MGM invests $1 million in downtown garden

Sorry if this is already posted somewhere... but I didn't see anything.

Nice to see MGM give back a bit. Seems like a nice use for the abundance of parking lots in the CBD, although it doesn't do much for the density aspect... better than gravel though!



MGM Grand Casino broke ground this morning on what promises to be downtown’s only big community garden and one of the largest and most elaborate gardens in the city.

Created in partnership with the nonprofit Greening of Detroit organization, the MGM Grand garden will occupy 1.8 acres at Third and Plum near the casino. It includes a 60-by-96-foot greenhouse, and eventually will include bee keeping for honey, berms with fruit trees, and training programs for both children and adults interested in growing food inside the city.

The site is a gravel parking lot, which prompted Rebecca Salminen Witt, president of the Greening of Detroit, to tell an audience at the ground-breaking ceremony, “We hear a lot about vacant space in our city. We see that as an opportunity.”

George Jackson, president of the Detroit Economic Growth Corp., said the garden fits into Mayor Dave Bing’s plans to nurture a greener, more environmentally sustainable city.

“We think this is outstanding, and my hat’s off to MGM Grand,” he said.

Jeff Jackson, director of engineering for MGM Grand, said the garden has been in planning for about a year. MGM Grand has purchased the gravel lot from nearby DTE Energy. Decades ago, the lot had been the site of horse stables and later a gas station, he said.

Of Detroit’s several hundred community, school, and family gardens, almost all are run on a shoe-string, usually with volunteer labor and often with donated seeds. The $1 million MGM Grand plans to invest marks this newest garden as all but unique in the city.

MGM Grand said that Greening of Detroit will distribute the food grown in the garden, and that produce sales to local restaurants will be used to fund the site’s overall operation.

http://www.freep.com/article/2010073...owntown-garden

Better than gravel, but not as good as ... say ... a city?

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Better than gravel, but not as good as ... say ... a city?

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Give them some credit for doing their bit... BTW, I believe that the vacant lot count in Detroit is what? 60,000? There is LOTS of room left in Detroit to build a city.

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Originally Posted by marcwigle

Give them some credit for doing their bit... BTW, I believe that the vacant lot count in Detroit is what? 60,000? There is LOTS of room left in Detroit to build a city.

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Nah. I won't give them credit. I will, however, give credit to DTE's real estate subsidiary, SYNDECO, for turning that part of downtown into a gravel lot and destroying the 19th century neighborhood that was there. As for this touted "green space," this is more appropriately described as "greenwashing." Probably one person walks out of that casino a month and commits suicide, so they have to do something to "give back" to the community. Even if it's a garden in an institutional part of town that nobody will go to.

Oh, yes. Lots of room to build a city. Except downtown. That's where our city fathers are busy building "green space." What a fookin' joke.

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Originally Posted by marcwigle

Give them some credit for doing their bit... BTW, I believe that the vacant lot count in Detroit is what? 60,000? There is LOTS of room left in Detroit to build a city.

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So there the mystery has been answered...

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

Nah. I won't give them credit. I will, however, give credit to DTE's real estate subsidiary, SYNDECO, for turning that part of downtown into a gravel lot and destroying the 19th century neighborhood that was there. As for this touted "green space," this is more appropriately described as "greenwashing." Probably one person walks out of that casino a month and commits suicide, so they have to do something to "give back" to the community. Even if it's a garden in an institutional part of town that nobody will go to.

Oh, yes. Lots of room to build a city. Except downtown. That's where our city fathers are busy building "green space." What a fookin' joke.

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Jesus Murphy... if you want to talk about how bad casinos are and how bad the neighbourhood is now compared to the past... fine. I'm not an expert on what the area looked like prior and I have never been a supporter of casinos. I was ONLY commenting on "gravel parking lot" vs "green space". Given a choice, I'll vote for green space.

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Originally Posted by marcwigle

Jesus Murphy... if you want to talk about how bad casinos are and how bad the neighbourhood is now compared to the past... fine. I'm not an expert on what the area looked like prior and I have never been a supporter of casinos. I was ONLY commenting on "gravel parking lot" vs "green space". Given a choice, I'll vote for green space.

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That's one of the reasons they get away with their BS about how they're "improving" Detroit ... people don't know the history. And so "Detroit" becomes a wonderful blizzard of upbeat press releases about "green spaces" and "improvements" -- none of which involve actual city-building.

Isn't this "charity" mandatory per their agreement with the city?

It's like when Dennis the Menace would cause a bunch of trouble, then at the end he would clean the mess and everybody would be like "yay Dennis", but even at 5 years old I was wondering why he was getting congratulated for doing what anybody would be expected to do.

