Gilbert Gets Jail Site - New Criminal Justice Center to Built

Not much of a surprise. What Gilbert wants Gilbert gets and in this case it is okay with me. How about you?

Gilbert will pay a sizable chunk of the half billion dollar criminal justice center at Warren and I-75 and get the Fail Jail site and Murphy Hall.

The new headquarter is a grim-looking semi-brutalist campus. It looks like what it is. A place I would not like to go to.

Attachment 35287

http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article...nty-to-get-new

And since this has been discussed over several threads, I have tagged them...
Click here for the list of Fail Jail - New Jail threads >>

This is the classic definition of a "Win-Win"... County gets the new jail at no major additional expense to taxpayers; Gilbert gets the jail site which will surely be successful for him; and the city get a better development at our eastern entry to downtown; not to mention the donations Bedrock is making to city parks and employee training, plus the commitment to 51% CoD employees are great bonuses. Cities are moving away from consolidating their jails & courtrooms downtown, where land values and demand are very high, so this makes sense in a 20+ year vision of downtown. This should also have some interesting implications for the I-375 removal project, with which Gilbert will now be able to coordinate. I could see his development here really being a new landmark as you enter downtown from Gratiot or 75.

Did anyone notice that the jail will be built @ the DDOT admin offices!

I agree that this is a win-win. Not only does an additional neighborhood get added jobs to the area, but those jobs should be able to support new businesses in the area as well. Of course Gilbert developing the fail-jail site will most likely mean more development on the outskirts of downtown towards Eastern Market.

The renderings look good for the most part, but it's a shame that with the size of the site, they couldn't have put a park for the kids.


So Gilbert now has all of the justice buildings in Greektown. He plans on doing a development on the fail jail site, and the juvenile jail site. He also plans on renovating the old DPD HQ.

What is happening with the neoclassical jail, the newer jail, and the Frank Murphy Hall of Justice?

Original Gratiot site jail plan, set for completion in mid 2014:

2,000 beds. $300 million cost. $200 million in bonds obtained in
2010. Audit showed that about $40 million in cost overruns was
expected by county execs and this info was not shared timely with
the Wayne County Board of Commissioners and the Wayne County
Building Authority:

https://www.freep.com/story/news/loc...jail/77547072/

[[With appreciation to the Detroit Free Press for its FOIA fight in this
matter - the county should have been transparent in the first place
especially with its oversight boards)

End cost including overruns, lower estimate $270 million;
highest estimate $391 million - that was for the Wayne County
jail Gratiot site.

It was floated that the Gratiot site was costing Wayne
County about $1 million a month. 4.5 years times 12
months per year - that adds up to $54 million total.
So I do not see how there could be $50 million remaining
from bonds unless they were earmarked solely for
construction.

So the new jail [[presumably without overruns baked in)
is to cost Wayne County $380 million - there is said to
be $50 million of bonds allocated to the original Gratiot
jail that will be available, so then the new bonds to
be issued look to be $330 million.
It will be a 2,280 bed jail. There may be additional
facilities and amenities for that higher cost as compared
to the Gratiot site projected facility.

Combined bond total for the two sites could be
$200 million original plus $330 million new.

Sounds like a great deal. But that rendering of the new jail and courthouse complex is brutal indeed. Couldn't they have hired an architect under the age of 70?

Well if the county had been damn the torpedos full speed
ahead for the original jail, overruns and all, it could have
been finished in 2014 for $391 million bonds.

The jail that the county will get now will be finished in
a couple of years for $530 million bonds, including those
funds misused to partially construct the poorly planned
Gratiot site project.

My bet is on Gilbert turning the Fail Jail site and the [[soon to be) former Juvenile Justice Center to the south of it... as the site for the Jack Casino, with other developments planned for the Murphy site, existing Jail site, and redeveloped old Police HQ.

Gilbert's Greektown Casino is the little kid on the block with only 25% of Detroit Casino revenues.... he wants a bigger share.

The Greektown Hotel and parking structure will anchor the south side of the future larger casino, and the current Greektown Casino and former Trappers Alley, will be redeveloped into an destination of some sorts to tie the Jack Casoni, Greektown development, Monroe/Randolph and Campus Martius into a large entertainment district.

It's like what the Ilitch's would like to do farther north... but without the festoon lighting.... :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dumpling

Well if the county had been damn the torpedos full speed
ahead for the original jail, overruns and all, it could have
been finished in 2014 for $391 million bonds.

The jail that the county will get now will be finished in
a couple of years for $530 million bonds, including those
funds misused to partially construct the poorly planned
Gratiot site project.

