Moving to Detroit from Sweden; any advice?

[DetroitPlanner]

Lafayette Park neighborhood has a school within walking distance which is supposed to be good.[[Chrysler Elementary) Other posters who live there can tell you more. [[Paging Neil )

This might be a good choice. Get a Mies Van der Rhoe townhouse for a fraction of what it would cost in europe.

[gnome]

If one takes into consideration all the requirements:


- bike to downtown
- public school within walking distance of home
- walkable shopping district
- safety

I think the only place to consider is Lafayette Park.

As nice as Indian Village, Grosse Pointe, Corktown, Birmingham, Plymouth, or Palmer Park might be the only place that fits all of the criteria is LP.

[Flintoid]

Definitely Lafayette Park. Good school in walking distance, gorgeous park, very unique architecture, and right next door to downtown. Very walkable, bikeable, and a grocery store just opened in the neighborhood this year. I'm sure some other posters who live in the neighborhood could help you out with more details. And as far as education goes, if you dont want to go the Chrysler School [[the one in lafayette park) route, there are many excellent private and charter schools in the city. I'd avoid the suburbs, you would be forced to spend half your life in a car and for someone seeking walkability in the general downtown area, you certainly will not find it in the suburbs. Welcome to Detroit! Hope you love it as much as I do!

[Neilr]

As Pam, gnome and others have posted, Lafayette Park seems to best meet your criteria.

The Mies van der Rohe townhouses are coops as are most other townhouses in the neighborhood so renting is not a likely possibility. The 3 Mies glass high rise apartment buildings are rental. 1300 is a 28 story coop apartment building designed by Gunnar Birkerts that does permit some limited rental of units.

The internet has many, many links to articles, pictures, and videos about Lafayette Park. If you're interested, here's several to get you started.



http://www.modeldmedia.com/features/lafayette07.aspx


http://curbed.com/archives/2010/11/2...te-park-qa.php


http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=lafa...k+detroit&f=hp


http://blog.miessociety.org/post/128...ayette-park-in


http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com...ing-with-mies/


http://www.flickr.com/photos/jschiem...7626780007976/

[mwilbert]

First, let me say I hope you find a place you really like in Detroit.

Second, I'd never dis Lafayette Park, which I love, but it is almost too close to bike downtown. And while there is nearby shopping, I don't think there is any place inside the city limits that really offers a good variety of shopping. [[Incidentally , I disagree with Bham1982 about Livernois--there are actually a number of useful stores a half-mile either side of 7. Of course it isn't what it was when I was a kid, or should be now. ) You can easily bike downtown from Midtown, or Corktown, or Mexicantown, or even Boston-Edison. Detroit is completely flat, and riding downtown even from Sherwood Forest is feasible if you are in decent shape. If you stay near the Woodward corridor, you can have reasonable bus service on days riding is not what you want to do.

Here's the problem. You are likely to have a hard time finding a public school you [[and your wife, often a bigger issue) are willing to send your kids to, and while there is nowhere in metro Detroit that is as safe as Sweden, there is REALLY nowhere inside the city limits that is close to that safe. Even most Americans who are used to a relatively high level of violence and crime can't deal with Detroit, so it is possible you won't want to deal with it.

If that turns out to be the case, you might consider one of the nearer Grosse Pointes; they are close enough to bike downtown, you would likely find the schools acceptable, and there is some shopping.

[Gistok]

Welcome Zeyrek!

I have one piece of advice.... you can be thankful to the Swedish government back in the 1960s...

Back on the 3rd September 1967... Sweden followed the rest of continental Europe and everyone in your country started driving on the right side of the road starting that Sunday morning... [[after years of planning, public resistance, and bus conversions!)...

So now driving is going to be a lot easier for your family!

And you can forget about most [[but not all!!) of these road signs of Sweden.... [[courtesy of LEGO)....

[kryptonite]

Zeyrek - welcome to Detroit and to our state of Michigan. Please consider contacting some people who live in the area and do your research well before you move into Detroit. I love our city and lived most of my life in Detroit, but please keep in mind Detroit like most large American cities has problems with crime, urban decay, and poor schools. Detroit also has a problem with a lack of retail establishments which includes basics such as grocery stores.

I think it would benefit you to know the good and the bad aspects of the city before deciding to live somewhere close enough to Downtown to allow you to ride a bicycle to work. Keep in mind that you have a wife and children and safety could be an issue at times.

And if you see and learn enough about Detroit and still decide to live near Downtown then congratulations. There are many wonderful places to visit in Detroit such as our art institute, many theaters, sports arenas, restaurants, beautiful old buildings and churches, etc.

