Some people don't have a worry in the world - John Engler's 6 figure state pension

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 03:07 AM

http://www.detnews.com/article/20111107/METRO/111070361

No wonder Engler is so big, he's eating filet mignon every night. Must be nice to draw those huge pensions. Mine is pocket change compared to some of those. Who says life ain't fair? In light of this, I sure hope the Supreme Court over turns the pension tax. It's a lot of double-dipping going on with our legislators isn't it?

**CassTechGrad** · November-12-11, 09:15 AM

Along with pension reform, the courts should order that former governor Grandhold return the salary we paid her. In the Michigan Jennifer Granholm governed for eight long years, the list of her painful failures that she inflicted on us is too long to list. On her watch, the state's rankingin per capita GDP plummeted to 41st place from 24th, Detroit's population shriveled to its lowest level since 1910, and Michigan earned the dubious distinction of being the only state to suffer a net out-migration this past decade.

Ms. Granholm's tax record would include the$1.4 billion tax increase in business and personal taxes in 2007, not to mention the tax hike she tried to inflict on her way out. She is responsible for the loss of an astounding 630,000 Michigan jobs over her tenure.

Ms. Granholm's is just one of many politicians who never lose the charming faith that they know best how to spend other people's money. If you liked Gov.Granholm's Michigan, you'll love President Obama's America.

**313WX** · November-12-11, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by CassTechGrad

Along with pension reform, the courts should order that former governor Grandhold return the salary we paid her. In the Michigan Jennifer Granholm governed for eight long years, the list of her painful failures that she inflicted on us is too long to list. On her watch, the state's rankingin per capita GDP plummeted to 41st place from 24th, Detroit's population shriveled to its lowest level since 1910, and Michigan earned the dubious distinction of being the only state to suffer a net out-migration this past decade.

Ms. Granholm's tax record would include the$1.4 billion tax increase in business and personal taxes in 2007, not to mention the tax hike she tried to inflict on her way out. She is responsible for the loss of an astounding 630,000 Michigan jobs over her tenure.

Ms. Granholm's is just one of many politicians who never lose the charming faith that they know best how to spend other people's money. If you liked Gov.Granholm's Michigan, you'll love President Obama's America.

It's scary that a supposed Cash Tech graduate would post something this loony.

**jerrytimes** · November-12-11, 10:01 AM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

http://www.detnews.com/article/20111107/METRO/111070361

No wonder Engler is so big, he's eating filet mignon every night. Must be nice to draw those huge pensions. Mine is pocket change compared to some of those. Who says life ain't fair? In light of this, I sure hope the Supreme Court over turns the pension tax. It's a lot of double-dipping going on with our legislators isn't it?

And Blanchard gets a nice pension and so does Granholm. Nice how you single out the Republican.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

And Blanchard gets a nice pension and so does Granholm. Nice how you single out the Republican.

I'm calling all of them on the carpet. Get a freakin clue. Makes no difference, all of them are stealing money.

**jerrytimes** · November-12-11, 10:09 AM

Englers is so big because it's two different pensions put into one. Every state politician gets one and it's a joke, but don't act like its just a Republican thing. [[D)Jim Blanchard gets $51,634 annually, [[D)John Cherry gets $99,437, [[D)Arthur Miller gets $107,747, [[D)Debbie Stabenow gets $52,438, [[R) Tim Walberg gets $54,503 ect ect.... the list goes on and on, both parties eating away at our state.

**jerrytimes** · November-12-11, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

I'm calling all of them on the carpet. Get a freakin clue. Makes no difference, all of them are stealing money.

Really, cause what you wrote was only a jab at Engler like hes the only government slime taking our money.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

Really, cause what you wrote was only a jab at Engler like hes the only government slime taking our money.

His pension is one of the highest, so if you want to go there, fine.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

Englers is so big because it's two different pensions put into one. Every state politician gets one and it's a joke, but don't act like its just a Republican thing. [[D)Jim Blanchard gets $51,634 annually, [[D)John Cherry gets $99,437, [[D)Arthur Miller gets $107,747, [[D)Debbie Stabenow gets $52,438, [[R) Tim Walberg gets $54,503 ect ect.... the list goes on and on, both parties eating away at our state.

Why are you so defensive towards the Repubs? Are you one? LOL Really wasn't picking on "fat boy" , his picture was the first one shown to the right of the article, if you managed to look. All parties are getting over on the public's dime. Also. thx for adding John Engler to my heading to make it look like it is all about him.

**Signman** · November-12-11, 10:23 AM

By the way, what is your pocket change pension? Is it a government one?

**Bigb23** · November-12-11, 10:23 AM

If you liked Gov.Granholm's Michigan, you'll love President Obama's America.