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I believe Gilbert is paying $20 million for the Fail Jail site, so that brings bond total down to $510 million.

I think we can safely assume with usual government cost overruns that finishing at the Fail Jail site would have cost close if not more than the high end of estimates: $391 million.

For that extra $120 million [[guaranteed not to go higher because it's not on the hook for cost overruns) Wayne County will get a new jail that's 15% larger than what was to be built on the Gratiot site, allowing closure of all 3 current jails, not just the two downtown; offices for the sheriff's department and prosecutor's staff; a criminal courthouse and a juvenile detention facility.

There is no way Wayne County could have added those jail beds or built those replacement facilities, which it has sorely needed for years, for $120 million. I think that's a fantastic deal.

Also, in response to another post: the new site is south of Warren, not north, so will not be built on or next to the DDOT HQ and terminal.

I am very happy about the existing facilities being replaced or repurposed.

That's a nice slice of the downtown pie that we know will be humming along in the near future. I hope it's not too tourist trap-y.

What are the best guesses as to what this might be?

Some [[half-baked) ideas:
-Expansion of Greektown Jack Casino
-Office space
-Indoor concert venue
-Large gym [[Lifetime, LA Fitness, Soulcycle)
-Movie theater [[Big Sean?)
-New Quicken HQ/offices
-Hotel

Most likely this will be a combo of a few things, office, retail, apartments and a hotel, but wild speculation on the Internet is more fun.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EGrant

What are the best guesses as to what this might be?

Some [[half-baked) ideas:
-Expansion of Greektown Jack Casino
-Office space
-Indoor concert venue
-Large gym [[Lifetime, LA Fitness, Soulcycle)
-Movie theater [[Big Sean?)
-New Quicken HQ/offices
-Hotel

Most likely this will be a combo of a few things, office, retail, apartments and a hotel, but wild speculation on the Internet is more fun.

---

I would guess this will be a high-end chain hotel. Probably one of the following brands or similar: Intercontinental, St. Regis, Waldorf-Astoria, Ritz Carlton, Autograph Collection, W hotel, etc.

It just has the look of a regal old building, in a great location for a hotel, and size wise not too big that it would fit well into the luxury hotel category. Maybe it will have a residential component added in as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shai_Hulud

I hope it's not too tourist trap-y.

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This. And I'll be more specific: I hope it's not an expansion of the casino. Though I imagine Gilbert plans part of it to include that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EGrant

Most likely this will be a combo of a few things, office, retail, apartments and a hotel…

---

That would be great.

It's an outstanding location. Especially once 375 is gone.

Please bring back the soccer stadium. We are about to lose a chance for an MLS team ... to Cincinnati!

Anything that keeps and improves on the existing street grid I am all for! No stadiums, dead parking garages, or casino gaming floors. Given Bedrocks history I have confidence in them doing this right and not making this a "District Detroit 2.0".

I really don't think Gilbert is too concerned about growing his casino bigger than Motor City and MGM. Doing so would require substantial land commitment as Greektown has by far the smallest footprint right now. Not to mention Gilbert has shown himself to be an idealist, more concerned about being a good corporate citizen than maximizing profits at every single turn.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by masterblaster

Please bring back the soccer stadium. We are about to lose a chance for an MLS team ... to Cincinnati!

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Lol no. Let's keep that bid with Ford Field. No need for another stadium downtown.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jakewayj

Of course Gilbert developing the fail-jail site will most likely mean more development on the outskirts of downtown towards Eastern Market.

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Huge opportunities for the Gratiot corridor.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zads07

Lol no. Let's keep that bid with Ford Field. No need for another stadium downtown.

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I agree. Why can't Ford Field be used for soccer? It makes no sense to have large, duplicate facilities. Wings and Pistons share.

WOW, look at how much has changed in eight years.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tig3rzhark

Did anyone notice that the jail will be built @ the DDOT admin offices!

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The press release is misleading. The admin building for DDOT are not currently part of the project.

Soccer equals yawn.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eastland

Soccer equals yawn.

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And yet it has one of the biggest crowd draws worldwide.

Just a guess, but the incinerator is not long for this world.

Pricey lawyers and judges get garbage slime on their person and their cars...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eastland

The press release is misleading. The admin building for DDOT are not currently part of the project.

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Yet when the news came out, the address for DDOT's admin offices was mentioned as the location of the new jail.

Is there any more information that you have that would state that the DDOT admin offices would remain in its location, or if not, where it would be relocated?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tig3rzhark

Yet when the news came out, the address for DDOT's admin offices was mentioned as the location of the new jail.

