PJ O'ROURKE : falling out of love with the automobile

[edgar_rhode]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...767415892.html

second article [[ the first was in this months ESQUIRE ) that basically states thats the sweet spot of the automobile as an icon is past.

the blame can be laid on the doorstep of any number of people ala "CLUE" [[ ...the UAW in the union hall with a contract, the management in the board room with a blindfold, the engineers on the test track with a lead foot, etc ) but it basically comes down to "times have changed"

there are some wonderful lines and observations in the article from a completely outside the 313 point of view. painfully true in the reality "you have an ugly child" biatch slap kind of way. well worth the time.

[reddog289]

I must now be UNAMERICAN. GIMMEE a Prius painted BLACK with Flames,side pipes with a spoiler and hell a fake blower., and don't forget a killer sound system that can play real NASTY SCARY ENGINE SOUNDS, becuse I can't hear if the engine is running in the Prius half the time. Now to something less angry. I myself have gotten to look at my truck and car as really nothing more then an appliance. I myself could, should walk to work becuse I can yet I drive. The last vehicle I loved was my 91 Ranger my 1st new car. I love my 65 Comet yet we live seperate lives.I lust after many vehicles so count me outta that group and im in the 734 area code.

[gazhekwe]

I enjoyed reading the article. The point he made, about our cars becoming a useful appliance as we drive everywhere for chores and appointments, not for fun and freedom, is a very good one. When he went on to blame "pointy headed" busybodies for safety and fuel economy requirements, I think he is a bit off.

IMHO, the beginning of the end came with the fuel crisis of the early 80s. We found our beautiful power machines were not so great as gasoline went up and up and lines formed at the pumps. Then we were offered boring and shoddy choices by the US manufacturers, with incomplete engineering and poor fit and finish. Meanwhile, Japanese cars were already smaller and more fuel efficient, having been designed and built for a smaller country full of smaller people. Their basic design was well engineered and well put together, with nicely appointed interiors. The Big Three offered us hastily thrown together smaller cars with ill-matched power trains, poor fit and finish, and taxi-like bare bones interiors, while still lavishing their attention on the big cars. For them, they raised fuel economy by cutting horsepower, so you got the Look without the pizzazz.

What happened to design? Where was our innovative engine and trans combo? We were stuck on the Hemi, and still are. The whole point is, we need some new options to capture our interest and return that wonderful sense of freedom and adventure.

[nouthen]

I just the wonderful and amazingly efficient Detroit mass transit system to go all over the city and surrounding suburbs. The fact is in Detroit we don't have any options and until we do we are forced to drive and I believe in buying what you want.

[O-Dawg]

Factors which have contributed to the sea-change in the autmotive industry;

1) Cars last much longer than they did fifty years ago; then, cars were worn out at 50 or 60 K miles; now, with minimally proper mantenance, most cars are good for 150K miles or more.

2) Cars cost much more than they once did; unless a family has significant disposable income, an investment of 30K dollars+ needs to last a decade. Trading in every year or two, once common, now is not.

3) The population has aged; people who are 60 something see the purpose of cars differently than people who are 20 something, and the increased cost of cars means that 20 somethings are more limited in their choices than was once the case.

4) Gasoline is no longer cheap, which makes driving as entertainment more expensive.

Add all of this together and by necessity you end up with a much more functional role of driving a car, i.e., the car as a transportation appliance rather than sporting entertainment.

[9mile&seneca]

Right you are ODAWG. Also, when I used to drive a ragtop, the door came up to just under my armpit. I could lay my left arm on the top of the door as I drove. Now in what passes for a convertible, The top of the door is up to my neck, and I'm strapped in like I'm a NASCAR driver. Care free motoring is now highly regulated driving just as what was called "good parking" is now handicapped parking.

[otter]

2) Cars cost much more than they once did; unless a family has significant disposable income, an investment of 30K dollars+ needs to last a decade. Trading in every year or two, once common, now is not.

Actually, the cost of an average new car as a percentage of median family income is, I'm almost certain, as low as it has ever been. Certainly, it is as low as it has been in the last 30 years or so. To that point, I found this:

http://www.economistblog.com/2009/05...l-record-high/

Also, to the point in your last sentence above, cars do last a lot longer than they used to, as I think you also mentioned.