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Originally Posted by Johnlodge

Isn't this "charity" mandatory per their agreement with the city?

It's like when Dennis the Menace would cause a bunch of trouble, then at the end he would clean the mess and everybody would be like "yay Dennis", but even at 5 years old I was wondering why he was getting congratulated for doing what anybody would be expected to do.

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Good point, JL.

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

That's one of the reasons they get away with their BS about how they're "improving" Detroit ... people don't know the history. And so "Detroit" becomes a wonderful blizzard of upbeat press releases about "green spaces" and "improvements" -- none of which involve actual city-building.

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And I understand that... it happens in other cities as well as I'm sure that you know. As a visitor to the city though, I would rather see greenspace than more parking lots... I would certainly like to see less burned-out houses. I would also like to watch a ballgame at Tiger Stadium or, failing that, be able to play baseball there and not have to worry about the cops kicking my sorry butt off the field. And I'm ceratinly not a big believer in slapping up casinos to "improve" a city or ripping down buildings just because... I don't know, we need more parking spots. I can tell you that our visit to Detroit last summer will not be our last. We stayed at the Milner Hotel which has been standing there for close to 100 years [[it could use a few repairs) and enjoyed walking around downtown. Taking a drive past my grandmother's old house was a bit of an eye-opener. I guess I'm off-topic now...

Anyway, I enjoy history and I hate to see some things change. Do I want more casinos?... nope. Do I want more parking lots?... nope. Do I want Detroit to forget it's history?... absolutely not. Do I want Detroit to rise again? Definitely. In fact, I'm looking at purchasing a small set of derelict buildings on Michigan Avenue this fall or spring to rehab. When I do I'll post the info here and see what people think of my project... on second thought! ;-)

I'm just wondering what kind of garden do you get for a million bucks? That must be one fancy garden!

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Originally Posted by marcwigle

And I understand that... it happens in other cities as well as I'm sure that you know. As a visitor to the city though, I would rather see greenspace than more parking lots...

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It was the big players in the city, including DTE, who first turned what was a beautiful 19th century neighborhood, built all around two vest-pocket parks, into a gravel wasteland. That's the full story. Now we're supposed to cheer because they are turning some of the gravel into a park that I imagine few will use, as it is unlikely it will be integrated into a neighborhood. Who lives back there? Anyway, who wouldn't rather see "green space" than parking lots? The real travesty is hidden behind the glowing press release. And I figure I have to barge in here, tell the whole story and correct the record somehow. In truth, the little-known people who rehab what remains do a world more good than the "city fathers." And good luck to you.

The neighborhood was cut up by the Lodge in the 1950s and cut up by I-75 by 1968. Starting in 1966, there was an attempted [[and intentional) redeployment as Detroit's Haight-Ashbury [[backed by Mayor Cavanaugh and spearheaded by the guy who later owned and upgraded the buildings housing C-Pop, Avalon, and the Spiral Collective), and the entire area was bust by 1969 due to crime and general business failures. Land acquisition started after that [[there was no eminent domain, and selling unproductive commercial property in particular would have been a no-brainer), and Edison Plaza was built in 1971-1973. Where's the evil plan here?

I get the vague impression that your viewpoint on this was formed by looking at some archive picture of the area in 1915, combining them with the knowledge that until 6 years ago, it was all gravel lots for Edison, and concluding that it was all part of a sudden, evil plot by which a terrestrial paradise was suddenly and unjustifiably destroyed by a big, bad corporation. If am getting the details on this area wrong, by all means tell me - but do point to the specifics. What I see is that the area failed [[to the point a 24-year-old teacher could buy a lot of the land for the project) and was given a demolition-free re-use program that had the extraordinary imprimatur of the mayor on a project designed to attract hippies. That's not exactly everyone's ganging up on poor old Plum Street. I think that area was dead in the water as soon as it was cut off from Corktown by the Lodge.

I'm curious about something else: for all of the suppositions on DetroitYes that had it not been for [[plug in name of decision designated as "stupid" based on knowledge/techniques known today), XYZ would still be here, it almost begs the questions of an alternate universe where [[a) demand for Detroit's CBD did not suffer any setbacks and/or [[b) structures, maintained or not, last forever.

Take for example the Syndeco issue you raise. There was no upsurge in demand for any type of property downtown after 1969, the year the functional aspect of the Plum Street area hit its end - and businesses with their people bled out very rapidly. In the meantime, nothing is paying for the upkeep of the buildings. I think it's overwhelmingly likely that the Plum Street buildings [[many of which would have been frame construction) would not have made it to any point anywhere near the present.

And especially given the end result, a place that's built up with more density than it has ever had [[even excluding parking decks), why are you herniating about events that likely happened before you were born? It's not exactly like Edison built an adobe hut as a headquarters.

