Sobering..... Jalopnik: "Why Lincoln should die."

**Whitehouse** · June-23-11, 01:48 PM

http://jalopnik.com/5814169/why-lincoln-should-die

**Orthophonic** · June-23-11, 03:07 PM

Sort of similar in tone to the recent Daniel Howes article...
http://www.detnews.com/article/20110...dentity-crisis

As a former Cadillac employee, I would go for a Cadillac over a Lincoln anyway. But that would require having enough money. I'm hoping for a properous reincarnation!

**Ray1936** · June-23-11, 03:37 PM

Oh.......that Lincoln. I thought you were talking about Mary Todd's hubby.

GUSHI · June-23-11, 05:31 PM

Ford needs a luxury brand, I don't see Lincon going any where.

**downtown_racine** · June-23-11, 06:18 PM

I liked the Town Car as a old school luxo-barge and the LS was a decent looking car I doubt I would own either but the rest of their cars they have been making in recent car look like absolute rubbish and if the cars are ugly Americans WILL NOT buy them.

When your highline cars look worse than your entry level cars you are in bad shape, the reason Lincoln should die is because they insist on building ugly cars.
Damn decent cars under all that ugly bodywork and fabulous interiors but nobody will buy them to know any of that.

The Town Cars have always looked fine and the LS looked ok but was a disappointment mechanically the only other decent cars looking cars they have made in the last 30 years are the Mark 7 and 8.
I like the Ford Edge and new Exploder myself, the Lincoln counterpart looks like crap.
Chevy trucks should die as well, make the GMC trucks and call'er a day, get rid off all that redundant badge engineered crap.

**Patrick** · June-23-11, 07:45 PM

Ford needs to start a enw luxury "brand" from the ground up similar to what Hyundai did with the Genesis.

**detlump** · June-23-11, 10:22 PM

I think the article is spot on. Lincoln hasn't really been much since the 60s, and you can get all the equipment on a Ford. Globally Lincoln is unknown. Cadillac is somewhat better, but still not a global nameplate. More people probably know Buick thanks to China.

If Ford means "One Ford" then Lincoln should go. They have been trying to get that brand right for decades, toss it and make better Fords.

**Red Devil** · June-23-11, 10:57 PM

Here is an article from the 90s about another company/brand that shoulda died...

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...7747/index.htm

Things change. Let's see what Ford has in store for Lincoln before we pen the obituary

**Don K** · June-23-11, 11:07 PM

Unfortunately [[and I say this as a Ford retiree who would like Lincoln to succeed), Lincoln has been hobbled over the years by too much badge engineering and a relentless focus [[for the most part) on making every car feel like a Town Car. I mean, back in the day, even my brother in law [[who's not a car buff at all) knew that the last Continental was a tarted up Taurus, and it didn't take too much knowledge to realize the Mark VIII was a T-Bird in drag. And the electronics [[adjustable suspension and steering) that were intended to differentiate these models ended up being mostly annoying. Setting the suspension on Firm just made the ride harsh; it didn't really improve the handling. Setting the steering on Firm made it feel as if there was a leprechaun under the front of the car trying to tug the front tires the wrong direction; it didn't improve steering feel at all.

Since then, with the exception of the LS, it's been ever more obvious that a Lincoln is is the same as a Ford with the silly baleen-whale grille, nicer interior materials, and some extra stuff to justify the ten-fifteen grand price premium. When I had to get my first post-employment car in the fall of '08, I wanted a mid-sized sedan, so had the choice of a Fusion, an MKZ, or a Mazda6 [[assembled at Flat Rock!). I chose the Mazda, because it offered most of what was offered on the MKZ [[okay, no cooled seats - such is life), without the monster price premium.

I also should mention the formation of PAG as part of Lincoln's decline. At that time a conscious decision was made that Lincoln was to slot in under Jaguar, in performance and luxury, which left Lincoln occupying a near-luxury slot like Buick.

**Autoracks** · June-23-11, 11:09 PM

I had a conversation with my dad about this just the other day. He
picked me up in a rental car Lincon. Not sure the model. MKZ perhaps
and the entire ride we discussed the car.
I think Ford has done a great job restructuring, remaining solvent,
When i think Lincon i think competition to Cadillac. Lincon is
far from competing with Cadillac. Its more like Lincon is competing
with Ford. Something must be done

**Cincinnati_Kid** · June-24-11, 02:06 AM

Cadillacs have always been considered better than Lincolns. The Escalade kills the Navigator every year in sales. The DTS and CTS are gorgeous. They are just better looking. The MKS is the only exception.

**luckycar** · June-24-11, 06:10 AM

I have found that used Lincolns for the most part,bring far less than a similar Cadillac.The quality of materials,that stupid air suspension,the sorry Ford trannys,all make for a worthless used car.We don't even want them.The 3 LS Lincolns that we have had the pleasure of trying to sell all had troubles.Kill it off.I read where Ford wants the remaining Lincoln stores to invest a million in up grades.I'd get out if I had one.

**mallory** · June-24-11, 07:57 AM

The MKX is an ugly turd. They improved it slightly for this year, but whoever came up with the "crossover" idea should be fired. YOO-GLY!

I'll give Lincoln credit for the rest of their lineup; they are some nice looking cars. Still, I'll take my wife's CTS Coupe over anything Lincoln makes any day.

**Hermod** · June-24-11, 08:18 AM

Lincoln has always run second fiddle to Cadillac. Ford always had trouble making Lincoln compete with Cadillac and making Mercury [[and Edsel) compete with Pontiac, Oldsmobile, or Buick. Ford could usually give Chevrolet a run for their money. Chrysler tried the "brand ladder" with Plymouth, Dodge, De Soto, Chrysler, and experimenting with Imperial as a separate brand and not just a high end Chrysler. The problem was that all of the companies created too much overlap within their ladders.

