Lansing to save MCS?

Heard this on NPR this afternoon.

http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/mi....Central.Depot

Saving Detroit's Central Depot Laura Weber [[2009-08-31)

DETROIT, MI [[MPRN) -

State lawmakers say there may be federal stimulus dollars available to renovate and restore an old Detroit train station into an international trade hub.

A state Senate hearing in downtown Detroit focused on possible future uses for the run-down Michigan Central Depot. Senators on the panel sent a letter to the building owner, listing potential uses for the property. Ideas included a Michigan State Police lab, a Homeland Security border protection office and an international trade processing center.

State Senator Cameron Brown chaired the meeting. He says it would be nice to see the train station used for transportation again. But he says that might be hard to do because current plans for a future light rail line bypass the station.

"Let's begin by getting the depot up and running, so to speak, and then we'll deal with the complete transportation nexus as step number two," says Brown.

Brown says the station's owner is willing to discuss renovating the building if there is a plan in place for its use. © Copyright 2009, MPRN

i much prefer this idea over the DHS scheme. clearly the facility is too large to solely be a passenger train station but if it were established as a trade centre i would like to see an area of the main level be set aside for the future home of a passenger train station.. maybe if amtrak could rent a small portion of the station it might get them back in there.

i would like to see any use for the station... whatever it takes to save the old girl.. but if it were to be reborn again as a passenger / freight transportation hub... well, in my opinion that would just be fantastic, and great for corktown

Anything at this point that saves it is OK with me.

Don't you find the term "international trade processing center" a bit cold and clinical?

Much like reading the ingredients in a bag of Tyson frozen food: "mechanically separated chicken..."

Yes, Good news. Hate to see that gem come down.

Sen. Brown was throwing around the figure $100 million on Local 4 today. There is no way in hell that building gets done for anything less than $200 million, especially if the Book-Caddy cost $180 million.

And the owners are all about fixing it, but understandably they want there to be a plan for it. I mean sure you can fix it up but if there's no concrete plan then putting all that $$$ into it would be pointless and a huge loss.

If somebody comes up and says hey we want this building where do we sign? then that's perfect, but so far no ones done that and it sucks because people can't see beyond the broken glass and overgrown grass [[though the group I'm with The Michigan Central Station Preservation Society Inc. is hoping to go in with some landscaping gear and clean up the outside...just because it's empty doesn't mean it has to look neglected!)

This is like the 'renaissances' of Detroit. There's another one happening every few years. I'd love to see it, just don't count your chickens.

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Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

Sen. Brown was throwing around the figure $100 million on Local 4 today. There is no way in hell that building gets done for anything less than $200 million, especially if the Book-Caddy cost $180 million.

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I believe that to "restore" the building would cost vast sums, and undoubtedly more than the book caddy. However, if one were to adaptively reuse the structure, and disregard the interior, perhaps the figure could be below the book caddy's price tag. I have a hunch the government would choose the latter. Though it would be a punch in the gut, at least it would preserve the exterior of this endangered structure.

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Originally Posted by buildingsofdetroit

Sen. Brown was throwing around the figure $100 million on Local 4 today. There is no way in hell that building gets done for anything less than $200 million, especially if the Book-Caddy cost $180 million.

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You can't compare the Book-Cadillac to MCS. For one, the BC was a 1,000 bedroom hotel and had to have plumbing redone for 1,000 washrooms and all the new condo kitchens. An office building like MCS only needs two central washrooms per floor. You're not going to be adding hundreds of kitchens with granite countertops for the converted condo section. You won't need to replaster the ceilings on the upper floors, just add suspended ceilings with ceiling tile and duct work. You don't need fancy lighting on the upper floors, just basic commercial lighting. You're probably not going to need to move the walls on the upper floors. The big cost will be rewiring the building. The $100 million figure sounds like a fair estimate..

I'm all for making the MCS into something usable again. But why should Maroun get a free ride on this? It's his building, he let it rot for 20 years and get torn up by scrappers and urban explorers. He should have to relinquish ownership if the government pays to fix up his building with no contribution from him.

I think the article says Mouron has to pay for it, the government is going to start leaning on him to make him do it, from what I understood.

I agree with Dave Windsor on this one it won't be quite like BC, the main task will be to clean up the main floor, beyond that it's basically an office building inside.