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

It was the big players in the city, including DTE, who first turned what was a beautiful 19th century neighborhood, built all around two vest-pocket parks, into a gravel wasteland. That's the full story.

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As has been asked above, "Who is going to tend this 'community garden'? Who lives in that area?"

This is the problem with top-down solutions. MGM has provided a community garden for a community that doesn't exist. Are we to believe that people are going to drive and bus from all over Detroit to maintain a few crops?

It's one thing if residents gather as a collective to maintain a garden in their own neighborhood. It's quite another for a corporate behemoth to construct a Potemkin garden as a PR gimmick.

And I'm sure this garden will be open to just anyone, right? No wrought-iron fences around the perimeter???

Forget landscaped-lighted parking lots. It sounds like George Jackson just got a stiffy for the latest craze to implement in his Slum Clearance efforts.

Now that might make the other two casinos think that they may have to one-up their competitor and give the city something better.

Not impressed. After making money for 11 years in the city of Detroit, MGM wants to put a garden in downtown. Not that I'm against a garden but a 1 million dollar garden is a drop in the bucket for MGM. I love to gamble like the next man but I wish the casinos never came to Detroit. We are no better than we were 11 years ago.

You do know that the deal is not a million dollar park, but it is a grant to Greening of Detroit AND the donation of the land so GoD can operate the garden for years and years to come.

The newspaper article is not very clear. And ensuing posters have jumped to laughable contusions with their editorialized re-writes of history and fact. Nothing new there.

The real deal is that GoD gets some money coupled with the ability to make more money, the area gets something a little more attractive than a gravel lot, and best of all detroitnerd gets something to complain about. He's always so happy making everyone else miserable, that it looks like this deal is a triple win.

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Originally Posted by gnome

The real deal is that GoD gets some money coupled with the ability to make more money, the area gets something a little more attractive than a gravel lot, and best of all detroitnerd gets something to complain about. He's always so happy making everyone else miserable, that it looks like this deal is a triple win.

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Ah, the old Expect Nothing and Be Happy When They Throw You Crumbs bit.

Perhaps you're thrilled about this, gnome, but I suspect that many Detroiters have higher expectations than the patronizing "greening" of a gravel lot that never should have existed.

It's going to be a greening of detroit farm, not a community garden. There's lot of different models within urban agriculture.

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Originally Posted by ghettopalmetto

As has been asked above, "Who is going to tend this 'community garden'? Who lives in that area?"

This is the problem with top-down solutions. MGM has provided a community garden for a community that doesn't exist. Are we to believe that people are going to drive and bus from all over Detroit to maintain a few crops?

It's one thing if residents gather as a collective to maintain a garden in their own neighborhood. It's quite another for a corporate behemoth to construct a Potemkin garden as a PR gimmick.

And I'm sure this garden will be open to just anyone, right? No wrought-iron fences around the perimeter???

Forget landscaped-lighted parking lots. It sounds like George Jackson just got a stiffy for the latest craze to implement in his Slum Clearance efforts.

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I wish MGM would invest more in Detroit than just a garden, they have the ability to do much more than that. However, a million dollar investment is better than nothing, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Detroitnerd

That's one of the reasons they get away with their BS about how they're "improving" Detroit ... people don't know the history. And so "Detroit" becomes a wonderful blizzard of upbeat press releases about "green spaces" and "improvements" -- none of which involve actual city-building.

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I am following what you mean, but perhaps now is the wrong time to dish out "place is a not city when there's no buildings" argument. If we were to substitute this for actual development, it would be fairly weak.

New construction is held to extraordinary low standards in Detroit when it comes to aesthetics and form. I'd say concentrate new construction elsewhere where there's more activity and at least some attempt at placemaking with decent architecture.

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Originally Posted by WayneMan

I wish MGM would invest more in Detroit than just a garden, they have the ability to do much more than that. However, a million dollar investment is better than nothing, I guess.

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With a 24% wagering tax paid to the city by the three casino's, I think they do enough.

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Originally Posted by Huggybear

The neighborhood was cut up by the Lodge in the 1950s and cut up by I-75 by 1968. Starting in 1966, there was an attempted [[and intentional) redeployment as Detroit's Haight-Ashbury [[backed by Mayor Cavanaugh and spearheaded by the guy who later owned and upgraded the buildings housing C-Pop, Avalon, and the Spiral Collective), and the entire area was bust by 1969 due to crime and general business failures. Land acquisition started after that [[there was no eminent domain, and selling unproductive commercial property in particular would have been a no-brainer), and Edison Plaza was built in 1971-1973. Where's the evil plan here?

