion a year as a state. This idea has nothing to do with Snyder or any one political party, it makes sense. We need to fund our roads, and we have to pay for that. Southeast Michigan pays 25 cents for every dollar that an average urban metropolitan area pays for transportation [[roads, rails, etc.). It shows, and this could be a step in the right direction.

**Searay215** · January-22-12, 10:24 PM

I heard on I beleive channel 4, that the increast in gas tax will be 9 cents a gallon and its not a 60% increase in plates, but a $60 per vehicle increase. As for the tax on gas, we currently have the 6th highest gas tax in the nation. Please tell me how that is going to make companies and people want to come to Michigan? Talk about hitting seniors, who have a fixed income....tax the pensions now increase other taxes.....I wish I could afford to move out of this state.

**jackie5275** · January-22-12, 10:52 PM

If you do Schedule A on your 1040, you can deduct the license plate fee.

**Novine** · January-22-12, 11:28 PM

It's the price of sprawl. Too few people paying to support too much infrastructure. But at least we have money to widen I-94.

**DetroitPlanner** · January-23-12, 01:03 AM

Originally Posted by Searay215

I heard on I beleive channel 4, that the increast in gas tax will be 9 cents a gallon and its not a 60% increase in plates, but a $60 per vehicle increase. As for the tax on gas, we currently have the 6th highest gas tax in the nation. Please tell me how that is going to make companies and people want to come to Michigan? Talk about hitting seniors, who have a fixed income....tax the pensions now increase other taxes.....I wish I could afford to move out of this state.

According to my counts and this source
http://www.gaspricewatch.com/usgastaxes.asp
there are 29 states whose gas tax is 19 cents or higher.
there are only 4 states with a diesel tax higher than ours.
Michigan also charges a sales tax on gasoline. Many other states do not. Of the sales tax, most of that goes to funding schools. None of it goes to funding transportation.

If you want to move to a state with less gas tax, god luck. Most of those are backwater hellholes worse than Michigan.

Jackie makes a good point. You can schedule A your lisence plate fees. Its also more fair as it is based on the car's worth. A straight gas tax is a long term loser as the policies to use transit more, drive less, and own more fuel efficient cars have bankrupted the Michigan Transportation Fund as well as the Federal Highway Trust Fund [[both of which also fund transit).

More people bitch about the poor shape of roads, the need for more transit, and how much they spend on stuff like tie rods and suspension systems in this state than there are who are saying that we adequetly fund roads and transit. Its time to shake off the Act 51 of 1951 mentality that has funded roads in this state and embrace something that will help us adequetly fund things.

**Gistok** · January-23-12, 01:21 AM

Originally Posted by davewindsor

How about paying over double for a gallon of gas in Germany? I've been to Germany before and seen people spend a thousand bucks filling up a grocery cart. I had a guy from Sweden tell me that paying the equivalent of16 bucks US for a bottle of beer in a bar is normal. So, you think your taxes are unfair???

Beer in Sweden.... averages $7....
http://www.studyinsweden.se/Living-i...ost-of-living/

Gas prices in Germany $8+ per gallon... but regular Germans drive economy cars, that get superb gas mileage. Ever come across a pothole in Germany? Much less auto maintenance costs...

People spending $1000 filling up a shopping cart? Um... that would likely be an institutional purchase... the reason.... German consumers have a refrigerator/freezer that is about 1/2 the capacity of those in the USA. They also generally shop more than once a week, due to that. They often shop at Aldi's and other cut rate supermarkets, where you buy from cases/cartons, bag it yourself, and bring your own shopping bags. Also Germans are about 10 times as likely as the USA to have their own gardens for growing foodstuffs. The memories of going hungry during and after the war years still runs deep in the German psyche. Been to Germany 15 times... never saw a shopping cart with that much piled into it....

**jerrytimes** · January-23-12, 01:42 AM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

This is amazing. First, the Governor cancelled the rail project up Woodward so people are force to rely on an automobile. Second, he want to raise the price of the registration fee to make it expensive for residents of Michigan to own a car. Does he realize that he is making this state a less tolerable most expensive state to live in?

FYI, the cost of living in Michigan is much lower than in many states, also, the cost of auto registrations hasn't gone up in at least 15 years. I bought my Chevy S-10 in 1997, I still have it and the cost hasn't changed. It's been $51 since I purchased it. 60% increase puts it up to $80ish. Big deal, if it makes our roads better and the money is used properly then fine. My 2011 Buick Regal is $151 a year, 60% brings it up to $240ish. Sucks that I have to pay more, but the roads are expensive.

**jerrytimes** · January-23-12, 01:45 AM

Originally Posted by stasu1213

This is amazing. First, the Governor cancelled the rail project up Woodward so people are force to rely on an automobile. Second, he want to raise the price of the registration fee to make it expensive for residents of Michigan to own a car. Does he realize that he is making this state a less tolerable most expensive state to live in?

Give me a break. Michigan has relied on the automobile for decades and a rail system? What is this, the 1920's? If $100 bucks or whatever a year is going to make it so impossible for you to own a car then maybe you have more problems than paying for your plates.

**Gistok** · January-23-12, 02:44 AM

Jerrytimes... I would prefer an increase in the gas tax rather than an increase in the registration fees. Why should retirees, who are on fixed incomes and drive significantly less than working folks, pay the same amount for road usage/repair, when they don't have to drive 20 miles to work every day, and put much less wear and tear on our rroadways.

**jerrytimes** · January-23-12, 02:48 AM

Originally Posted by Gistok

Jerrytimes... I would prefer an increase in the gas tax rather than an increase in the registration fees. Why should retirees, who are on fixed incomes and drive significantly less than working folks, pay the same amount for road usage/repair, when they don't have to drive 20 miles to work every day, and put much less wear and tear on our rroadways.

But a gas tax would over years time be much more of a cost to most people than why Snyder is proposing, including seniors.

**Dexlin** · January-23-12, 06:35 AM

Someone already partially corrected the original posters mistake, but not only is this not a 60% increase for all vehicles, but the $60 increase is an average that includes ALL cars, everything from Kias to Bentlys. Some people at the lower end would actually see a decrease in their registration fees. Snyder can't reveal that this is really a tax on more valuable cars, because it would go against the GOP ideology of increasing fee/staxes on the rich. He also can't explictly say that part of this money is going toward mass transit because that also goes against his party's orthodoxy. In all honesty, he's proposing a left-of-center idea, but through a center-right framing.

Personally, I'm generally supportive of this idea. Perhaps, to make sure the vehicle registration fee is lower than a $60 average we could mix a bit of sales tax revenue in to bring down the average we'd have to pay on vehicles, but I otherwise generally support the registration fee increase and switching the gas tax from retail to wholesale.

I'm not a fan of this governor at all, but this is nearly exactly what Granholm proposed. I supported it, then, and I support it know, at least in theory without seeing the exact details of the plan. This NEEDS to get done; this has been floated for over 10 years, now, time to get it done.

We've been bonding out money for patchwork repairs for years, now, which makes everything more expensive in the long-run. It's time to end this game and do it right. We need to start actually paying up front for regular repair and maintence work, and stop waiting until bridges and roads and rail are literally crumbling before we do anything about it.

**coracle** · January-23-12, 06:53 AM

$60 average increase per Car Registration Fee to repair our lousy Michigan roads is peanuts compared to the doubling of our gas price from $1.83 to $3.40 per gallon since the advent of Obama. Snyder is doing a sterling job and is addressing the previous 8 years of do nothing by the previous "Governor"