[quote=mcsdetroitfriend;62953]And the owners are all about fixing it, but understandably they want there to be a plan for it. I mean sure you can fix it up but if there's no concrete plan then putting all that $$$ into it would be pointless and a huge loss.[quote]

And there is the definition of a slumlord. I honestly don't care if it gets rehabbed. Given its location it will not result in any additional development or spin off business. The fact that government and non-profits [[even if their heart is in the right place) are the only ones attempting to do anything for this building tells me all I need to know about how much Maroun cares.

The piece of shit, just like every other slumlord or owner that does not maintain his property should be fined every single day. the different is that Maroun can afford to at least maintain a basic fence but chooses not to.

I think your heart is in the right place but how can a group of people be so niave to perform charity helping beatify a building that has an owner that is as indifferent about it as I am about the last crap I left in the toilet.

There are a lot of non-profits that would happily accept your help and are helping someone other than a billionaire that has been allowed to let his buildings get to this point.

[quote=jt1;63166][quote=mcsdetroitfriend;62953]And the owners are all about fixing it, but understandably they want there to be a plan for it. I mean sure you can fix it up but if there's no concrete plan then putting all that $$$ into it would be pointless and a huge loss.

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And there is the definition of a slumlord. I honestly don't care if it gets rehabbed. Given its location it will not result in any additional development or spin off business. The fact that government and non-profits [[even if their heart is in the right place) are the only ones attempting to do anything for this building tells me all I need to know about how much Maroun cares.

The piece of shit, just like every other slumlord or owner that does not maintain his property should be fined every single day. the different is that Maroun can afford to at least maintain a basic fence but chooses not to.

I think your heart is in the right place but how can a group of people be so niave to perform charity helping beatify a building that has an owner that is as indifferent about it as I am about the last crap I left in the toilet.

There are a lot of non-profits that would happily accept your help and are helping someone other than a billionaire that has been allowed to let his buildings get to this point.

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MCS has had two other owner besides Maroun who had no fence and allowed the building to be in the state it's in. By 1994 when Maroun picked up the property it was pretty already in the same state it's in today. I'm in class right no and don't have the book on me, but the two owners prior to DIBC had no fence and stripped and sold most of the interior. There's a flyer from 1993 for some DJ event that was to go on inside and the photo is basically a mirror image of what the building looks like today. Sure Maroun hasn't done much at all other than buying and maintaining a fence since then, but like i said before, theres been no concrete use for it. "If they build it they will come" does not work right now.

The city of Detroit also has some blame for the state of the building because they own the tracks, and the area underneath the tracks [[the former baggage and mail rooms). The area under the tracks lead right up into the building. DIBC has fences right where their property starts. There's a steel fence right at the end of the Subway to stop people from coming in but people find their way in. The other day someone cut through the fence, later that same day it was fixed.

So it's not to say the company isn't trying to maintain it, but people will get in if they want to. Also they're organizing a landscaping for the property, removing the windows, and adding new Lanax [[?) windows [[apparently 400 times stronger than glass). We'll see if that happens, temp fixes, but it'll look nice

1. Why is the state government spending its time trying to propose uses to a private land owner when they they are staring at a massive deficit?

2. Why is the state government proposing hundreds of millions of dollars of redevelopment with a land owner with whom they have several outstanding lawsuits for egregious breaches of contract and for illegal squatting on City land?

3. Why is the state government rushing to the aid of a land owner who is bank rolling the recall effort of a state representative, the only person who has openly challenged the slum lord?

4. Why is a non-profit allowed to co-opt my donations for the benefit of a private land owner who flaunts local, federal and state laws? Why isn't Mike Cox investigating the non-profit status of Summer In The City?

5. When DEGC was asked to run the figures on the renovation of the MCS in to Police HQ in 2006, the figure was right around $200 - $250 million. They used several contractors to give rough estimates and used their own experience with similar buildings around town such as the Book Cadillac.

6. Is MCSDetroitfriend really Mr. Smithers, I mean Dan Stamper?

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Originally Posted by PQZ

1. Why is the state government spending its time trying to propose uses to a private land owner when they they are staring at a massive deficit?