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That's a pretty good history, Huggy. I think your search for an overarching evil plan is going to be fruitless though. These are business decisions from a business community that, frankly, never seemed to appreciate the history or continuity of that part of town. They bought properties and, as they bought them, they knocked them down for more parking. They even changed the name of Jones Street to Plaza Drive. I guess you can picture some executive in 1971, looking at a wooden model of DTE's office complex and nodding approvingly at it, but no evil plan. It's just that Detroit's business leadership has zero vision when it comes to downtown, other than turning it into parking lots, office towers and gated campuses.

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Originally Posted by Huggybear

I get the vague impression that your viewpoint on this was formed by looking at some archive picture of the area in 1915, combining them with the knowledge that until 6 years ago, it was all gravel lots for Edison, and concluding that it was all part of a sudden, evil plot by which a terrestrial paradise was suddenly and unjustifiably destroyed by a big, bad corporation. If am getting the details on this area wrong, by all means tell me - but do point to the specifics.

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It's deeper than that. To a certain extent, yes, people had been leaving that neighborhood for a long time. I used to bike back there about eight years ago and admire the holdouts: The little tea house, a few handsome old apartment buildings, places that were cared for by individuals who lived there, amid the gravel parking lots, probably refusing offers from Syndeco because they chose to stay. They swept their streets, tended their gardens, even as the neighborhood was being systematically turned into lots. The city didn't care for the actual park that sat there, but they did pay to pour new curb ramps all over the area, which were then promptly destroyed for the new casino. Gotta love that.

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Originally Posted by Huggybear

What I see is that the area failed [[to the point a 24-year-old teacher could buy a lot of the land for the project) and was given a demolition-free re-use program that had the extraordinary imprimatur of the mayor on a project designed to attract hippies. That's not exactly everyone's ganging up on poor old Plum Street. I think that area was dead in the water as soon as it was cut off from Corktown by the Lodge.

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Perhaps. But then there were people still living there in quaint old buildings too. I know, it was just four or five buildings left, but they stayed. Now they're gone.

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Originally Posted by Huggybear

I'm curious about something else: for all of the suppositions on DetroitYes that had it not been for [[plug in name of decision designated as "stupid" based on knowledge/techniques known today), XYZ would still be here, it almost begs the questions of an alternate universe where [[a) demand for Detroit's CBD did not suffer any setbacks and/or [[b) structures, maintained or not, last forever.

Take for example the Syndeco issue you raise. There was no upsurge in demand for any type of property downtown after 1969, the year the functional aspect of the Plum Street area hit its end - and businesses with their people bled out very rapidly. In the meantime, nothing is paying for the upkeep of the buildings. I think it's overwhelmingly likely that the Plum Street buildings [[many of which would have been frame construction) would not have made it to any point anywhere near the present.

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Maybe, but for the vision thing. You must admit there's a lack of vision of what a functioning downtown should be. Lots of stuff plays into this. The political class only wants to deal with big players, and doesn't care much for small businesses or homeowners. The business class only cares about profits, or holding onto land until it can be sold for more money. Downtown properties descend to the lowest form of life: the parking lot. And everybody points somewhere else for why this is: The business climate, the exigencies of finance, the political facts of life. It galls me to see street grids erased for superblocks and campuses. It galls me to see opportunities to capitalize on the past sacrificed for quick fixes and PR stunts. And then, when these same players line up for thank-yous because they're putting in a "community garden" where no community is, that galls me too.

They had proposed the similar things in New Orleans back in the 1960s. They had wanted to demolish the French Quarter and put up a forest of skyscrapers in its place. What's wrong with that? More density! More money! Bigger buildings! More tax revenue! Thank goodness they didn't, but our Detroit city fathers would likely approve such a plan today, 50 years later.

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Originally Posted by Huggybear

And especially given the end result, a place that's built up with more density than it has ever had [[even excluding parking decks), why are you herniating about events that likely happened before you were born? It's not exactly like Edison built an adobe hut as a headquarters.

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Um ... it has more density? Where are the residents? :confused:

It's not a community garden. It's an educational/vegetable tranplant[[seedling) farm. Students will learn how to plant, maintain, and harvest while earning a few dollars. It will also help supply the Garden Resource Program with much needed vegetable transplants for Community, School and Family/ Market Gardens. The GRP has grown by 50% or more for the last three years.

Thanks for bringing this into focus Cub. I guess that this is a much better way for MGM to help Detroit that putting up monuments or planting a city flower garden.... but it does seem like an odd place to put such an enterprise.

Why all the complaining? I don't get it. What could be worse than a gravel lot? It's things like this that attract people to the area. If we keep doing what we've always done how can we expect anything to change?