How EM-controlled DPS ruined a school for teen moms with a 90 percent graduation rate

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By all standards, Detroit's Catherine Ferguson Academy was a success story. The school for teenage moms had a 97 percent attendance rate and a 90 percent graduation rate. It was the focus of an award-winning Metro Times story in 2004 for its innovative practices. The gardens and animals on the school's grounds excited the imagination of students and neighborhood people, and it appeared to be a model for urban education.

And then the emergency manager-controlled DPS said it had to be closed, touching off a battle that resulted in the school remaining open, but under the operation of a for-profit charter school organization run by Blair Evans, the brother of failed Detroit mayoral candidate, former Detroit Police Chief and current Wayne County Executive-elect Warren Evans. And that's when things fell apart.

That story is the focus of a news report by Al-Jazeera America, and the piece suggests that the charter organization innovated the school right out of existence. A news summary accompanying the video piece quotes Joyce Schon, a Detroit attorney who helped file a lawsuit against the school; Schon says the new set-up was "a disaster."

http://www.metrotimes.com/Blogs/arch...raduation-rate

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Yeah just run the schools like a businesses that'll fix everything!!:rolleyes:


http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/s...imination.html

Did you just quote Al Jazeera?

How often has the charter for the DPS been revisited? Perhaps it should be rewritten from scratch, to incorporate public charters and have stricter regulations on how these schools are allowed to proliferate and the governance structure behind them.

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Originally Posted by 1953

Did you just quote Al Jazeera?

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Their journalism has been pretty good the few times I've read it.

Their news and documentaries are actually quite good, though most will be turned off by the name.

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Originally Posted by MSUguy

Yeah just run the schools like a businesses that'll fix everything!!

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Why blame the fireman for the condition of the burned house? The EM arrived at the burning school district and made decisions made necessary by administration's malfeasance and incompetence.

Sounds like this decision was really unfortunate. But I have a hard time blaming the person brought in to clean up a mess for collateral damage.

If you don't want an EM, the run your district well. Problem solved. You can then have an excellent school you manage.

Yes, there were many factors that contributed to DPS problems. But the elephant in the room was so clearly their incompetence. If you don't believe this, you can ignore my comments and continue to blame others.

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

Why blame the fireman for the condition of the burned house? The EM arrived at the burning school district and made decisions made necessary by administration's malfeasance and incompetence.

Sounds like this decision was really unfortunate. But I have a hard time blaming the person brought in to clean up a mess for collateral damage.

If you don't want an EM, the run your district well. Problem solved. You can then have an excellent school you manage.

Yes, there were many factors that contributed to DPS problems. But the elephant in the room was so clearly their incompetence. If you don't believe this, you can ignore my comments and continue to blame others.

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Why do you continue to ignore that DPS took the biggest hit when the state came in to 'help' the first time. Let's make sure that you acknowledge the conditions, scores, enrollment and finances before the first state takeover and after they left.

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

Why blame the fireman for the condition of the burned house? The EM arrived at the burning school district and made decisions made necessary by administration's malfeasance and incompetence.

Sounds like this decision was really unfortunate. But I have a hard time blaming the person brought in to clean up a mess for collateral damage.

If you don't want an EM, the run your district well. Problem solved. You can then have an excellent school you manage.

Yes, there were many factors that contributed to DPS problems. But the elephant in the room was so clearly their incompetence. If you don't believe this, you can ignore my comments and continue to blame others.

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This, of course, makes no sense.

Essentially you're saying that if your school district is in financial trouble, don't be surprised if the EM comes in and completely ruins shit.

Perhaps it was unclear to you that that is not the purpose of the EM.

So unacceptable when the school board is screwing up, but it's "collateral damage" when the EM fucks up. Roger that. Ah, Wesley, the conservatives' ever-loyal terrier. The EM could start eating babies and he'd defend it to the last.

I'm not even opposed to the EM, and I hate the school board. However everyone should be held accountable, because young people have a right to education in this country.

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Originally Posted by poobert

This, of course, makes no sense.

Essentially you're saying that if your school district is in financial trouble, don't be surprised if the EM comes in and completely ruins shit.

