Street Lights Out on Second Ave. Petition

**French777** · October-30-11, 09:42 PM

Last weekend, 4 WSU students were robbed in the area around Second Avenue and Hancock. Along the route, from W. Canfield to Warren Avenue, none of the street lights have been working at all since the start of the academic year. I started a petition to collect signatures and testimonials from people who are upset about the high amount of non-operational streetlights in the area, and I am planning on sending them to the City of Detroit's Public Lighting Dept.

If anyone has tips on how to pursue this, most effectively or has any questions, feel free to send me an email at midtown.streetlights@gmail.com

Thank you.

**gthomas** · October-30-11, 10:03 PM

Yes, I couldn't agree more. I live on Second Av. It's dark on Cass, Second, and Third Av. All the residential streetlights are out too in the area. WOODWARD is so bright though..? We need a new approach to lighting in this city. There's only one lightpost per block that either out or have low voltage.Midtown has tons of creative people, let's think of a plan to light up our streets throughout Midtown.

**Autoracks** · October-31-11, 10:20 AM

ive had 2 cars stolen on 2nd

**Downtown Lady** · October-31-11, 10:39 AM

Hi French -- so glad to see you taking action on this!

My suggestion would be to start an online petition at change.org ---> http://www.change.org/start-a-petition

Once you have that started, you can post the link here and fellow DYes members can sign it electronically, which could help you get quite a few signatures.

from the website:
Change. org is a non-partisan organization that empowers anyone, anywhere to start and win campaigns for social change.

Every day, people who start petitions on Change.org win meaningful change using the most easy-to-use & powerful grassroots organizing tools on the web.

**Cooper** · October-31-11, 11:58 AM

I would suggest several strategies:

First, collect as many signatures as possible, and in addition to sending them to the Lighting Department, send them to each City Council member, the mayor's office, and every major media outlet.

Second, have everyone who signs the petition call 311 and report the problem individually to the lighting department. In theory, they keep a running tally of complaints and should prioritize yours.

Third, get in touch with intermediaries. Agencies like the Wayne State Police and Midtown, Inc., are more likely to be heard by city officials. Present your signatures to them and get them to agitate on your behalf.

**313WX** · October-31-11, 06:58 PM

Fact of the matter is the money simply isn't there to have lights on everywhere. We're still trying to operate infrastructure for a city that should support 2 Million People with only 700,000, half of which don't even pay taxes.

So if the lights at Second and Hancock come back on, what area will now have to suffer without their lights? 7 Mile & Schoenherr? Vernor & Clark? Joy & Schaefer? Then what happens if something dangerous happens in these areas due to no lighting?

**Islandman** · November-01-11, 01:34 AM

Woodward is not any better when it comes to public lighting. It looks brighter because of all of the retail and larger traffic volume. One would think pedestrian heavy areas such as Second would be a priority, but when they can't even keep the most famous road in Michigan lit, it's not that big of a surprise.

Ravine · November-01-11, 02:09 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Fact of the matter is the money simply isn't there to have lights on everywhere. We're still trying to operate infrastructure for a city that should support 2 Million People with only 700,000, half of which don't even pay taxes.

So if the lights at Second and Hancock come back on, what area will now have to suffer without their lights? 7 Mile & Schoenherr? Vernor & Clark? Joy & Schaefer? Then what happens if something dangerous happens in these areas due to no lighting?

That's not French777's problem. French777's problem is the area he or she named, which is, I assume, the reason for the petition.
The fact that there is an over-all problem, city-wide, is neither a thing which French777 can address nor a reason for French777 to suffer in silence and not bother to act in defense of the area where French777 resides.
The city makes good and goddam sure that the routes heading in to the casinos are cleared of snow, and heavily salted, during the winter.
Detroit has few areas into which folks are moving. The authorities might want to think about protecting those areas with some of the same zeal they show toward salting Trumbull Avenue between Grand River and Lafayette.

**Dexlin** · November-01-11, 03:13 AM

Bingo, Ravine. French can petition for attention for his neighborhood, and everyone is free to do the same for their own little corner of town. It's called democracy. That's why we have neighborhood associations and organizations.