2. Why is the state government proposing hundreds of millions of dollars of redevelopment with a land owner with whom they have several outstanding lawsuits for egregious breaches of contract and for illegal squatting on City land?

3. Why is the state government rushing to the aid of a land owner who is bank rolling the recall effort of a state representative, the only person who has openly challenged the slum lord?

4. Why is a non-profit allowed to co-opt my donations for the benefit of a private land owner who flaunts local, federal and state laws? Why isn't Mike Cox investigating the non-profit status of Summer In The City?

5. When DEGC was asked to run the figures on the renovation of the MCS in to Police HQ in 2006, the figure was right around $200 - $250 million. They used several contractors to give rough estimates and used their own experience with similar buildings around town such as the Book Cadillac.

6. Is MCSDetroitfriend really Mr. Smithers, I mean Dan Stamper?

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Lol @ PQZ nope just a college student who has either been brainwashed or actually knows the fact vs. rumor and innuendo. I've been there, I've heard employees talk freely about affairs of the building, etc etc etc.

Summer in the City is already being investigated so don't you worry, that's their problem....Couldn't tell you about the differing figures, maybe in '04 [[not 06), they actually had a general contractor go in and make quotes? Who knows

Once again from what I read in the article the government is not giving money to the project, they want him to pay and they're just trying to rush the project along, from what I can tell.

""We're focused on every effort possible to see if there's a use for that facility," Brown said, explaining that owner Matty Moroun is willing to invest his own money to renovate the depot if he has assurances of an anchor tenant."

"The depot would require extensive renovations, but Brown said taxpayers would not be expected to foot the bill for any renovation. "I'm a realist. If the owners did not have the wherewithal to make this project happen, you and I would not be having this conversation."


-http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/09/michigan_central_depot.html

PQZ, thank you for your post #14. Great questions and they get right to the heart of the matter. I don't agree with your last question, #6, unless you meant it in jest. As much as I may disagree with MCSDF, he seems to be someone genuinely concerned and involved. We can only wish for more people to get involved.

I can understand wanting an anchor tenant before renovation, not that the building should have been allowed to get to the point it is now- but that's another discussion.

If the Matted One is really a billionaire, then what's 200 million to him? You mean to tell me he couldn't get a loan to start renovation? Put down 50 million? Give me a break. Since he's supposedly paying for it anyway, why not start now with the basics, roof, window replacement, mechanicals- leave it raw on the inside and closer to tenant ready.

It's politics, which he's playing with outstate Republicans- which should give one reason to pause in the first place. I'll bet there is no real outrage from lawmakers due to Moron's position as a billionaire with money to finance campaigns. Pretty simple- follow the money.

Why is it that in any other city this would be front page news, and the only way I found out about this was on this blog.
I certaintly find this positive news

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Originally Posted by andylinn

I believe that to "restore" the building would cost vast sums, and undoubtedly more than the book caddy. However, if one were to adaptively reuse the structure, and disregard the interior, perhaps the figure could be below the book caddy's price tag. I have a hunch the government would choose the latter. Though it would be a punch in the gut, at least it would preserve the exterior of this endangered structure.

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How does one "adaptively reuse" a structure by disregarding it's interior? Using it for target practice for the feds?

The word "facadectomy" has been coined to describe saving only the outside of a historic building, while building a whole new structure inside or behind the facade. It's easy to imagine something like this happening to the waiting room and concourse of MC Depot, if a use were ever found for the building. That's a big "if," of course.

I wish I could have attended the Senate hearing, just to see how familiar the rural Republicans were with the building and the surrounding neighborhood. I have a hunch I wouldn't have run in to them at the next table at Lupita's after the meeting, but maybe I'm being too cynical.

I thank Sen. Brown for his wanting of MCS to be a transportation hub again. But the light rail line does not need to be connected to MCS. If used for transportation, MCS should be the center of the commuter rail lines [[and Amtrak) that will branch out from Detroit. Our current station does not have the capacity to carry both Amtrak and let's say 4 commuter rail lines [[Ann Arbor, Pontiac, Port Huron, and Monroe are the three I saw for the transportation plan) The train station can be the hub and headquarters and/or offices for the transportation authority and Amtrak offices, if so desired. Express buses and go between downtown and MCS for passengers.