Oh - for the good old days under the Bush royalty. Three wars started for Saudi interests, trillions spent so far, thousands of lives given for the ungrateful, millions of jobs lost overseas, the economy that tanked, and homes worth less than the note, so let's beat up on Granholm. In her eight years, she should have turned around the country - let alone the state.

**jerrytimes** · November-12-11, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

Why are you so defensive towards the Repubs? Are you one? LOL Really wasn't picking on "fat boy" , his picture was the first on shown to the right of the article, if you managed to look. All parties are getting over on the public's dime. Also. thx for adding John Engler to my heading to make it look like it is all about him.

I sure am a Republican. Very happy that I have my views as well, but politicians from both parties currently are jokes. See, I am a person that will vote for a Democrat if that person is the better candidate, unlike yourself I'm sure. I didn't add Engler to anything, so I don't know where you got that from. My whole point was that your article that you posted had a headline that was singling him out when you should have posted something along the lines calling each and every Michigan politician out that is receiving pensions like these.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by Signman

By the way, what is your pocket change pension? Is it a government one?

Public, like most people. And people wonder why the state is broke.

**jerrytimes** · November-12-11, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by Bigb23

[COLOR=black][FONT=Arial][SIZE=3]

Oh - for the good old days under the Bush royalty. Three wars started for Saudi interests, trillions spent so far, thousands of lives given for the ungrateful, millions of jobs lost overseas, the economy that tanked, and homes worth less than the note, so let's beat up on Granholm. In her eight years, she should have turned around the country - let alone the state.

The state did tank pretty bad under her reign, while not all her fault she didn't do much to keep business here or to attract new companies. While the Bush years weren't great by any means, unemployment was a lot less and my house was worth a lot more, although that's not something that just the president affects, but the house and senate do as well.

**jerrytimes** · November-12-11, 10:30 AM

Originally Posted by Bigb23

[COLOR=black][FONT=Arial][SIZE=3]

Oh - for the good old days under the Bush royalty. Three wars started for Saudi interests, trillions spent so far, thousands of lives given for the ungrateful, millions of jobs lost overseas, the economy that tanked, and homes worth less than the note, so let's beat up on Granholm. In her eight years, she should have turned around the country - let alone the state.

Jobs lost overseas thanks to NAFTA. Wait, who signed that into law? hmmm.....

**Bigb23** · November-12-11, 10:41 AM

Jobs lost overseas thanks to NAFTA. Wait, who signed that into law? hmmm.....

NAFTA was signed by President George H.W. Bush, Mexican President Salinas, and Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney in 1992. It was ratified by the legislatures of the three countries in 1993. The House approved it by 234 to 200 on November 17 and the Senate by 60 to 38 on November 20. It was signed into law by President Bill Clinton on December 8, 1993 and entered force January 1, 1994. Although it was signed by President Bush, it was a priority of President Clinton's, and its passage is considered one of his first successes. [[Source: History.com, NAFTA Signed into Law, December 8, 1993.
How Was NAFTA Started?:
The impetus for NAFTA actually began with President Ronald Regan, who campaigned on a North American common market. In 1984, Congress passed the Trade and Tariff Act. This is important because it gave the President "fast-track" authority to negotiate free trade agreements, while only allowing Congress the ability to approve or disapprove, not change negotiating points. Canadian Prime Minister Mulroney agreed with Reagan to begin negotiations for the Canada-U.S. Free Trade Agreement, which was signed in 1988, went into effect in 1989 and is now suspended due to NAFTA. [[Source: NaFina, NAFTA Timeline)

http://useconomy.about.com/od/tradep...TA_History.htm

**detroittrader** · November-12-11, 03:11 PM

It should be just as easy to legislate ending welfare payments to these former politicians as it was to end them for poor folks.

**MikeyinBrooklyn** · November-12-11, 04:30 PM

[QUOTE=Cincinnati_Kid;283889]http://www.detnews.com/article/20111107/METRO/111070361

No wonder Engler is so big, he's eating filet mignon every night. QUOTE]

Hey, Engler was a chubbo-American long before he had money! [[Note: John Engler and I share both a political orientation and approximate size). I do STRONGLY favor not having elected officials recieve pensions. They should be paid for their work, but only while in office. Additionally, I think all people who qualify for a public pension, should ONLY be eligible for one pension [[naturally the higher one). I wish Engler would donate it back. But this kind of thing isn't limited to John Engler: Jim Blanchard is eligible for a Governor's pension, diplomatic pension, and Congressional pension. Most politicians who get elected to multiple positions over their careers collect partial or full pensions for each job they held. It's just wrong.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 05:27 PM