Is there any more information that you have that would state that the DDOT admin offices would remain in its location, or if not, where it would be relocated?

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That's because it's DDOT's property, the jail is being built on the back half of the property. The admin building is the black glass building directly on Warren, in front of the tan brick maintenance facility. If you look in the aerial rendering you can see the main DDOT buildings are undisturbed. The jail replaces a smaller warehouse and some sheds. https://goo.gl/maps/6ie3m16dGwH2


In the land swap, the city got the gigantic American Motors site. https://goo.gl/maps/usH15pYn7co You can see that this has a similar arrangement as the DDOT buildings, but it would cost a ton of money to renovate and is way too big for DDOT. Across the street from DDOT now is a DPS warehouse. So maybe DDOT, the DPS warehouse, and then the DPS school bus yards and other utilitarian things across the city could be consolidated at the American Motors site. But I don't think there's a reason for the city to go through the hassle/expense, and I don't think there's a reason for developers to want to build stuff that would be looming under the shadow of a prison and incinerator.

It seems like the DDOT site was chosen simply because the government owned land was easier to assemble, it's in an industrial district so there wouldn't be NIMBY opposition, or opportunity costs from alternative uses of the land, and it's still vaguely close to the core of the city.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by brizee

Just a guess, but the incinerator is not long for this world.

Pricey lawyers and judges get garbage slime on their person and their cars...

---

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...ay/3287589002/

That was quicker than I thought.

With all the new residintial construction and proposals within half a mile there was no way this was surviving.

.. still no timeline for construction to begin here?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hypestyles

.. still no timeline for construction to begin here?

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There is a serious lack of tradesmen available to do everything on the existing projects in Detroit. I imagine that the criminal justice complex will have to wait its' turn.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hypestyles

.. still no timeline for construction to begin here?

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You can't have a timeline for construction without an actual proposal. Nothing has formally been submitted for this one, and nothing will be until Gilbert is done getting Monroe Blocks going.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gistok

There is a serious lack of tradesmen available to do everything on the existing projects in Detroit. I imagine that the criminal justice complex will have to wait its' turn.

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With all due respect Gistok, the above is a Michigan Excuse if there ever was one.

Did Phoenix have the trades in the nineties at the same time that Atlanta, Florida, the Silicon Valley and the entire east coast was exploding? If the work is here and the money is good they will come from somewhere else just like they do in other places. God knows we have been the supplier of skilled trades to the rest of the country for a long time. Just because an economic boom has not happened in Detroit since WWII, that is not a good enough reason to believe it is not possible here again.

If the right conditions are created the growth will happen in our area just like other places in this country. We just have to compete and make changes of old archaic ways and level the field so Michigan gets in the game instead of sitting on the sidelines playing the poor victim state in the rust belt hit the hardest.

Quote:

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Just because an economic boom has not happened in Detroit since WWII, that is not a good enough reason to believe it is not possible here again.

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I don't think he believes that or implied any such thing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ABetterDetroit

With all due respect Gistok, the above is a Michigan Excuse if there ever was one.

Did Phoenix have the trades in the nineties at the same time that Atlanta, Florida, the Silicon Valley and the entire east coast was exploding? If the work is here and the money is good they will come from somewhere else just like they do in other places. God knows we have been the supplier of skilled trades to the rest of the country for a long time. Just because an economic boom has not happened in Detroit since WWII, that is not a good enough reason to believe it is not possible here again.

If the right conditions are created the growth will happen in our area just like other places in this country. We just have to compete and make changes of old archaic ways and level the field so Michigan gets in the game instead of sitting on the sidelines playing the poor victim state in the rust belt hit the hardest.

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I'll just let the problems speak for its self....

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/constr...-continue-2019

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/constr...labor-shortage

https://www.freep.com/story/money/20...it/1986685002/

With nearly $10 billion in construction going on in the next 5 years, a skilled labor shortage should be of no surprise. They're gonna have to pay up big time to hire required help from outside the region, especially with Detroit's cyclical jobs situation. People that left after the 2008 meltdown [[many losing their homes in the process), may not be so quick to return... knowing the cyclical nature of the Michigan business climate.

I have 2 friends who are construction business owners and have been trying for 2-3 years to add help... but to no avail. Anyone that is interested usually goes to the larger construction firms who have deeper wallets. And even though they're both willing to train new guys to work for them... the interest among potential employees wanes fast when it is discovered how hard building trades work can be... for the X-Box generation... :rolleyes:

this isn't a detroit problem. there's a serious lack of skilled trades nationally.

https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2018...for-university