A friend of mine from Sweden lived in Detroit for several years before returning to Sweden. During the time he lived here I was personally robbed at gunpoint and my house was broken into. We were friends at the times of these events and he was very disturbed by the crimes and shocked. He was from the Lund area and crime was not a major issue for him and his wife in Sweden.

Even if you decide to live in the suburbs of Detroit you will find many nice places and Michigan is a beautiful state, my Swedish friend thought northern Michigan reminded him of central Sweden where his family owned a small farmhouse. Best wishes and welcome.

[jefferson78]

Sorry Bham, The problem I have with Oakland county is too many people.
It's great if you like being stuck in traffic. Dealing with crowds everywhere you go and
the me-first attitudes of a lot of suburbanites.
I prefer to live in a mostly rural area, where I can look out my window and not have to look into my neighbors living room. People tend to be a litle bit friendlier and you can actually breathe.
Granted, that may not be for everyone. Some people like the hustle and bustle of a urban area. Just isn't for me. I avoid Oakland county whenever possible.

[iheartthed]

It's funny how a foreigner has come and said he wants to move to the city of Detroit, for whatever reason, and a significant amount of this thread has been devoted to trying to persuade him to do otherwise. That in itself is not so problematic... If you think that he would not find what he expects to find in the city. But do you think he'll find what he states are his preferences in the places that have been suggested as alternative? I doubt you do. So why not instead suggest that he rethink coming to Metro Detroit period? [[If this is a legitimate noob, he's probably already rethinking it.)

[Islandman]

I'm curious as to how much advice he's received from personnel at his enginneering firm? I'd be more afraid of what his wife is gonna do to him.

[Bham1982]

Sorry Bham, The problem I have with Oakland county is too many people.
It's great if you like being stuck in traffic. Dealing with crowds everywhere you go and
the me-first attitudes of a lot of suburbanites.

I think you make reasonable points.

If I were to generalize, traffic in Oakland is worse, folks tend to be less considerate, and there's generally more passive-aggressive behavior.

That said, these differences are largely symptons of greater prosperity. There's more traffic/crap behavior because there's more people, jobs, wealth and commerce relative to other local areas.

[Occurrence]

I would strongly recommend you move to Oakland County.

I strongly recommend you DON'T move to Oakland County. Just the fact they elected that idiot sheriff is reason enough not to live there.

[bopcity]

If I were to generalize, traffic in Oakland is worse...

Traffic on thoroughfares like Telegraph and Northwestern might be maddening but the Woodward corridor's generally not that bad, is it? Anyone commuting from Novi's lost their mind.

Not that any of that's particularly relevant to the topic.

[davewindsor]

I wouldn't set your heart on living in the city. You'll be moving to the suburbs shortly after your wife and children get here. Your wife won't tolerate the lack of personal safety and the minimal ammenities found in the city. The city of Detroit is not like any first world city you've ever been to.

There's a reason most of the hipsters move out of the city as soon as they have children.

Also plan on needing 2 cars. Public transit is virtually non existent in southeastern michigan.

Well, I'm sure the city will ever become a first world city after comments like that. If he takes a $100K a year job in the city as an engineer and lives here, an extra grand goes into the city coffers from income tax, he occupies an otherwise empty property that pays taxes to the city instead of going to tax sale, he spends money on local businesses that all contribute to raising the wealth of the city. Heck, he may even decide to stay here and buy an empty historical mansion and fix it up instead of it becoming another parking lot.

Thanks for being a part of the problem.

[Bham1982]

Traffic on thoroughfares like Telegraph and Northwestern might be maddening but the Woodward corridor's generally not that bad, is it? Anyone commuting from Novi's lost their mind.

Not that any of that's particularly relevant to the topic.

I think Woodward Corridor has pretty bad traffic.

Try to drive Maple through downtown Birmingham during rush hour. How many light changes does it take to get through Maple/Southfield Rd?

It's about as slow-moving as any street in MI.

Woodward itself seems somewhat better than Telegraph. At the least, it seems to always move, even during the height of rush.

Orchard Lake, IMO, is the worst surface arterial. Horrible potholes, terrible drivers and nonstop congestion.

If traffic congestion is a major factor in locational decisionmaking, then move south of 8 Mile. Almost all the roads clear up south of Baseline. Or, at the least, move south of I-696.

[Bham1982]

Thanks for being a part of the problem.

No one is going to move anywhere based on a random internet post. Folks are offering their opinions, nothing more. Sorry if you don't like folks' observations.

If the poster decides to live in Detroit, good for him.

