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Any news about a possible new Red Wings arena? I posted once here before, but this is my final document about a new Red Wings Arena design. I realize it may be awhile before something gets moving due to the current economic situation. Again, not a professional work, but the people that have taken a look at it really seem to like it. I wanted to post a link here so some of you could see it. See what you think....it's at
www.newolympia.blogspot.com
Couldn't open the doc, schulzte.
There won't be in new arena until the wings start to suck, imo.
Sorry, I tried to link to a document but it didn't work. Try my website at www.newolympia.blogspot.com
interesting.
I thnk your blog proves a point and that is there is no room for rink where you have put it. Would they really tear down the kales building or the other apartent building right next door?
you should also consider the area across from motor city.
My 11 year old son just read this and seen your blog. He is mad that anyone would ever consider Red Wings hockey anywhere except at the Joe.
Anyway, interesting blog - not sure about the location though.
Does anyone know if the NHL would allow open air hockey, i.e. retractable roof?
They did in Chicago on New Year's Day!!!
Seriously, I doubt it. It would add a potentially controllable variable [[or advantage), and the ice would probably be a beatch to maintain
"My 11 year old son just read this and seen your blog. He is mad that anyone would ever consider Red Wings hockey anywhere except at the Joe."
Didja explain yet to the lad there was once a magical place called The Olympia? or Victoria Arena for you old school types...
Bravo, Flying J! The current building cannot hold a candle to the greatest arena ever built, that being at Grand River and McGraw.Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingJ
My guess is that it will be located on the large site that was recently cleared near the Motor City Casino. Lots of activity there in recnet months
Not enough thought put into that.... Actually, very interesting, thanks for putting your time into a solution. I bet with refining you could get rid of your restricted view seats. Have you ever forwarded these ideas to anyone important?
I also feel that even though we've all been led to believe that the arena will go in Foxtown, I think three other areas have a chance and are being mentioned not just for leverage, but because they are actually candidates to land the project.
First, I think the Motor City Casino area, which originally was slated for another high rise hotel, is the first choice. The NHL might not like being neighbors with a casino, but I don't like being neighbors with the guy who uses a chainsaw constantly after dark. The point is, I really have no say.
Second, I think the Northwest Corner of I-75 and Woodward is sitting perfect and ready for an Arena.
And last, I think that the Tiger Stadium sight could handle an arena while still using the remains of the old stadium.
I've also heard in a smoky dark room that the Masonic Temple property is also in play.
I can't wait until this current national recession and local depression is over.
Actually I did, with the help of schulzte's blog!Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingJ
According to his site plan, none of the buildings along Adams Street would be touched, including the Kales.Quote:
Originally Posted by croweblack
Wait, what? Is it time to start a Don't Knock Down The Masonic Temple For a Fucking Hockey Arena facebook group/online petition/can drive?Quote:
Originally Posted by ddf313
I hardly think that the Masonic Temple is in any danger.... if Ilitch was really interested in knocking it down for an arena, he wouldn't have paid the past due utility bills and taken over booking for the 2 theatres. He would have let it close [[once the electricity was shut off) and let it start to decline
He doesn't own it [[probably doesn't want to considering how high the property taxes would be), but benefits from it remaining open and being well maintained.
Pardon my ignorance, but what lame excuse has been devised for not playing in the Joe Louis arena any more? Are we reaching a point where life-spans of stadia are reduced to such a point that construction and destruction of them becomes the only revitalization this city receives?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit
Haven't you heard? A new hockey stadium will generate economic development, and thus will put money into the taxpayers' pockets.
Seriously, not one red public cent for a new arena. If Mike Ilitch wants a new place for his team to play, that's fine -- let him pay for it himself.
Any expenditure -- any money at all -- during these tough economic times would be absolutely unconscionable.
I think any new arena should be a new design specifically for the new site [[not a modified version of the old design).
And I think that Olympia is in the past, and Detroit should be looking towards its future. Reusing the old design just shows the world that we're too busy scrambling to return to the past to be able to be forward thinking.
I'd rather there be an architecture competition for the new design, and should be done in such a way to attract world-class submitions [[for a world-class hockey team). Then, an all around solid design should be selected, anticipating short term and long term needs. It would remind people that Detroit is capable of being progressive and high quality, and it wouldn't need to be rebuilt every few decades.
The Joe was built quick and dirty to keep the Wings from moving to the suburbs. This time it can be done the right way. But that would cost money, and I think the new one will also be built quick and dirty, but this time to simply maximize profits.
My design submission for a new stadium would be a stadium in the shape of a dollar sign. Call it Taxpayer Revival or Neo-Cynicism
For starters, no way is Kales going anywhere. It was just redeveloped, as was Cliff Bell's, Park Bar, etc. I think the spot on MLK by Ilitch's casino is a possibility, as is the wide open space on the north side of 75 since Ilitch just bought the Eddystone and Park Ave. hotels. Not sure if he'd have to close roads to do that, though.