9mile&seneca · June-24-11, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by Don K

Unfortunately [[and I say this as a Ford retiree who would like Lincoln to succeed), Lincoln has been hobbled over the years by too much badge engineering and a relentless focus [[for the most part) on making every car feel like a Town Car. I mean, back in the day, even my brother in law [[who's not a car buff at all) knew that the last Continental was a tarted up Taurus, and it didn't take too much knowledge to realize the Mark VIII was a T-Bird in drag. And the electronics [[adjustable suspension and steering) that were intended to differentiate these models ended up being mostly annoying. Setting the suspension on Firm just made the ride harsh; it didn't really improve the handling. Setting the steering on Firm made it feel as if there was a leprechaun under the front of the car trying to tug the front tires the wrong direction; it didn't improve steering feel at all.

Since then, with the exception of the LS, it's been ever more obvious that a Lincoln is is the same as a Ford with the silly baleen-whale grille, nicer interior materials, and some extra stuff to justify the ten-fifteen grand price premium. When I had to get my first post-employment car in the fall of '08, I wanted a mid-sized sedan, so had the choice of a Fusion, an MKZ, or a Mazda6 [[assembled at Flat Rock!). I chose the Mazda, because it offered most of what was offered on the MKZ [[okay, no cooled seats - such is life), without the monster price premium.

I also should mention the formation of PAG as part of Lincoln's decline. At that time a conscious decision was made that Lincoln was to slot in under Jaguar, in performance and luxury, which left Lincoln occupying a near-luxury slot like Buick.

The Lincioln continental became the Cadillac Cimarron. You need one for each foot.

**Whitehouse** · June-25-11, 04:20 PM

Originally Posted by Red Devil

Here is an article from the 90s about another company/brand that shoulda died...

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...7747/index.htm

Things change. Let's see what Ford has in store for Lincoln before we pen the obituary

Not the worst case of bad forsight. That still is Decca turning down the Beatles as an upcoming band. but this one comes close. If you've sold your Apple stocks on the base of this article, you could sue....

9mile&seneca · June-26-11, 03:03 AM

Originally Posted by Whitehouse

Not the worst case of bad forsight. That still is Decca turning down the Beatles as an upcoming band. but this one comes close. If you've sold your Apple stocks on the base of this article, you could sue....

Schlitz is back and better than ever!!!

**56packman** · June-27-11, 11:30 AM

Lincoln has suffered from the badge-engineering woes described above, they have not made a seperate Lincoln engine since the 1956-'57 Mark II Continental, Lincolns have used Ford truck and passenger car engines for longer than most people can remember.
My experience with them is that the initial luster dies off quickly, the gagets all die and are expensive to repair or replace and as used cars the second buyer is 4 social ladder rungs below the first buyer, at least in the caucasion community.
It's all a moot point now, the educated and affluent turn their nose at all domestic luxury offerings, preferring German and high-end Japanese premium makes. The pool of old Dear-bern, Ford retired or Ford-loyal are a dying breed and their offspring don't want much to do with Lincoln when they reach that social strata. Cadillac has some exciting, great product now, but I think they are going to have a tough time getting back the high-end buyer crowd that now wants to be seen in a Mercedes or Lexus. Decades of selling Cadillacs to buyers who couldn't really afford them through GMAC to make production numbers seriously damaged the brand's cache with the high end market segment.
The Cimmaron,the V-8-6-4 engine, the Escalade and Escalade truck didn't help matters any.
Bob Lutz did a great job driving Cadillac back with the car product they are making today.
I hope they don't $600 repair bill the owner to death after the warranty expires.

**Dbest** · June-27-11, 12:04 PM

The last model of the Continental was a pretty decent car. I have had mine for some years now and the only thing I've done to it was replace the rack for the steering. My buddy had an 01 STS with less miles that blew a head gasket. Before you shoot your mouth off check out what owners said about the 00 Lincoln Continental. Kelley Bluebook link:
http://www.kbb.com/lincoln/continent...sumer_reviews/

I like the person[[comments section) who talks about theirs having over 400,000 without a major engine issue. Hey Cadillac groupies, remember the NORTHSTAR? What a complete piece of shit motor.
A couple of things to take into account, Lincoln was just awarded best in initial quality! That is no small feet people, ask Chrysler[[almost last). I think they can fix up the bodies of their cars as well. There is a plan to implement more European aspects to these cars, they can only do things so quickly. They will separate themselves from the blue oval styling in the coming years. Also take a look at Luxury Suv sales and you will see the Navigator perched on top of its class, as always.
I could probably find an archived article of this guy saying kill ford off when they hit rock bottom some years back. If the dynamic change in the Ford brand is any indication as to what may be in store for Lincoln, I like it. Remember Alan showed up in Dearborn behind the wheel of a Lexus. I'm sure he wants more out of Lincoln.

**D_Town** · June-27-11, 05:33 PM

Lincoln needs to reintroduce the Continental as a flagship 7/S/A8 competitor, a proper mid size sedan between MKZ/MKS, small car/possible hybrid?, keep the two SUV's [[MKX, Navigator), and a convertible/sport car based on the mustang platform.

**downtown_racine** · June-27-11, 08:21 PM

I agree about the Northstar being an over priced and over hyped pile of junk. Most Caddy engines are low performance turds IMO the only Caddy worth owning is powered by a Chevy V8, either a late big body Fleetwood or a CTS-V.
The last Conti FWDriver with the Ford 4.6 litre 32valve V8 was a good car. Hard to beat any Ford V8.
The whole current Lincoln line up is gaudy and ridiculous looking next to Caddy or Lexus.
The gen 2 Mark 8 Was the best looking Lincoln since the Mark II