French, along with the other contact people gave you, I'd also offer the The University Cultural Center Association or whatever they are calling it, now:

info@detroitmidtown.com

313-420-6000

**313WX** · November-01-11, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by Ravine

That's not French777's problem. French777's problem is the area he or she named, which is, I assume, the reason for the petition.
The fact that there is an over-all problem, city-wide, is neither a thing which French777 can address nor a reason for French777 to suffer in silence and not bother to act in defense of the area where French777 resides.
The city makes good and goddam sure that the routes heading in to the casinos are cleared of snow, and heavily salted, during the winter.
Detroit has few areas into which folks are moving. The authorities might want to think about protecting those areas with some of the same zeal they show toward salting Trumbull Avenue between Grand River and Lafayette.

It would only make sense to take special care of areas where your tourist will trek and busy thoroughfares and where more people for the time being actually live. Everybody can petition and protest and vote and whine for "me-me-me" all they want. But again, the fact of the matter the resources aren't there to give every "me-me-me" want they want. Some areas are going to have to go without, which is not fair nor democratic since every taxpayer in all 143 sq. mi of the city pays the same relative amount of taxes, but in Detroit that's just the way it is. You can't just make the moeny to satisfy everyone appear out of the thin blue sky [[well, there are OTHER ways, but they're even less popular and that's another political discussion). I would like my route in and out of work, Davison from Van Dyke to where it transitions to an expressway, to be lit at night [[ESPECIALLY since it is a busier thoroughfare than Second will ever be anytime soon). I try my best not to stop at any lights along the routes because of it. But I know the reason they're off is because the city can't no longer afford to turn them on and I deal with it for the time being.

**DetroitPlanner** · November-01-11, 08:56 AM

Take matters into your own hands have the landlords light up your buildings like Christmas trees. Go to Walmart and buy some cheap LED/solar lights and masking tape them to the light poles, that would be a sorry sight if the DPL would send folks out to remove them without fixing the lights!

**Russix** · November-01-11, 08:59 AM

When the city fails one of the densest and fasting growing neighborhoods in the city[[Lights have been out for more than 6 months), its time to turn to the neighborhood association for solutions. We already have a redunant[[and actually responsive) police force. Why not buy a small bucket truck and pay DPL workers to come fix our lights on the weekends?

**antongast** · November-01-11, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

I would like my route in and out of work, Davison from Van Dyke to where it transitions to an expressway, to be lit at night [[ESPECIALLY since it is a busier thoroughfare than Second will ever be anytime soon).

Davison probably carries more cars, but I'm pretty sure Second has more foot traffic. The robbery victims near WSU have been pedestrians, not motorists.

Then again, based on the WSU campuswatch emails from 10/24 and 10/31, there was one robbery on Hancock, two on Cass, one on Third, and one on Second, so I'm not entirely convinced that fixing the lights on Second is going to stop the robberies in the area.

**Danny** · November-01-11, 09:36 AM

Here's my advise! Don't go out in the ghettohoods of Detroit at night! If you do pack your gun, a knife, mace and a air horn in your pocket. Make sure its license for your own protection.

**French777** · November-01-11, 10:17 AM

First off, Thank you all very much for your help and constructive criticism. I have started an Online Petition at Change.org at http://www.change.org/petitions/city...-to-warren-ave

Secondly, Cass Avenue, will become more well-lit in the spring with the further completion of the Midtown Loop according to an email I received from Midtown Inc a month ago.

I have been in contact with a representative from City Hall and will be emailing Midtown Inc. and Wayne State later today.

Thanks again,

**Downtown Lady** · November-01-11, 11:30 AM

Hi French, you're doing a great job! I signed your petition and hopefully others will click on the link and sign it too.

http://www.change.org/petitions/city...-to-warren-ave

**Russix** · November-01-11, 02:38 PM

Signed! Now to spread the word to the masses!

**313WX** · November-01-11, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by antongast

Then again, based on the WSU campuswatch emails from 10/24 and 10/31, there was one robbery on Hancock, two on Cass, one on Third, and one on Second, so I'm not entirely convinced that fixing the lights on Second is going to stop the robberies in the area.

Exactly.

On top of that, French777 and company can also take the same advice many are giving me. It's not like this petition will solve the problem, it'll just shift it on to someone else. The problem is structural, and until that's repaired the problem will still be there.

Also, this area may be the fastest growing area in the city, but I bet that area doesn't even make up 2% of the city's population, and downtown/midtown as a whole doesn't even make up 6% of the city's population. So I guess we will choose to ignore 95%+ of the city's population for that 2-5%, right? In fact, I doubt much in the way of tax revenue comes from that area, since it's mostly cultural institutions and yuppies in that area.