Perhaps it was unclear to you that that is not the purpose of the EM.

So unacceptable when the school board is screwing up, but it's "collateral damage" when the EM fucks up. Roger that. Ah, Wesley, the conservatives' ever-loyal terrier. The EM could start eating babies and he'd defend it to the last.

I'm not even opposed to the EM, and I hate the school board. However everyone should be held accountable, because young people have a right to education in this country.

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EMs should not be good educators. They are Emergency Managers.

EMs should be so bad, that people will work to avoid EMs at all costs.

We don't need EMs who know education. That's the job of the schools. We need EMs who stay about 10 minutes, tear up old ways of doing things, stabilizes finances, and then leaves and lets the school board fix up the mess.

Orr knows nothing about how to run a government. That's why when Duggan showed up and said he hated the EM process, Orr welcomed him.

Young people do deserve a good education. And it should be delivered by the school board, not the EM. You don't ask a fireman how to redo your electrical wiring to avoid a fire, do you? Don't ask an EM to educate your kids. They don't and shouldn't know how.

[[And thanks for the kind words.)

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

EMs should not be good educators. They are Emergency Managers.

EMs should be so bad, that people will work to avoid EMs at all costs.

We don't need EMs who know education. That's the job of the schools. We need EMs who stay about 10 minutes, tear up old ways of doing things, stabilizes finances, and then leaves and lets the school board fix up the mess.

Orr knows nothing about how to run a government. That's why when Duggan showed up and said he hated the EM process, Orr welcomed him.

Young people do deserve a good education. And it should be delivered by the school board, not the EM. You don't ask a fireman how to redo your electrical wiring to avoid a fire, do you? Don't ask an EM to educate your kids. They don't and shouldn't know how.

[[And thanks for the kind words.)

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when you tear things apart you lose enrollment. When you lose enrollment you lose funding. When you lose funding a higher percent goes to legacy costs and less to the class room. Education does not operate like a business. Unfortunately, people in lansing and washington are too fucking stupid to understand that.

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

EMs should not be good educators. They are Emergency Managers.

EMs should be so bad, that people will work to avoid EMs at all costs.

We don't need EMs who know education. That's the job of the schools. We need EMs who stay about 10 minutes, tear up old ways of doing things, stabilizes finances, and then leaves and lets the school board fix up the mess.

Orr knows nothing about how to run a government. That's why when Duggan showed up and said he hated the EM process, Orr welcomed him.

Young people do deserve a good education. And it should be delivered by the school board, not the EM. You don't ask a fireman how to redo your electrical wiring to avoid a fire, do you? Don't ask an EM to educate your kids. They don't and shouldn't know how.

[[And thanks for the kind words.)

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So the EM is punitive? It's designed to harm people? Buddy I work for Uncle Sam and I've never heard such malarkey. If you want to use the government to terrorize people, are you a fascist or just confused? What is wrong with you, and where did you come up with these ideas?

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

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Originally Posted by MSUguy

Yeah just run the schools like a businesses that'll fix everything!! :rolleyes:

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Why blame the fireman for the condition of the burned house? The EM arrived at the burning school district and made decisions made necessary by administration's malfeasance and incompetence....

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I'm embarrassed for you.

I'm willing to forgive that you selected that exceptionally inappropriate metaphor unwittingly.

http://www.destgulch.com/movies/f451/f45109.jpg
Fahrenheit 451

Your mentors are exploiting your youthful, overconfident naïveté. They betrayed you by allowing you to post that embarrassment. Save yourself before it's too late.

Choose more supportive mentors.

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Originally Posted by 1953

Did you just quote Al Jazeera?

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You do understand the Al Jazeera has infinitely more journalistic credibility and integrity than CNN, Fox and MSNBC combined, right? They are a great source for articles that report the news in a factual manner and let you decide how you feel on the subject. A piece like this is factual, it tells you how the EM targeted this school in particle, specifically by cutting off its funding life line even though the school was what one would consider a model school.