O.

[DetroitDad]

The other thing is that driving isn't a novelty anymore, it's a chore. I remember when we were young and a family member bought a new automobile, everyone in the family was called up and invited over for a ride, or visited by the new car buyer. Each family member was taken on a special ride around the block while the driver showed us all the nice new features.

Nobody cares about your new giant electric shaver or strange uncomfortable ultra mini box on wheels anymore.

No driving isn't the novelty anymore, walking and mass transit is.

Walking and mass transit is supposed to be the new answer to all our problems. In reality, walking everywhere means a lot of stress on your legs and joints, and going through a pair of shoes every month. Density is nice for awhile, but there is a whole different set of problems that really mean it's not a panacea either. I really do wish new urbanists would acknowledge a place for the car. I think that the future is walkable neighborhoods with mass transit and, dare I say it... automobiles. In affect, I think that is what is going to happen, and yeah, that means the car will be what it should be; not a bass pounding, brightly colored, speedy, road rage filled extension of our personality, but a heavy piece of machinery with a purpose, what other posters above called an "appliance".

[East Detroit]

Sounds like you might be getting jaded in your age.

I love driving, love working on cars, etc.


So, we should fall out of love with them and fall into love with what?

What reflects our new post-American Graffiti society? Our cell phones? Hey, check out my ringtone, I installed it myself!

[Bearinabox]

Sounds like you might be getting jaded in your age.

I love driving, love working on cars, etc.

I don't think that sentiment is at all incompatible with wanting other forms of transportation. I like driving sometimes, but I wouldn't want to drive everywhere. Road trips are fun, sitting in traffic on the Southfield for two hours is a pain in the ass. Besides, when the people who don't particularly like driving have other options available to them, the roads become less congested for the people who still choose to drive. I'm always baffled when people equate support for mass transit to some sort of covert War On Driving.

[ghettopalmetto]

I don't think that sentiment is at all incompatible with wanting other forms of transportation. I like driving sometimes, but I wouldn't want to drive everywhere. Road trips are fun, sitting in traffic on the Southfield for two hours is a pain in the ass. Besides, when the people who don't particularly like driving have other options available to them, the roads become less congested for the people who still choose to drive. I'm always baffled when people equate support for mass transit to some sort of covert War On Driving.

In a way, I can't blame those people for thinking the way they do. They reason that since the government has forced us to drive everywhere for the past 60 years, they can just as easily force us to *gasp* take a train!

[BShea]

This line is brilliant:

"Pointy-headed busybodies of the environmentalist, new urbanist, utopian communitarian ilk blamed the victim. They claimed the car had forced us to live in widely scattered settlements in the great wasteland of big-box stores and the Olive Garden. If we would all just get on our Schwinns or hop a trolley, they said, America could become an archipelago of cozy gulags on the Portland, Ore., model with everyone nestled together in the most sustainably carbon-neutral, diverse and ecologically unimpactful way."

No one around here like that ...

[9mile&seneca]

I recently found myself in jacksonville Fl., at a Hotel near the airport,adjacesent to[[or so I thought) a brand new mega strip mall the size of a small town. I thought I'd walk over to one of the several restaurants and get something to eat. Huge mistake. The developers had built a big moat that caused me to have to walk an extra half mile or so, to get to the entrance. They clearly did not want foot traffic. We continue to build this country to force people to drive. Nobody wants a neighborhood bar or restaurant on their street, where you could walk and have a few beers, but we rail against drinking and driving. How high will gas have to go before we realize we are not 18th century British nobility and don't need an acre or two of lawn and no sidewalks.

[ghettopalmetto]

I recently found myself in jacksonville Fl., at a Hotel near the airport,adjacesent to[[or so I thought) a brand new mega strip mall the size of a small town. I thought I'd walk over to one of the several restaurants and get something to eat. Huge mistake. The developers had built a big moat that caused me to have to walk an extra half mile or so, to get to the entrance. They clearly did not want foot traffic. We continue to build this country to force people to drive. Nobody wants a neighborhood bar or restaurant on their street, where you could walk and have a few beers, but we rail against drinking and driving. How high will gas have to go before we realize we are not 18th century British nobility and don't need an acre or two of lawn and no sidewalks.