**English** · November-01-11, 08:37 PM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Exactly.

On top of that, French777 and company can also take the same advice many are giving me. It's not like this petition will solve the problem, it'll just shift it on to someone else. The problem is structural, and until that's repaired the problem will still be there.

Also, this area may be the fastest growing area in the city, but I bet that area doesn't even make up 2% of the city's population, and downtown/midtown as a whole doesn't even make up 6% of the city's population. So I guess we will choose to ignore 95%+ of the city's population for that 2-5%, right? In fact, I doubt much in the way of tax revenue comes from that area, since it's mostly cultural institutions and yuppies in that area.

As someone who grew up in and lived in one of those "other," unnamed areas, I remember what we did long before Detroit's renaissance. Our streetlights started going out in the late 1980s, early 1990s. We had an active block club. We not only petitioned, but we had post lights in our yards. My folks and some of the neighbors installed motion lights.

It's not an either-or situation. It is both-and. You can do individual things within neighborhoods AND work for larger change across the city.

**Dexlin** · November-02-11, 03:27 AM

Originally Posted by 313WX

Exactly.

On top of that, French777 and company can also take the same advice many are giving me. It's not like this petition will solve the problem, it'll just shift it on to someone else. The problem is structural, and until that's repaired the problem will still be there.

Also, this area may be the fastest growing area in the city, but I bet that area doesn't even make up 2% of the city's population, and downtown/midtown as a whole doesn't even make up 6% of the city's population. So I guess we will choose to ignore 95%+ of the city's population for that 2-5%, right? In fact, I doubt much in the way of tax revenue comes from that area, since it's mostly cultural institutions and yuppies in that area.

Again, you can bitch about someone else petitioning and calling to get their's, or you can do the same to see what your attempts to do the same get you. You are as free as any other citizens in Detroit to try to get redress for your neighborhood's issues, and I'd suggest you do that instead of making baseless accusations.

French is doing something about his situation. What have you done to get attention to your hood, lately, besides bitching to us nobodies on an internet messageboard to no one in particular? Closed mouths don't get fed. I'm really getting tired of you presenting a false choice and making insinuations about parts of the city that you have no real proof to back up.

Ravine · November-02-11, 06:08 AM

Yeah, way to resent a person for no good reason.
French777 is trying to get some attention paid to a problem, not steal your goddam cable.

**Dexlin** · November-02-11, 07:12 AM

Originally Posted by Ravine

Yeah, way to resent a person for no good reason.
French777 is trying to get some attention paid to a problem, not steal your goddam cable.

lol! Well said. Brevity is indeed the soul of wit.

**bike4beer** · November-02-11, 09:22 AM

I sent the link for the petition to a friend that lives in the area and he said he saw a bunch of trucks from the lighting department in the area on Sunday. Not sure if they actually fixed anything or not.

**Russix** · November-02-11, 09:42 AM

Originally Posted by bike4beer

I sent the link for the petition to a friend that lives in the area and he said he saw a bunch of trucks from the lighting department in the area on Sunday. Not sure if they actually fixed anything or not.

They came after they paved Prentis. Fixed a single fucking streetlight on Prentis west of 2nd. Forest West of 2nd is dark, 2nd Ave between Warren and Canfield is completely dead dark[[0, absolute 0 streetlights work). If you want anything to get done in this city, you gotta bitch and complain. Cause they don't do what they're suppose to do, they just do things so you'll shut the fuck up. If the streetlights are out in your hood, post you petition here, I'll sign it, please sign this one too. Thank you!

**DetBill** · November-02-11, 06:00 PM

I congratulate you for your efforts, We have the same problem on Lafayette infront of the townhouses and 1300 for several years now,, Its very dangerous at night . There is a lot of foot traffice in this area so the danger element is there as well as many people walking around across the street in the dark , wearing dark clothing with many cars travelling in both directions, On several occasions I almost hit people in the middle of the street as I couldnt even see them.
Last night I was trying to cross lafayette towards Greektwon at rivard, with the pedestrian signal for me and I almost got hit by 4 cars, none of them stopped turning right. Its really crazy. The city does nothing, Our building has been trying to get this resolved for years, with a lame excuse every year. The only time they miraculously discovered the lights was the weekend of superbowl, they somehow discovered the system to turn them on, for years they told us they couldnt figure it out. We need to do something also, This is a very busy , viable area and its just plain dangerous with so much traffic everywhere flying around, both foot and car. The city says they cant afford to fix anything now, yet if someone is killed they will sue the city for millions, like they can afford that now.