Opinion of Charles Pugh

**R8RBOB** · November-16-11, 12:55 PM

For the record, I did not vote for Pugh because I knew like Monica Conyers he would get in because of his name. I was disappointed that Detroiters would by default make him the council president like they made Conyers the President Pro Tem.

I just watched the news at 12 and WDIV had an interview with Pugh in which they asked him what he wanted Bing to say this evening and he said he wants to hear layoffs, cuts which is fine and dandy if to shore up assets but you don't make it sound like it's no big deal and that is what he did. Everyone knows that Detroit has to make tough choices but there is way to do things and when you are a politician you really have to know what to say on TV.

Maybe Pugh thinks that a majority of Detroit workers are suburbanites. Maybe they are. After all, Engler and the legislature got rid of residency requirements and many city workers fled the city in name only. [[they were already gone physically) Pain is coming and many will feel that pain. What they don't need is some condescending ex-newsman/council president get on television and make it seem like it's no big deal to lose your job especially when the council president does not have to worry about his job being lost for another two years.

**Detroitnerd** · November-16-11, 01:41 PM

Rather than some faux emoting on television, perhaps it's better for people to see Pugh in this light -- in the long run...

**Gistok** · November-16-11, 02:06 PM

Perhaps my impression of him is clouded by the fact that I met him at one of the Forum Picnic's, and had a lengthy discussion with him. But I think that in some respects he's getting a bum rap. Now granted his financial situation bears a lot of valid scrutiny. But I don't see him as a condescending councilperson. Yes he stood up to the suburban McMansion owning Detroit preachers, and I actually applauded him for having the balls to do that.

These are tough times we are in... and being "Mr. Nice" really isn't going to cut it during this juncture in the city's future.

He hasn't been anywhere as bad as Monica/Barbara Rose and Martha.... that's for sure. Perhaps he wouldn't be as criticized if he didn't come in 1st place for council. It wouldn't have hurt had Kenneth Cockrel stayed on as the President, and have the newbies learn the ropes for a few years.

He may not be the best... but we've definitely had worst on council.

Again... I know his own financial house plays against him... but if he's got money problems... at least it appears he's not lining his pockets with city contracts.

That's just my 2 cents [[and this is a subject I'm not an expert on)... perhaps more knowledgeable people on the subject can enlighten us on this thread.... [[there seems to be no shortage of them on the Bob Ficano and Turkia Mullin topics

)....

**gnome** · November-16-11, 02:33 PM

I think he is a petulant man-child.

I don't see him as a leader, but a preener, a poseur, an ill-mannered peacock.

Other than that, he's ok.

**antongast** · November-16-11, 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

He hasn't been anywhere as bad as Monica/Barbara Rose and Martha.... that's for sure.

If this how Pugh's supporters defend him, I'm left to wonder why anyone would even go to the trouble of criticizing the guy. Anything further you could say against him is just piling on.

**R8RBOB** · November-16-11, 02:52 PM

Originally Posted by gnome

I think he is a petulant man-child.

I don't see him as a leader, but a preener, a poseur, an ill-mannered peacock.

Other than that, he's ok.

I can agree with this. If Pugh thinks talking tough makes him a leader, he is in for a rude awakening. This is why I hate how the city council president is appointed based on most votes. What a joke!!!

**antongast** · November-16-11, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by R8RBOB

This is why I hate how the city council president is appointed based on most votes. What a joke!!!

Actually, that's no longer the case. Pugh is the last council president to be selected in that way. Perhaps you remember that new charter we voted on last week?

**detroitsgwenivere** · November-16-11, 04:28 PM

Having a beer with Pugh is fun. He's a really nice guy who is articulate, intellegent, and cares about the city.

But so are a lot of other people.

**firstandten** · November-16-11, 05:46 PM

To be honest, I need to see more before I can come up with an opinion. I know he's a personable guy who's approachable. I was not happy to see him be council president at least in his first term and I'm glad thats been changed. I wonder however how would people's perception of him would be if he was your garden variety community activist trying to get a foothold into Detroit politics rather than a well known TV anchor. The reason we need to ask these questions is I feel he will in time run for mayor

I think his money issues should be a cause for concern, but not necessarily a deal breaker as far as his political future is concerned. Bottom line I want to see more before I form a opinion of him as a leader in this city.