I'm sorry you had to be in Jacksonville. That is, by far, the worst place I have ever been.

[Parkguy]

DetroitDad--
I think the problem, like Ghgettopalmetto says, is that we don't have any choice. Government builds roads and streets, along with all other forms of transportation, and it has been single-minded for decades. I know that the term "sustainable" has become a buzz word, and for many it has become a "fightin' word," but the sprawl we've developed is not sustainable. That just means that it cannot sustain itself economically or environmentally. And those two factors will become more and more tangled together.

I like my cars, and I like being able to go when and where I want. But I also love walking, and I love bicycling, and [[in places where it works) I love taking public transit-- using all of these when it is appropriate and convenient to use them. This is what I'd like to see in our transportation infrastructure: "complete streets." http://www.completestreets.org/

[9mile&seneca]

I'm sorry you had to be in Jacksonville. That is, by far, the worst place I have ever been.
Agreed. Pakguy, I think it's more what people want and are willing to pay for than it is the gov't. We don't want to live in neighborhoods anymore like in the 30's or 40's, with everything within walking distance. We had so much wealth for so long[[and cheap energy) that we became like the English upper class[[only with bad manners) just kidding. We have had people who are not really that well off financially, burning hundreds of gallons of gas per year just cutting their lawns, and driving every single place they go.They have to drive, there are no sidewalks, and it's 5 miles to the nearest place to get a loaf of bread.

[Bearinabox]

Pakguy, I think it's more what people want and are willing to pay for than it is the gov't. We don't want to live in neighborhoods anymore like in the 30's or 40's, with everything within walking distance.

I do. I would love to live in such a neighborhood. There is nothing like that anywhere in Metro Detroit [[although Hamtramck is pretty close), so it makes no sense to say that people are choosing not to live in places like that. There are none of them here for people to choose. Around here, people like me have two choices: live someplace that's fairly walkable, and drive as little as possible [[which is what I do), or move to New York or Chicago [[which is what most people of my generation seem to be doing).

[East Detroit]

I don't think that sentiment is at all incompatible with wanting other forms of transportation. I like driving sometimes, but I wouldn't want to drive everywhere. Road trips are fun, sitting in traffic on the Southfield for two hours is a pain in the ass. Besides, when the people who don't particularly like driving have other options available to them, the roads become less congested for the people who still choose to drive. I'm always baffled when people equate support for mass transit to some sort of covert War On Driving.

I agree. The sentiments are not incompatible. In fact, I would be one of the first in line if I could hop on reliable mass transit close to my home and then close to work.

I would still want my car for not driving back and forth to work and still love driving and love working on it.

And... I would still wonder what is next. If personal transportation is a dead end, then what will define our culture next?

[DetroitDad]

I do. I would love to live in such a neighborhood. There is nothing like that anywhere in Metro Detroit [[although Hamtramck is pretty close), so it makes no sense to say that people are choosing not to live in places like that. There are none of them here for people to choose. Around here, people like me have two choices: live someplace that's fairly walkable, and drive as little as possible [[which is what I do), or move to New York or Chicago [[which is what most people of my generation seem to be doing).

Have you ever been to Downtown Detroit, Downtown Ann Arbor, or certain areas of Birmingham, Livonia, Dearborn, Hamtramck, Farmington, or Plymouth?

I live in Downtown Detroit, and while it is no New York, it is walking distance to local grocers, government offices and Secretary of State, centers of employment, utility offices, doctors and dentist offices, hospitals, veterinarians, a hardware store, video boxes, a library, florists, pharmacies, retail, a movie theater, restaurants, and other entertainment. Transit isn't the best, but I can take a taxi just about anywhere for a few bucks, or wait for a bus running in ten minute intervals for $1.50 if I'm strapped for cash. The People Mover is right outside my door step for winter errand running, and if all else fails, I still have my car which can be parked in lots or garages in the CBD for FREE-$25 a month, depending on what building you live in. I also have heard they're building various systems to connect other localities, including a light rail line on Woodward Ave..