I like the idea of an arena going north of 75 and west of Woodward. We are just a few really long blocks away from making downtown meet up with Wayne State/ New Center.
Wait, I just said "we" but I don't live in Detroit....
Spend a ton of cash there though.
No way is a new hockey arena going into the middle of Park Avenue at Grand Circus Park. Get rid of the Kales and Cliff Bell's? Extinguish a growing nightclub and entertainment district along Park? Crazy!
A site near Motor City casino does seem the most viable
Olympia is just nostalgia; a new arena should be modern and look toward the future.
Really? Then explain the success of the retro ballparks that have popped up beginning with Camden Yards in Baltimore.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fury13
I see no reason hockey can't do that too--blend the good of the past with the good of the current and future.
Agree 100%. We live in the past too much around here. I sometimes think if Detroit could permanently live if the 1950's, you folks would be in eternal bliss. I would love to see a nice modern, unique hockey arena. They did it with Ford Field, why can't they do it with the new hockey rink?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason
There have been like 100 threads on a supposed new arena for the Wings, and I have no idea why.
Illitch cannot afford to build a new arena right now, and there's no way Detroit or Michigan are going to pay for an arena right now.
Maybe in 10 years.
A new arena is absurd. I don't know how or why ideas like this suddenly become urgent. The Joe Louis Arena is FINE as it is. If it so happens that the Joe can no longer function, than why not renovate it to make it function. If that doesn't work, why not tear down the Joe and build a new one in the same location. There is no reason to build a new stadium at a new location. Absolutely none.
What are the costs of building a new stadium at a new location, I'll review just a few:
- further compromising the urban street grid, creating yet another superblock near Downtown, futher "fortressizing" the urban landscape and therefore making it less friendly to pedestrians
- further destroying the historic fabric of the city by demolishing historic buildings, completely removing entire streets from existance
- leaving behind yet another abandoned empty structure or leaving behind yet another empty lot
- loosing the people-mover connection to the stadium, hurting Greektown and other areas frequented by Wings fans
- expansion of demolition for surface parking lot "development" to serve the stadium
- huge $$ costs, having to aquire lots of land and buildings
- limited benifit to surrounding neighborhoods... are those costs worth the benifits, which would expect to be: increased traffic around the new location [[most likely west of Woodward north of I-75) during games and filling in the empty void on Woodward from I-75 to Temple St.
If a new stadium at a new location is indeed built, I think some of these costs can be mitigated by a) ensuring the new construction is well integrated into the urban fabric, where the street wall is restored with retail along the street. b) ensuring that there is limited demolition of historic buildings, especially for parking lot development c) ensuring that the surrounding neighborhood is compensated and that tax money flows directly into community investment
The Joe was 'built quick and dirty' to to snag the Republican convention and the Wings move in worked. I personally think the building sucks but the space was there and it was, all things considered, a cheap fix for the time.
I'll skip your snobby comment about the 1950s and get right into it.Quote:
Originally Posted by raptor56
Why can't you have a modern arena that captures interesting aspects of arenas past? These factors are not mutually exclusive. And an arena that does this would certainly be unique. As it stands it seems most current NHL arenas [[meaning the newer ones) have so much sameness.
He was going to build it, about 4 years ago the project absolutely was on. The downturn in the economy killed it.Quote:
Originally Posted by crawford
Um.... Revolutionary... when was the last time you've been in west Foxtown? Or lower Midtown? There's hardly anything left to level if a new arena was going to be built.Quote:
Originally Posted by revolutionary
As far as land aquisition goes, that is up to Ilitch. He's pretty much bought up 95% of west Foxtown, and much of lower Midtown.
I can understand the superblock concern... but when you take an area that is already devoid of ALL buildings, it makes that argument less important. For me the bigger concern is that none of the Woodward Plan street layout is altered [[dating back to 1806-07), and since the arena won't be south of Adams Ave., that should not be an issue.
I think that if an arena is built in west Foxtown... the neighboring business along nearby Park Ave. will be more than compensated by the additional customers.
As for the People Mover issue... if the arena is built in west Foxtown, it will be no farther away from a people mover station [[about 2 blocks) than Comerica Park and Ford Field are. If the arena is built in Midtown, then this is a valid concern for businesses along the People Mover route that depend on game nights... although many restaurants have shuttle service.
All other issues aside, I think there can be better aesthetic and revenue-generating uses for riverfront land that a windowless concrete box, i.e. Joe Louis. Just my humble opinion.
In Port Huron, they needlessly built the waste-water treatment plant downtown along the gorgeous St. Clair River/Black River mouth -- next to the yacht club, so Detroit isn't alone in silly waterfront land moves in the past.
then what about the lease expiration this june?Quote:
Originally Posted by crawford
can you imagine monica conyers bitching at reps of the illitches about the sweet deal they have?
can't remember if it was city option or illitch option