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Originally Posted by poobert

So the EM is punitive? It's designed to harm people? Buddy I work for Uncle Sam and I've never heard such malarkey. If you want to use the government to terrorize people, are you a fascist or just confused? What is wrong with you, and where did you come up with these ideas?

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Not designed to harm, but designed to stablize the district that was destroyed by local control. EMs should not be viewed as saviors. They are just emergency workers dealing with the mess created by others.

I don't see how blaming the EM has any validity. They certainly should behave responsibly, but they are not the school board. Its the school board's job to protect excellent programs.

Why is the EM to blame, but not the school board that didn't protect these students and instead steered the ship towards the rock. No, let's blame the EM, yell about 'local control', and ignore that 'local control' is really what failed the students.

I would never ascribe journalistic integrity to CNN, MSNBC, or Fox - and I'm pretty skeptical about it coming from Al Jazeera, too!

1953

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Originally Posted by 1953

Did you just quote Al Jazeera?

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I been watching Al Jazeera English [[not Al Jazeera America) regularly lately and I find their news reporting to be excellent.

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Originally Posted by downtownguy

I been watching Al Jazeera English [[not Al Jazeera America) regularly lately and I find their news reporting to be excellent.

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I have to agree with you. It's like watching real reporting, not bobble-heads nodding in the background.

In a period when Detroit Public Schools was spending $6,800 per student, including, for example, very at-risk of dropping out male students, the students at the Catherine Ferguson Academy were enjoying education at $12,619 per student.

i know, I know - many will say nearly $13,000 per girl was worth it to get those teen mothers a HS diploma and that 97% went on to secondary education. But - exactly how many of those girls graduated from a four or two year college? Without the magic of double the normal spending and triple the normal counselings and interventions - exactly how did they make out? The publicity machine does not say.

At any rate - that per pupil cost was not sustainable. So the EM was incidental to the decision. it would have happened sooner or later anyway.

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Originally Posted by SWMAP

In a period when Detroit Public Schools was spending $6,800 per student, including, for example, very at-risk of dropping out male students, the students at the Catherine Ferguson Academy were enjoying education at $12,619 per student.

i know, I know - many will say nearly $13,000 per girl was worth it to get those teen mothers a HS diploma and that 97% went on to secondary education. But - exactly how many of those girls graduated from a four or two year college? Without the magic of double the normal spending and triple the normal counselings and interventions - exactly how did they make out? The publicity machine does not say.

At any rate - that per pupil cost was not sustainable. So the EM was incidental to the decision. it would have happened sooner or later anyway.

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I've never believed that pouring money on education worked, but this suggests that it does. If money can be proven to solve urban education problems, this might be less expensive that paying for the consequences.

So in this case, the plug was pulled because the district ran out of money. Too bad. Still no reason to blame the EM. Did what had to be done within the money available it seems.

Would like to see this sort of experiment continued.

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

I've never believed that pouring money on education worked, ....

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

... So in this case, the plug was pulled because the district ran out of money. Too bad. Still no reason to blame the EM. Did what had to be done within the money available it seems. ...

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I agree with these two statements.

I remember back in public high school I switched from one school to another. The one I switched to didn't offer the same history courses. My guidance councilor told me that I could take those courses as distance ed courses while still going to public high school. I did that. And wow, I mean I learned so much more through those distance ed history courses than I would ever have going to classes for them. It was supervised by part-time retired school teachers. I listened to a dozen cassette tapes and read several focused course books and I still got A's. When I looked at the distance ed course book, they had everything. Math, physics, French, English, History, everything.

The point is, you don't need to go to a physical location daily to get a good high school education. Why can't they learn at home through correspondence courses if this academy shut down? It's not going to cost anywhere near $12Gs or $6Gs for that matter. There's a point where the student has to take some responsibility for getting through high school.

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Originally Posted by davewindsor

I agree with these two statements.

I remember back in public high school I switched from one school to another. The one I switched to didn't offer the same history courses. My guidance councilor told me that I could take those courses as distance ed courses while still going to public high school. I did that. And wow, I mean I learned so much more through those distance ed history courses than I would ever have going to classes for them. It was supervised by part-time retired school teachers. I listened to a dozen cassette tapes and read several focused course books and I still got A's. When I looked at the distance ed course book, they had everything. Math, physics, French, English, History, everything.