[QUOTE=MikeyinBrooklyn;283971]

Originally Posted by Cincinnati_Kid

http://www.detnews.com/article/20111107/METRO/111070361

No wonder Engler is so big, he's eating filet mignon every night. QUOTE]

Hey, Engler was a chubbo-American long before he had money! [[Note: John Engler and I share both a political orientation and approximate size). I do STRONGLY favor not having elected officials recieve pensions. They should be paid for their work, but only while in office. Additionally, I think all people who qualify for a public pension, should ONLY be eligible for one pension [[naturally the higher one). I wish Engler would donate it back. But this kind of thing isn't limited to John Engler: Jim Blanchard is eligible for a Governor's pension, diplomatic pension, and Congressional pension. Most politicians who get elected to multiple positions over their careers collect partial or full pensions for each job they held. It's just wrong.

I agree, and people wonder why Mich is broke. All these exhorbant pension payouts don't help. Most of them don't deserve the generous handouts they are receiving, for running the state into the ground. yet, they want to tax public pensions starting Jan 1st. I hope the Supreme Court over turns it. Everything is being put on the working man's back. It's not right.

**313WX** · November-12-11, 05:30 PM

The reason Michigan's broke is because the resources are spread too thin [[usually for a redundant reason) AND tax receipts are low due to the depressed economy since we've been so independent on very few industries versus diversifying our economy.

**firstandten** · November-12-11, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by jerrytimes

The state did tank pretty bad under her reign, while not all her fault she didn't do much to keep business here or to attract new companies. While the Bush years weren't great by any means, unemployment was a lot less and my house was worth a lot more, although that's not something that just the president affects, but the house and senate do as well.

By no means do I blame Granholm for all of Michigan's problems. What happen to Michigan was going to happen, no matter who was in office because most was beyond the governors control. I fault her for politics as usual when we needed a more visionary person, a think outside of the box person. Granholm was too much of a stick a finger up in the air to see which way the wind was blowing type of politican

Also the reason why the Bush years were so good for you was because he was able to fuel a bubble economy with massive debt which masked the fact there was no real growth until it could no longer substain itself.

**MikeyinBrooklyn** · November-12-11, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by firstandten

By no means do I blame Granholm for all of Michigan's problems. .

I agree. I am no fan of JG, but honestly Michigan's fiscal and economic woes are structural, and many different problems had been compounding them for ages. She does deserve some blame, but not most of it. Michigan wasn't really friendly to job creators for years. You can blame or credit various governors depending on your POV, but the reality is no one really pushed reform at the level needed. You'll note: Romney, Milliken, Blanchard, Engler, and Granholm all served 2 or more terms. This demonstrates, I think, that no one made choices tough enough to make them unpopular enough to lose. Of them, only Blanchard lost one, and it was for a third term. I would love a governor [[I neither love nor hate Snyder at this point; in his first year it is still too early to pass judgment in my opinion) who made tough choices, popularity be damned. From my partisan perspective, Engler came closest, but didn't go far enough in making the state friendly to business, including the entrepreneurs we are already here. Real growth will not come from high profile tours of other countries to lure a factory to be opened here. It will come when someone in Detroit or somewhere else in Michigan can have a good idea and open a business, and not be driven out of business or out of Michigan by a combination of taxes and regulation. Note that food truck vendor who made 60 trips to the city to get the permits to open. How silly and unproductive is that? For a single food vending truck! Enough to cause some people to not bother, I suspect.

**Cincinnati_Kid** · November-12-11, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

The reason Michigan's broke is because the resources are spread too thin [[usually for a redundant reason) AND tax receipts are low due to the depressed eocnomhy since we've been so independent on very few industries versus diversifying our economy.

Oh, and that too.

**ordinary** · November-12-11, 08:06 PM

I guess people vote their pocketbooks. I remember Engler in a favorable light because when he was in office, my propery taxes went way down. I know I have saved thousands of dollars.

**DetroitPlanner** · November-12-11, 10:43 PM

Originally Posted by ordinary

I guess people vote their pocketbooks. I remember Engler in a favorable light because when he was in office, my propery taxes went way down. I know I have saved thousands of dollars.

Sure your property taxes went down, but sales taxes increased 50 percent. Buy a modest $15,000 car and your sales tax went from $600 to $900! Just think about all the stuff you buy in a year. He did several other tax increases too such as the gas tax, it went up 30 percent.

He also bonded the hell out of everything he built. The bonds started to come due in earnest the year after he got out, leaving a huge deficit at the time we were going into a slow-down. But hey at least all of the colleges had new buildings... and the only way to pay for them was to increase tuition.