**animatedmartian** · November-16-11, 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by firstandten

To be honest, I need to see more before I can come up with an opinion. I know he's a personable guy who's approachable. I was not happy to see him be council president at least in his first term and I'm glad thats been changed. I wonder however how would people's perception of him would be if he was your garden variety community activist trying to get a foothold into Detroit politics rather than a well known TV anchor. The reason we need to ask these questions is I feel he will in time run for mayor

I think his money issues should be a cause for concern, but not necessarily a deal breaker as far as his political future is concerned. Bottom line I want to see more before I form a opinion of him as a leader in this city.

Out of curiosity I looked him up on Youtube. The guy certainly has people appeal and even Tyree Guyton said that he could make a good mayor. I agree that his personal financial management is one of his flaws, but there are Detroit politicians who have been faaaaaaaaaaaaaaar worse. And to compare him to them seems unfair IMO.

*Note: the audio is pretty annoying... at least for me anyway.

Also the way he explains the budget seems pretty straightforward and honest.

Of course these are from his Youtube account, so they're going to try to show him in the best light, but he seems pretty legit to me. Even if you disagree with him, he doesn't seem contrived like most politicians. If he manages to get his campaign mess together it'll be interesting to see how he'll run for mayor.

**Thames** · November-16-11, 07:16 PM

I don’t trust him.

When Mildred Gaddis was on TV, she had “meet the candidate” type shows . She was charging $1000 to be a part of those shows. You can’t do that. He is [[was) a journalist. If anybody knew that was unethical, he did. He did it anyway and didn’t come clean until he got called out for it.

When he won the election, he immediately hired a family member for a high paying job on his staff. That’s right out of Kwame’s playbook of the friends and family plan.

He also immediately [[after the election) started a “civic fund” [[ another move out of Kwame’s playbook) and said it would be “completely transparent”. However, he refused to make the donor list public.

Then he crashed a city owned car and was less than forthcoming about the accident. Another "smells like Kwame" moment.

Most recently, it has been revealed that he hasn’t filed annual campaign reports and it appears he’s been using his campaign account as a slush fund. To top it off, he is blaming someone else for the withdrawals.

He was a diehard Kwame supporter. To the bitter end.

Finally, his personal finances are a mess and they have been for years.

Obviously, he doesn’t know how to manage money, and he never will. How can he be trusted to manage the city’s money?

**firstandten** · November-16-11, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by Thames

I don’t trust him.

When Mildred Gaddis was on TV, she had “meet the candidate” type shows . She was charging $1000 to be a part of those shows. You can’t do that. He is [[was) a journalist. If anybody knew that was unethical, he did. He did it anyway and didn’t come clean until he got called out for it.

When he won the election, he immediately hired a family member for a high paying job on his staff. That’s right out of Kwame’s playbook of the friends and family plan.

He also immediately [[after the election) started a “civic fund” [[ another move out of Kwame’s playbook) and said it would be “completely transparent”. However, he refused to make the donor list public.

Then he crashed a city owned car and was less than forthcoming about the accident. Another "smells like Kwame" moment.

Most recently, it has been revealed that he hasn’t filed annual campaign reports and it appears he’s been using his campaign account as a slush fund. To top it off, he is blaming someone else for the withdrawals.

He was a diehard Kwame supporter. To the bitter end.

Finally, his personal finances are a mess and they have been for years.

Obviously, he doesn’t know how to manage money, and he never will. How can he be trusted to manage the city’s money?

I am going to make note of your points and see how over time Pugh responds to this.

The manner and truthfulness of his answers will give me my opinion of him.

**Hypestyles** · November-16-11, 07:59 PM

..he led a push for city council to get more direct management power over city services.. I don't think it happened with the charter commission revisions.. I'm not thrilled with council apparently getting the legal nod to design districts.. in an interview, Pugh said once he would like to see downtown split up three ways. I'm not sure what the long-term impact of that would be..
I wonder if he'll have another "meet Pugh" get-together like he did in, September I think it was..

**Scottathew** · November-16-11, 08:36 PM

One does need to show much tact when talking about people taking cuts or getting laid off. Pugh and Bing are right though about needing cuts.