You should check it out sometime. The options aren't the best, but are much better then the suburbs. If people are really serious about ending their love affair with their car, then they should be well aware these city centers are just siting here waiting to be reactivated. If people choose to live in them, business will be sure to follow within the decade, and we'll be leaving a nice walkable lifestyle behind for our children.

[Bearinabox]

Have you ever been to Downtown Detroit, Downtown Ann Arbor, or certain areas of Birmingham, Livonia, Dearborn, Hamtramck, Farmington, or Plymouth?

None of those places are neighborhoods within the city proper. As I said in my previous post, Hamtramck is about as good as it gets around here in terms of walkability, IMO. I'd like it better if it were served by a 24-hour bus line, though.

I live in Downtown Detroit, and while it is no New York, it is walking distance to local grocers, government offices and Secretary of State, centers of employment, utility offices, doctors and dentist offices, hospitals, veterinarians, a hardware store, video boxes, a library, florists, pharmacies, retail, a movie theater, restaurants, and other entertainment. Transit isn't the best, but I can take a taxi just about anywhere for a few bucks, or wait for a bus running in ten minute intervals for $1.50 if I'm strapped for cash. The People Mover is right outside my door step for winter errand running, and if all else fails, I still have my car which can be parked in lots or garages in the CBD for FREE-$25 a month, depending on what building you live in. I also have heard they're building various systems to connect other localities, including a light rail line on Woodward Ave..

I'm not sure where you find some of that stuff downtown unless "walking distance" is about three miles. Downtown is pretty good, though. Just not a neighborhood.

You should check it out sometime. The options aren't the best, but are much better then the suburbs. If people are really serious about ending their love affair with their car, then they should be well aware these city centers are just siting here waiting to be reactivated. If people choose to live in them, business will be sure to follow within the decade, and we'll be leaving a nice walkable lifestyle behind for our children.

I agree completely with all of that, but there's a difference between "sitting here waiting to be reactivated" and "I'm selling my car tomorrow." I didn't let it stop me from living in such an area, or walking/taking the bus to almost everything, but I don't think I could live here without a car, and I'm willing to put up with more than most to avoid starting mine up. Empty storefronts can have all the potential in the world, but they don't make the walk to the nearest operating business any shorter, especially when it's twenty below outside.

[Fury13]

And... I would still wonder what is next. If personal transportation is a dead end, then what will define our culture next?

Ummm, how about people? Interpersonal relations? Folks talking and visiting with each other... exchanging ideas... instead of showing off one's 427, 44o, or Boss 302.

[Parkguy]

Here in Rosedale Park, I can walk no more than a quarter mile and get just about everything I need, except for the things I'd want to go to a mall to buy, anyway. Groceries, drugstores, hardware stores, haircuts, some clothing, video, carry-outs... all that is missing is a really nice sit-down restaurant and a coffee house [[I am baffled about why those are missing). Granted, if I lived farther away from Grand River, it would be a longer walk. There are other areas of the city that are walkable, too.

[Roq]

Ummm, how about people? Interpersonal relations? Folks talking and visiting with each other... exchanging ideas... instead of showing off one's 427, 44o, or Boss 302.

Or in other words, Dante's seventh circle of hell.

[ghettopalmetto]

I think it's more what people want and are willing to pay for than it is the gov't. We don't want to live in neighborhoods anymore like in the 30's or 40's, with everything within walking distance.

I don't believe that people "don't want" to live in walkable neighborhoods. Look at where people go on vacation to enjoy themselves and look at the places that have the highest property values.

The real problem is that building walkable mixed-use neighborhoods is ILLEGAL in 90% of the country. Thanks to the automobile lobby and roadway engineers who wrote the bulk of "modern" model zoning regulations!

[9mile&seneca]

Probably some of both. I know in Savannah, Ga. a family business, a seafood market in the same location for 40 years,wanted to start serving food and drinks as a seafood restaurant, and the neighbors went berserk. this was in midtown Victorian district with sidewalks.