[bopcity]

I think Woodward Corridor has pretty bad traffic. Try to drive Maple through downtown Birmingham during rush hour ... It's about as slow-moving as any street in MI.

Rarely venture that far north, nosebleed's tend to occur at high altitudes.

Orchard Lake, IMO, is the worst surface arterial. Horrible potholes, terrible drivers and nonstop congestion.

No argument there ...

[Parkguy]

My house in Rosedale Park has a walkscore of 66, which is pretty decent. The neighborhood as a whole has a walkscore of 60. North Rosedale: 66. What we need more of: bistro-style cafes and coffeehouses.

[EastsideAl]

I have no idea where our original poster should live, since so much depends on personal circumstances. Although I'd recommend Lafayette Park, the southern end of Indian Village/West Village or Jefferson apartments, Grosse Pointe Park, or the northern part of Midtown around Wayne & Cultural Center.

But you really need to come here yourself to see what you'd feel comfortable with. As many here have said, this is not really a place comparable to any European city, and it is probably quite different from any city you've ever been to.

[[Edit: took out a bunch of stuff that wouldn't be helpful to the original poster that I wrote in response to the insulting nasty crap of the "oh, you can't have children in the city!" crowd. Suffice to say that I, and pretty much all of my relatives, including some who are currently still children, were raised in the city and survived - even had reasonably successful adulthoods. Which would be a miracle, I guess, if there weren't thousands of others like us.)

[jt1]

I agree completely, OC IS THAT AWESOME. I'm damn fortunate to live there, despite LBP and our Sheriff.
But having said that, where is your smartass remark for those who are singing Detroit's praises just as loudly?

There is a difference. The people singing Detroit's praises are essentially saying what is good about Detroit. People like the poster I responded to are essentially saying OC is awesome and Detroit sucks. Subtle but important difference. Plus the poster I was responding to pretty much jumps in every thread about where to live emphatically stating that there is very little, if any viable place to live in Detroit. The non-sense gets really old.

Hopefully, one day I'll work really hard, save my pennies and be able to afford to move out of Detroit into the paradise that is OC. Granted that's wishful thinking since it is clear that anyone in Detroit is either too poor and ignorant to move out or is a naive hipster.

[ndavies]

The Original poster is moving his family to the other side of the world. He is already taking on a huge amount of risk. The man is expecting a European city. Detroit is nowhere near functional enough to come close to his expectations. The inner ring suburbs are the closest thing the metro region has to what he's looking for.

If he were coming alone I would wish him the best of luck with his choices. Bringing his family in is a completely different story. There is a reason 99% of the hipster move out of the city as soon as they have kids. They all come in with the best of intentions and then the day to day aggravation takes it's toll. They move back to the suburbs they came from.

As someone who has made a similar move from Europe, I came from the UK, I know he's going to find Detroit severely lacking in the things he needs. What happens if he moves his family to the city and they find they are not safe here. How long do you think he will remain in the country, let alone the city?

[jolla]

Living in Detroit with children and biking and walking is possible. What's not possible in my opinion is the public school in Detroit.

[gazhekwe]

Speaking of traffic, I do live in Oakland County, just two miles north of Detroit. I just spent a week in Boston/Cambridge, and guess what? We have no idea what traffic is here in SE Michigan. Really, we don't. On Saturday afternoon in Cambridge, traffic was wall to wall as far as I could see both up and down the road. It was moving, just barely. It took 25 minutes to go three miles from Cambridge to Medford. Turning left into or out of a side street took at least three minutes waiting for a break, and then we got out because some nice people let us get through the stream of traffic. If we ever have traffic like that around here, something is wrong somewhere, an accident, lights screwed up or some other blockage.

[mwilbert]

By Boston standards, metro Detroit has no traffic.

[Det_ard]

Living in Detroit with children and biking and walking is possible. What's not possible in my opinion is the public school in Detroit.

Disagree. There's a relatively small group of families living and public-schooling in Detroit that know which few schools are the good ones, on par with the better suburban schools. Those schools are good because the self-selection process ensures that 95% of the parents are doing what they should do with respect to educating their kids. They're doing it, it's possible, you just have to hook into the educationally-minded Detroiter network and you'll figure out how it can be done. Unfortunately the vast masses are still stuck with their not-so-good to downright terrible neighborhood schools.

Who knows what kind of urbanity the OP expects or what he already knows of Detroit. That's a big variable. My advice:

• visit Detroit and suburbs, tour potential areas and talk to residents
• rent for a year in your area of choice
• consider buying if it's working for you, or relocate if not.

You can do the urban family thing in Detroit but it's very different from other major cities, in ways good and bad. It's an individual decision as to if it works for you.