I have very little respect for Pugh, who has a hard time paying his bills despite bringing good paychecks.

Pugh doesn't know how to balance his own budget, he shouldn't be touching Detroit's.

**SWMAP** · November-16-11, 08:54 PM

A friend worked for Fox 2 and said once: the station was awfully glad and relieved when he moved on of his own free will. I took it to mean then that he is a primadonna- but it could have been a reference to his being unstable - anything that would make the bosses of a broadcast personality nervous. I for one don't see how he, with no other experience, could think he could run the City. It boggles my mind.

**Gistok** · November-17-11, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by antongast

If this how Pugh's supporters defend him, I'm left to wonder why anyone would even go to the trouble of criticizing the guy. Anything further you could say against him is just piling on.

Please spare me your lecture... Apparently you didn't read ALL of my post... such as the part where I don't consider myself an expert on him or the job he's done.

And if I were defending him outright, I would have done way better than the MonCon, Barbara-Rose and Martha Reeves comparisons.

I would have included the fact that with all his financial troubles, he's never filed for bankruptcy, something that people of much greater stature than Pugh have done... such as Henry Ford, Walt Disney, Donald Trump, P.T. Barnum, Charles Goodyear, Mark Twain, Oscar Wilde, Henry Heinz, Milton Hershey and even Thomas Jefferson.

So I will go back and restate my ORIGINAL position that I don't know enough about Charles Pugh to make an informed decision on his performance one way or another....

**antongast** · November-17-11, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

Please spare me your lecture...

I don't think "lecture" means what you think it means.

**Gistok** · November-17-11, 12:39 PM

.... the same can be said for the phrase "preaching to the choir".....

**R8RBOB** · November-17-11, 12:40 PM

Can I add Gary Brown to the list? After his clown act this morning on the news he may be worse than Pugh.

**Motor City Sam** · November-17-11, 12:50 PM

My opinion of Mr. Pugh is that he is just a smaller, less politically connected version of Kwame. His immediate hiring of a family member, his suspicious car accident, his awarding of raises to his staff in the midst of a financial calamity, his disregard of campaign finance rules, his apparent lie in blaming someone else for the misuse of the campaign cash card, all point to a guy who is just a federal indictment waiting to happen.

I also don't see the "intelligence" in him that some people speak of. We've got to stop complimenting people on their intelligence just because they can string a few sentences together.

**Gistok** · November-17-11, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by antongast

I don't think "lecture" means what you think it means.

Sorry Antongast... had a bad day... didn't mean to be snarky.... but I'm OK now... just found a bag of WWII nickels hidden in the basement fruit cellar... and what that means is "SILVER" nickels... about $1.90 each at today's silver price!

**detroitsgwenivere** · November-17-11, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by Motor City Sam

We've got to stop complimenting people on their intelligence just because they can string a few sentences together.

Or maybe we need to stop expecting other people to make uninformed opinions...

**detroitsgwenivere** · November-17-11, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by Gistok

what that means is "SILVER" nickels... about $1.90 each at today's silver price!

Hey! Good find!

I found 2 silver quarters at the laundrymat once. I check all my change now..

**7miledog** · November-17-11, 03:45 PM

Pugh is a Kwame retread and ardent supporter. If you remember during the Hendrix/Kilpatrick debate in '05 [[seems like a lifetime ago), when Kilpatrick closed with the zinger that "neither [he] nor [his] family has ever been in trouble with the law" [[boy was he ever wrong there!) in reference to Hendrix's son's little run in from the previous night, well that little tidbit of info came from good ole Pugh. Allegedly, Pugh's then boyfriend was related to the Hendrix son's ex-girlfriend who filed the police complaint in Ypsi. I'd be afraid, very afraid, if Pugh ever won the Mayor's race.

**Woodward's Cousin** · November-17-11, 04:10 PM

I wonder what ever happened to Rafael ? Anyone who was a stalwart supporter of Kilpatrick through two elections [[2001 and 2005 ) and on into 2008 is seriously suspect in my book. And that includes Dave Bing and many of those who consider themselves to be the Leaders of the Detroit Business community. You did not need to be a genius not to be fooled by Kilpatrick.