The point is, you don't need to go to a physical location daily to get a good high school education. Why can't they learn at home through correspondence courses if this academy shut down? It's not going to cost anywhere near $12Gs or $6Gs for that matter. There's a point where the student has to take some responsibility for getting through high school.

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Yes, but...

... we also are wise to recognize that certain classes of students may be helped by different techniques. What didn't get discussed on this thread was the challenge to the charter's program because it was discriminatory.

I feel that sometimes an 'all boys', or 'all girls', or even 'all black' or 'all hispanic' school could be appropriate. Not every move to acknowledge and respond to groups of students should be squashed by the obsessive advocates of fairness. Although in this case I wonder if the challenge wasn't more an 'attack' on charters than striving for equality.

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Originally Posted by 48307

Their journalism has been pretty good the few times I've read it.

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lol al jazeera is funded by qatar. the government is known to finance terrorists and has a less than stellar record of human rights

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Qatar

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...r-funding.html

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Originally Posted by hybridy

lol al jazeera is funded by qatar. the government is known to finance terrorists and has a less than stellar record of human rights

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_Qatar

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...r-funding.html

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Oh you mean like the United States

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Originally Posted by Detroit Stylin

Oh you mean like the United States

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OK, I'll take up the defense of the US.

Sure, we aren't perfect. But I don't see the point in beating ourselves up. Add up all our errors, and we're still dozens of times better than pretty much everyone else.

We should be very proud of ourselves for being the best protector of liberty, yet still strive to be even better.

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Originally Posted by Wesley Mouch

Yes, but...

... we also are wise to recognize that certain classes of students may be helped by different techniques. What didn't get discussed on this thread was the challenge to the charter's program because it was discriminatory.

I feel that sometimes an 'all boys', or 'all girls', or even 'all black' or 'all hispanic' school could be appropriate. Not every move to acknowledge and respond to groups of students should be squashed by the obsessive advocates of fairness. Although in this case I wonder if the challenge wasn't more an 'attack' on charters than striving for equality.

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How is it equality if the school board spends $12G per student when other charter schools are getting much less? They can just as easily get equality by taking a distance ed high school course for a lot less cost to the school board. Give them a number and no name and you'll never know if the student is a boy, girl, white, black or hispanic with distance ed. There's your equality. The test scores will ultimately reveal whether the student can handle themselves at university. It's that simple.

This school wasn't about educational equality and this school did not properly prepare their students academically for university. It was just a diploma mill that gave students a high school diploma they probably shouldn't have gotten anyway because all they did was just micromanaged their students' family lives for better salaries and getting more than double the school funding. I doubt that these high school graduates have anywhere near the same success graduating from a college or a university any more than a student from a much lower funded public or charter school. It really comes down to the student taking responsibility for their own success, which they can do in any learning environment if they really wanted to. Do I really need to get into anecdotes about some of the most successful people in the world that grew up in some of the worst conditions in the world?

Please reread what the school’s principal, G. Asenath Andrews, says. I mean, the principal is ranting that a student getting a C or less is like an A even though MEAP [[the Michigan Educational Assessment Program, the standardarized test for all public school students in Michigan) says that A is really a C or less. Yet, this C or less under MEAP somehow qualifies them to get into and graduate from a university? He's defending a diploma mill. It's ridiculous:

“If you look at MEAP scores, they’re not going to look good,” Andrews says. “I think we get the students ready. If you talk to kids, I think we’d get an A. If you look at MEAP we wouldn’t even get a C. We are a good school; we are not a great school. If we had a great school we’d have to start producing the kinds of test scores that make us look great. It starts with, ‘Is she OK? Is she living in a safe place? Is she getting prenatal care?’ Then you get to, ‘Did she do her homework.’ Our kids come with so much stuff to worry about, we never worried about test scores. If you base anything on just one standard, it’s not a true indication of what’s going on.” http://www.metrotimes.com/detroit/sc...nt?oid=2180156 [[upper middle of the article).